I used to think the most frustrating part of this was the long wait. It's actually that we've got some impatient and unreasonable fans that don't deserve to be around for the good times that are soon coming.
Progression of the rebuild
- Thread starter Jester9881
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bluechipbonzo
Registered User
Bailey was rushed.
Snow isn't a good GM.
Streit is finished.
We always rush our prospects.
This team will be a lottery team this year.
I don't know how to skate.
I love NASCAR.
The Islanders are winning.
All is forgiven.
Snow isn't a good GM.
Streit is finished.
We always rush our prospects.
This team will be a lottery team this year.
I don't know how to skate.
I love NASCAR.
The Islanders are winning.
All is forgiven.
Doshell Propivo
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- Dec 5, 2005
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4 weeks of good hockey apparently erases years (or is it decades?) of complete failure. The myopic among us rear their ugly head again.
Enjoy the games instead of worrying about the "told you sos."
Barely squeaking into the playoffs after almost a decade of lottery picks isn't exactly a "successful" rebuild in my eyes.
The team hasn't even made it in yet, let alone accomplished anything in the playoffs. Let's keep things in perspective.
PS - the same people that preach "patience" around here want to change the coach every Tuesday, and overhaul the roster after every losing streak!
Quicklime
Registered User
4 weeks of good hockey apparently erases years (or is it decades?) of complete failure. The myopic among us rear their ugly head again.
Enjoy the games instead of worrying about the "told you sos."
Barely squeaking into the playoffs after almost a decade of lottery picks isn't exactly a "successful" rebuild in my eyes.
The team hasn't even made it in yet, let alone accomplished anything in the playoffs. Let's keep things in perspective.
PS - the same people that preach "patience" around here want to change the coach every Tuesday, and overhaul the roster after every losing streak!
Understand your point, but come on - you can reserve judgment and still allow for a little optimism that things are starting to trend upwards rather than rain disdain on those that do.
Guess what? The Isles are 7-1-2 during a rough stretch in which playoff implications rise to a crescendo, stronger teams survive and weaker teams get destroyed. The only team that has beaten the Isles in regulation in that stretch is likely to compete for the cup, whether they manage to get healthy or not. These are things that give fans hope that the upward trend isn't a fluke. There's evidence for optimism here - it isn't that many of us don't care to see the bar raised, but it takes time to work the the sort of atrophy that sets in after a stagnant phase like this franchise has experienced.
Hell, dude - enjoy a drink or something!
- they really may not be as good as you may feel some say they are, but you have to start somewhere. If they derp their way out of the starting gate next year, feel free to quote this post and razz on me for it, but at the moment there's justification for some shred of optimism. They're not going to just win 60 games immediately after a scorched-earth rebuild.
Doshell Propivo
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- Dec 5, 2005
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Understand your point, but come on - you can reserve judgment and still allow for a little optimism that things are starting to trend upwards rather than rain disdain on those that do.
Guess what? The Isles are 7-1-2 during a rough stretch in which playoff implications rise to a crescendo, stronger teams survive and weaker teams get destroyed. The only team that has beaten the Isles in regulation in that stretch is likely to compete for the cup, whether they manage to get healthy or not. These are things that give fans hope that the upward trend isn't a fluke. There's evidence for optimism here - it isn't that many of us don't care to see the bar raised, but it takes time to work the the sort of atrophy that sets in after a stagnant phase like this franchise has experienced.
Hell, dude - enjoy a drink or something!
Oh believe me I am enjoying the heck out of this run!
I just have issues with pointing to this relatively modest success and claiming it somehow legitimizes the supposed "rebuild." You're right though, now is indeed a time for optimism. Exciting Islander hockey in April (and hopefully May)!
Quicklime
Registered User
Oh believe me I am enjoying the heck out of this run!
You're right though, now is indeed a time for optimism. Exciting Islander hockey in April (and hopefully May)!
