Post-Game Talk: PS #4 - 09/24/18 | devils @ RANGERS | 7:00 - MSG

[silverfish]

Nico Hischier finished 14th in the league in primary points per 60 last year during 5v5 play. This is very likely a kid who will be an elite player. You can look at his box stats and not be impressed by "only" 52 points, but you need to keep in mind he averaged 16:19 a game. Only 7 players in the league who recorded more points than Nico last year skated less average time per game.

These are important inputs you might be overlooking by only looking at point total.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

I don't think he's going to be an elite player but Hischier is going to be very very good. Anyone who can score 50 points in the NHL as an 18 year old is pretty damn serious.

The Devils aren't a bad team--I don't know if they're a lock to be a playoff team again though. I like the look of Ty Smith and Butcher is another young offensive D. As a team they don't seem that deep--maybe or maybe not good enough to make the playoffs but if they do not deep enough to go anywhere.

For a 1st overall I don't think he is that impressive.

I like ADA and have been generally pleased with his game, but I did find it interesting that everyone was creaming themselves over a play at the blue line and then that shake-and-bake thing that ended with a frisbee into Lack's belly. Meanwhile Pionk steps up at the blue line to break up a rush by knocking the puck out of mid-air with his stick, settles it, controls, makes sure the play is onside then send a perfect pass to Gettinger resulting in a goal and from what I recall there was no creaming.

Seems like there are more people pulling for ADA to succeed than Pionk. Is it because of their respective pedigrees and a perception that ADA has a substantially higher upside? I also chuckled about ADA getting a "well-deserved" point when I heard from a lot of people that all those secondary assists Pionk racked up last year were more due to luck and wouldn't be repeatable. Not disputing that, it's just, again, feels like there's a bit different set of rules for evaluation with ADA.

I hope they both do great and that they're our 2 and 3 RD for the next few years.

I assume many fans did not take Pionk seriously as an amazing player that he is and are not focusing on his play, and are paying close attention to their "pedigree" offensive Dman prospect ADA.

 

[offdacrossbar]

It's unfortunate, because, at least to me, ADA is so polarizing on this forum that it feels like you either get hot or cold with him so people go to extremes to try and cancel out others. While Pionk, it seems like people are more moderate with their opinions.

pionk is such a weird name i think thats the deciding factor.

talent and skills and stuff yeah... thats kinda important but the name is what really matters here

pionk just rubs me the wrong way

 

[darko]

pionk is such a weird name i think thats the deciding factor.

talent and skills and stuff yeah... thats kinda important but the name is what really matters here

pionk just rubs me the wrong way

Better check yourself before you pionk yourself fool.

 

[Inferno]

Nico Hischier finished 14th in the league in primary points per 60 last year during 5v5 play. This is very likely a kid who will be an elite player. You can look at his box stats and not be impressed by "only" 52 points, but you need to keep in mind he averaged 16:19 a game. Only 7 players in the league who recorded more points than Nico last year skated less average time per game.

These are important inputs you might be overlooking by only looking at point total.

....yyyeaaahhh butttt to be fair a lot of his points were...give the puck to hall...hall does some insane voodoo magic and scores a goal .Nico gets an assist.

 

[East Coast Bias]

For a 1st overall I don't think he is that impressive.




I assume many fans did not take Pionk seriously as an amazing player that he is and are not focusing on his play, and are paying close attention to their "pedigree" offensive Dman prospect ADA.

I mean that's literally the opposite of what has gone on here. Discussions about his advanced stats, his game, whether his play last season was sustainable, his eligibility to go to the AHL without waivers vs ADA who can't, etc.

 

[darko]

Nico Hischier finished 14th in the league in primary points per 60 last year during 5v5 play. This is very likely a kid who will be an elite player. You can look at his box stats and not be impressed by "only" 52 points, but you need to keep in mind he averaged 16:19 a game. Only 7 players in the league who recorded more points than Nico last year skated less average time per game.

These are important inputs you might be overlooking by only looking at point total.

Yeah I don't get Nico hate. Sure he's no Crosby or McDavid but he'll be a PPG players for years to come.

 

[BearishRiggs]

Yeah I don't get Nico hate. Sure he's no Crosby or McDavid but he'll be a PPG players for years to come.

He’s a Devil.

 

[will1066]

He’s a Devil.

So much truth here. If he were a Ranger, someone would need to regularly mop the floor in here because of the saliva.

 

[silverfish]

....yyyeaaahhh butttt to be fair a lot of his points were...give the puck to hall...hall does some insane voodoo magic and scores a goal .Nico gets an assist.

Do you know how many points Hischier had that Hall also had a piece of? Either assists to Hall or assists from Hall? Not asking to be a dick, generally curious. I can run this later if someone reminds me. Don't have the code at work.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

He’s a Devil.

Yeah, I don't get what there's not to get.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Do you know how many points Hischier had that Hall also had a piece of? Either assists to Hall or assists from Hall? Not asking to be a dick, generally curious. I can run this later if someone reminds me. Don't have the code at work.

Hall contributed on 22 of Nico's 52 points.

 

[darko]

He’s a Devil.

Yeah but surely we can evaluate a player fairly regardless who he plays for.