Absolutely! Here's hoping it lasts longer than May even - stranger things have happened! Still, we're in some agreement - the LAST thing I want to see is this team come slumping onto the ice next year, and THAT is as as much of a gauge as the current 9-1-2 streak.
They need a goalie to take over for Nabokov, they still need a little more leadership both up front and on the blue line in advance of the forthcoing decline of Visnovsky & Streit and they need to get Boyes off the 1st line, regardless of how well he seems to have showed up on the scoreboard tonight. If they can do two of those three things this summer they'll be well positioned, and a playoff appearance can help legitimize them to players who would otherwise ignore a contract offer.
I don't deny they have a ways to go, but I'm happy we can all see them at least start closing the gap at a time when the experience they'll get will be for the best.
No one expected this run. The ones who claim they did completely disappeared during the rough stretches this season, and most here said the team is making a march upwards, but on a slow scale. It could be expedited with two acquisitions (or free agents if we could somehow lure the good ones) to fill in some gaping holes.Understand your point, but come on - you can reserve judgment and still allow for a little optimism that things are starting to trend upwards rather than rain disdain on those that do.
Guess what? The Isles are 7-1-2 during a rough stretch in which playoff implications rise to a crescendo, stronger teams survive and weaker teams get destroyed. The only team that has beaten the Isles in regulation in that stretch is likely to compete for the cup, whether they manage to get healthy or not. These are things that give fans hope that the upward trend isn't a fluke. There's evidence for optimism here - it isn't that many of us don't care to see the bar raised, but it takes time to work the the sort of atrophy that sets in after a stagnant phase like this franchise has experienced.
Hell, dude - enjoy a drink or something!
Most here also thought the 8th spot was potentially in reach, though more likely not, and wouldn't have been if not for the lucky fortune of grabbing a couple of waiver pickups who were top end waiver pickups. Hickey is proving to be huge, and Strait was probably responsible for no less than 6 points in the beginning. Who knows how many Hickey helped ensure. Take those away and were is the club?
And where would the club be if they did in fact spend more and get even that wing Tavares so obviously would benefit from?
But hey, the kids can wear those crowns from Burger King and pretend to be Miss America for a day. Whatever turns them on.
Quicklime
Registered User
I'm only alluding to the fact that regardless of predictions and suppositions, it actually came together at the least likely, best possible time - if (that thousand letter word).....IF....they can ride this wave into next season, IF the team can show Wang how playoff revenue only gets bigger when you build a better product, this could be the corner they've been waiting to turn.
I for one thought they had a chance at the 8th seed early on until they stumbled, and I figured "screw it - Jones would look good in an Isles jersey" until they started winning, at which point I liked seeing them win. This was immediately before they started playing consistent hockey. I was happy when they hit 500 hockey; now they haven't really seemed to do much looking back. I don't think they've "arrived" just yet, but it's streaks like this, uniting experiences like this that become ammunition for them to keep building momentum, and if they keep pressing and get into the postseason, they can take that momentum right into next year.
Maybe they can prove a benefit from all the waiver wire pickups - it becomes additional depth. Now that they seem to be firing on a few more cylinders and depth declares itself useful, it'll be harder to be a passenger on this roster, because there are more players than than there is space as soon as next preseason, if any 3 of Strome, Nino, Nelson, Lee and Ullstrom all show enough promise to make the leap.
The true arrival is harvest; now they're simply starting to prove they're not trying to grow an orchard on a clay patch. This was always up to them, and I can't scorch them for finally gelling, waking up and playing like they finally believe in themselves. Predictions aside, it isn't like I would have absconded to another fanbase had they failed - I'm just happy that the Islanders are starting to EARN a little respect and play like they're hungry for more.
Quick edit/addition - I'd call this slightly closer to martial arts where belt tests start involving less emphasis on forms and breaking boards in favor of higher contact competition, putting the training into practice, or young Spartan children starting to suss out the Agoge and learning how to take down an opponent. They seem to have learned that the trick to throwing a punch properly isn't putting your fist on something as much as through something.
Titus Flavius Josephus once said that "drills are bloodless battles and battles are bloodless drills" when describing the intensity in Roman training methods. In comparison, it's a little like the difference between someone going for a nice run and someone running through the streets of Pamplona with a few dozen bulls behind them trying to wear the runners' intestines as adornments for their horns - there's no 'going through the motions until it's over' when one does that. The Islanders may be getting the hang of that concept of intensity; I already feel that Tavares and Martin do. Once the trickle-down effect galvanizes that philosophy team-wide and they learn that there's no switch for turning that intensity on and off, and that to be successful one must remove the switch and keep the intensity flowing for sixty minutes of ice time at the bare minimum, they'll have arrived, having learned how to access such a professional compete level without opposing players or thoughts get in the way of it.
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TROLLCHUK
Registered User
- Jul 1, 2006
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bluechipbonzo
Registered User
rikker
Registered User
some of you guys are pitiful. you just can't seem to enjoy the good times.
"yeah, but remember when there was no Islander team, like in the 60's. yeah, that sucked!! stupid Wang for not bringing a team in here. and Snow! damn, he was just thinking about being a goalie! loser!!"
i will gladly wear my Burger King Crown, over your Mr. Magoo mask... or how about Eyore. "it's sunny today, but it will probably rain later..."
revel in your black clouds boys. it really is sad...
"yeah, but remember when there was no Islander team, like in the 60's. yeah, that sucked!! stupid Wang for not bringing a team in here. and Snow! damn, he was just thinking about being a goalie! loser!!"
i will gladly wear my Burger King Crown, over your Mr. Magoo mask... or how about Eyore. "it's sunny today, but it will probably rain later..."
revel in your black clouds boys. it really is sad...
Quicklime
Registered User
Gratitude, for the information.
LOL - anytime.
The things I type when drinking, I guess.
....glad I didn't whip out the Sun Tzu though; I don't think it applies as well for hockey. 
Doshell Propivo
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- Dec 5, 2005
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Yeah but remember back in the 80's when we had a WINNER? Some of us have high standards, some of us don't. So it goes.
I doubt anyone is enjoying these good times more than me. But that is not what is being discussed here.
Don't be blinded by one playoff appearance as somehow vindicating years and years of being cellar dwellers, cap floor circumvention and a circus like atmosphere.
Isles fans truly do suffer from battered wife syndrome. After almost a decade of broken noses and black eyes, the husband let’s wifey go out with her girlfriends to a party one night and all is forgotten.
Impatience and being unreasonable are just parts of being a fan and stem from wanting to see your team succeed. Sports fans in general are just fickle. However, if fans have stuck through all the garbage this franchise has put us through over the last two decades they sure as heck deserve to be around for the good times, even if they b*tched and moaned all the way through the rebuild. If you stuck it out, whether you're positive or negative, you deserve to be around for the good times that hopefully apear to be coming soon.
LongIslandCircus
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- Apr 11, 2012
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I'll be the first to admit I have NOT been a big Snow supporter....and to be honest still am not handing out a passing grade. This roster was not structured with the goal of being competitive this year. Support was needed for these players a long time ago and it was never given. I will credit Snow for being patient, but a strong stretch in a shortened season isn't going to make me forget the continuous neglect of the major needs of this team. Truly ask yourself if this progress could have been acheived in a much more efficient manner. I believe it could have.
That said, I am absolutely LOVING this pleasant surprise, but this turnaround is directly attributed to the coaching staff and players. Watching the Toronto game really showed me how mature these youngsters are becoming. Once the lead was attained, shifts were short and no high-risk plays were made. For once a culture that is focused on winning is begining to surface and I (never thought I'd say this) credit Capuano and his staff for that.
Regardless whether we agree or not, every single one of us deserve to see this team make the playoffs. We've endured more than our fair share in the last 2 decades and I really couldn't be more proud of this group.