 

[darko]

Hall contributed on 22 of Nico's 52 points.

There it is.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

I mean that's literally the opposite of what has gone on here. Discussions about his advanced stats, his game, whether his play last season was sustainable, his eligibility to go to the AHL without waivers vs ADA who can't, etc.

advanced stats is usually for people who did not watch or are trying to prove some points. Most of them are stupid and out of context.

 

[FIRE DRURY]

I like ADA and have been generally pleased with his game, but I did find it interesting that everyone was creaming themselves over a play at the blue line and then that shake-and-bake thing that ended with a frisbee into Lack's belly. Meanwhile Pionk steps up at the blue line to break up a rush by knocking the puck out of mid-air with his stick, settles it, controls, makes sure the play is onside then send a perfect pass to Gettinger resulting in a goal and from what I recall there was no creaming.

Seems like there are more people pulling for ADA to succeed than Pionk. Is it because of their respective pedigrees and a perception that ADA has a substantially higher upside? I also chuckled about ADA getting a "well-deserved" point when I heard from a lot of people that all those secondary assists Pionk racked up last year were more due to luck and wouldn't be repeatable. Not disputing that, it's just, again, feels like there's a bit different set of rules for evaluation with ADA.

I hope they both do great and that they're our 2 and 3 RD for the next few years.

Silent creaming, I must say. Pionk's play there was exactly what our dmen need to do.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Hischier is better than a "solid number one center". Based on what I read on this site, people consider guys like Stepan/ROR/Turris/ as solid number one centers. Hischier is easily better than that, both offensively and defensively.

He'll be closer to someone like Toews in his prime.

 

[silverfish]

Hall contributed on 22 of Nico's 52 points.

Thanks. Doesn't seem unreasonable at all for a linemate, and not something I'd hold against Nico. Should be commended for being able to play, and not hurt Hall, as an 18 year-old. Here's Kredier last season, which I have available, 18 of his 37 to or from Zibanejad. Not something I'd hold against CK20 or say that Zibanejad was carrying him...

 

[darko]

If Nico was a Ranger we'd be drooling over him.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Thanks. Doesn't seem unreasonable at all for a linemate, and not something I'd hold against Nico. Should be commended for being able to play, and not hurt Hall, as an 18 year-old. Here's Kredier last season, which I have available, 18 of his 37 to or from Zibanejad. Not something I'd hold against CK20 or say that Zibanejad was carrying him...

Nice. Nico clearly was not a product of Hall both based on the stats and eye test.

Hockey-Reference's scoring logs makes it real easy to see how many points a player contributed to another's quick and easy. You just go to that player's page, i.e Nico's and do CTRL+F for 'Hall' and your browser will do the work for you and count the results. Although the last search result on that page was just another link containing Hall's name so you subtract 1 off the 23 to get 22.

Nico Hischier 2017-18 Scoring Log | Hockey-Reference.com

Only 6 PPP as well. So when he figures out his role and strength on the PP he's gonna put up big offensive numbers.

 

[silverfish]

Nice. Nico clearly was not a product of Hall both based on the stats and eye test.

Hockey-Reference's scoring logs makes it real easy to see how many points a player contributed to another's quick and easy. You just go to that player's page, i.e Nico's and do CTRL+F for 'Hall' and your browser will do the work for you and count the results. Although the last search result on that page was just another link containing Hall's name so you subtract 1 off the 23 to get 22.

Nico Hischier 2017-18 Scoring Log | Hockey-Reference.com

Very cool tip. Thanks!

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I like ADA and have been generally pleased with his game, but I did find it interesting that everyone was creaming themselves over a play at the blue line and then that shake-and-bake thing that ended with a frisbee into Lack's belly. Meanwhile Pionk steps up at the blue line to break up a rush by knocking the puck out of mid-air with his stick, settles it, controls, makes sure the play is onside then send a perfect pass to Gettinger resulting in a goal and from what I recall there was no creaming.

Seems like there are more people pulling for ADA to succeed than Pionk. Is it because of their respective pedigrees and a perception that ADA has a substantially higher upside? I also chuckled about ADA getting a "well-deserved" point when I heard from a lot of people that all those secondary assists Pionk racked up last year were more due to luck and wouldn't be repeatable. Not disputing that, it's just, again, feels like there's a bit different set of rules for evaluation with ADA.

I hope they both do great and that they're our 2 and 3 RD for the next few years.

There was plenty of love for Pionk's play that led to the 2nd goal. He was great yesterday as long as we ignore OT (where he is usually amazing), I don't think anyone has said otherwise.

Also lets not act like all 2nd assists are created equal. strong break out passes that lead to a high scoring chance are a repeatable skill.


But yeah, Lets hope that they both make it and play a bunch and Staal doesn't play much at all.

 

[FIRE DRURY]

If Nico was a Ranger we'd be drooling over him.

So true..

But since he's now a Devil, instead of drooling over him we can spit on him instead

 

[Drew4u]

If Nico was a Ranger we'd be drooling over him.

He would instantly become our most valuable player and probably best player in a year.

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

advanced stats is usually for people who did not watch or are trying to prove some points. Most of them are stupid and out of context.