That said, I am absolutely LOVING this pleasant surprise, but this turnaround is directly attributed to the coaching staff and players. Watching the Toronto game really showed me how mature these youngsters are becoming. Once the lead was attained, shifts were short and no high-risk plays were made. For once a culture that is focused on winning is begining to surface and I (never thought I'd say this) credit Capuano and his staff for that.
Regardless whether we agree or not, every single one of us deserve to see this team make the playoffs. We've endured more than our fair share in the last 2 decades and I really couldn't be more proud of this group.
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The actual players are over delivering despite the lack of support. That is something to celebrate. Giving their deserved props to an owner who has neglected them? I can't and won't do that. But if he delivers on his end of the deal this summer, I'll change my mind. Dumping on fans who are intelligent enough to see the difference and expect more... pretty low.
Quicklime
Registered User
I'm not giving props to Wang - I view him as the problem quite likely as much as you do. Nor am I dumping on fans who see the difference and expect more, as I am one of those fans as well. I'm just saying, if you isolate the body of work that the team itself, we're in agreement about that being something to celebrate - it sees they may have just figured something out.
I think our opinions are a tiny bit closer to the same tack than currently perceived. I support the team at the same time I frustrated at how ownership has handcuffed the progression. The team seems to be taking a turn for the better, and there's still tons of work to be done.
Long and short, I'm only saying we can be pleased with the production on the ice and still be ticked off at ownership (which I still am) and/or management (who I give a bit of a pass to for what he inherited.)
If something I said seems to have been interpreted as "dumping on fans who expect more," I'd be dumping on myself to an extent as well - I think that assumption's in error. Everything above was directed at the team on ice, not patting the back of ownership. I have and will continue to believe that Snow has more to overcome than other GM's (see Chicago before their change of regime) and hold loads of contempt for Wang. I'm just happy to see the Islanders play well. Who am I dumping on?
(Addendum: You could draw a straight line through pretty much any post I've made from 2007 up until today and you'll not once see deviate from believing Wang is a problem.)
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4 weeks of good hockey apparently erases years (or is it decades?) of complete failure. The myopic among us rear their ugly head again.
Enjoy the games instead of worrying about the "told you sos."
Barely squeaking into the playoffs after almost a decade of lottery picks isn't exactly a "successful" rebuild in my eyes.
The team hasn't even made it in yet, let alone accomplished anything in the playoffs. Let's keep things in perspective.
PS - the same people that preach "patience" around here want to change the coach every Tuesday, and overhaul the roster after every losing streak!
Barely squeaking in? This team is 2 points behind #5. Besides, gotta walk before you run.
After a long and cold winter, the sun is coming out and it's starting to warm up. Enjoy the breath of fresh air. It may get a little cold again, but make no mistake, summer will be here very soon.
And even after the bump, some fans still don't get it.
The guy you wanted to fire for a better coach, will likely get consideration for the Jack Adams award.
The GM you despised built this team from basically nothing
The guy you loathed being on the top line just two years go (PaP), you're now wishing was still here
The guy you wanted instead of the Bailey pick + trade down is basically a flop.
The top tier UFA's you've been crying about the last few years? Were never going to come here anyway
The top tier players you wanted in trade? Would have cost us much of what got us here in the first place (look at what Jeff Carter netted, and imagine what it would have cost us)
This isn't an "I told you so"..... it's meant as a "lighten up, or go root for another team.... you won't be missed". The tactics you've wished to employ over the past few years would have netted us a Milbury team of "sorta good" veterans. Here for a paycheck in their last years.... lucky to get an 8 and out in a good year.
This team is playing better right now than they have since the mid 80's other than the stretch to start 2001 when other teams were taking them for granted.
This wasn't going to be a two year Philly "rebuild" because the entire system was BARREN of talent. Even the current Flames have more to work with than the Islanders did, and their rebuild is going to take more than 3 years.
The guy you wanted to fire for a better coach, will likely get consideration for the Jack Adams award.
The GM you despised built this team from basically nothing
The guy you loathed being on the top line just two years go (PaP), you're now wishing was still here
The guy you wanted instead of the Bailey pick + trade down is basically a flop.
The top tier UFA's you've been crying about the last few years? Were never going to come here anyway
The top tier players you wanted in trade? Would have cost us much of what got us here in the first place (look at what Jeff Carter netted, and imagine what it would have cost us)
This isn't an "I told you so"..... it's meant as a "lighten up, or go root for another team.... you won't be missed". The tactics you've wished to employ over the past few years would have netted us a Milbury team of "sorta good" veterans. Here for a paycheck in their last years.... lucky to get an 8 and out in a good year.
This team is playing better right now than they have since the mid 80's other than the stretch to start 2001 when other teams were taking them for granted.
This wasn't going to be a two year Philly "rebuild" because the entire system was BARREN of talent. Even the current Flames have more to work with than the Islanders did, and their rebuild is going to take more than 3 years.
doublechili
For all intensive purposes, your nuts
- Apr 11, 2006
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I don't even quite understand this recent discussion here. Rebuilds take time. A lot of posters here have been saying that for awhile. Heck, Snow has been saying they're taking the long route and committing to youth. The roster was basically AHL quality after Smyth/Poti/Yashin, etc. left, with not a lot of prospects in the pipeline. They basically started from scratch. So yeah, that takes a bit of time, in this case it's been about 5 years.
But then at some point you have enough guys turning 22-23-24 and something clicks. A long time ago the Isles went from being one of the worst teams in the league in '73-74 to almost winning the Cup the next year, and they never looked back for the next 10 years. So the switch being flipped pretty suddenly is not unprecedented even for this franchise. Maybe that's what we're seeing now. Did the ones not calling for Snow's head know that the switch was perhaps going to be flipped now? No. But they also weren't saying the team was doomed under Snow. Let's be real.
But then at some point you have enough guys turning 22-23-24 and something clicks. A long time ago the Isles went from being one of the worst teams in the league in '73-74 to almost winning the Cup the next year, and they never looked back for the next 10 years. So the switch being flipped pretty suddenly is not unprecedented even for this franchise. Maybe that's what we're seeing now. Did the ones not calling for Snow's head know that the switch was perhaps going to be flipped now? No. But they also weren't saying the team was doomed under Snow. Let's be real.
Doshell Propivo
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- Dec 5, 2005
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And 3 points behind 9th.
I agree, it is progress and that is terrific.
By the way, what sun are you talking about? I moved to Minnesota in November and we've had snow cover for almost 5 months! Just got another 7 inches last night!!
Doshell Propivo
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Not sure who wanted to employ those tactics but what I and others with high standards have been advocate for is a youth movement along with strategic and timely veteran acquisitions. THAT is a true rebuild. Nobody was expecting a contender in 2 years, but I think a competitive team that would flirt with a playoff spot shouldn't be considered a monumental accomplishment that takes almost an entire decade.
Do you honestly believe that a below-cap floor budget (not to mention all the other nonsense) for 1/2 dozen years was/is the right approach?
Look, this has nothing to do with poo-pooing this year's accomplishments, but it certainly doesn't validate the way this team has been (mis)managed for many years.
PS, the 1993 team says hi.
Doshell Propivo
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- Dec 5, 2005
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And that is pecisely what I'm talking about. Look at the strategic acquisitions Torrey and Arbour made while still being committed to the rebuild. Totally different than what has happened now. Different eras I know, but the point remains.
This has nothing to do with patience.
It wasn't an assessment of you 88, but a critique of the mindset some are riding like a high horse.
Just look above. You have an individual with some sort of control freak issue trying to tell hardcore fans to go away. Seriously, they need to get over themselves because they are nobody. Lol.
