Post-Game Talk: Preseason GM05| Vancouver Canucks lose to Edmonton Oilers in Shootout | 2-3 (Bains & Smith)

[Vector]

I thought Sherwood was the best Canucks forward through the first 2 periods. Mueller was generating a lot of chances, disrupted plays, and push everything in the right direction in the first period but wasn't as strong as the game went on.

 

[StrictlyCommercial]

I watched the 2nd and 3rd. Sherwood should get looks in the Top 6. Desharnais should play with Soucy on the 2nd pair.

Raty is ready for a depth role, but I'm not sure if that is the best thing for his development. Maybe stays up until Blueger is healthy.

Lots of guys that can fill depth roles in a pinch. Provides us options to avoid overspending on depth, which will be key once Boeser and Hughes get extensions.

 

[MS]

I thought Sherwood was the best Canucks forward through the first 2 periods. Mueller was generating a lot of chances, disrupted plays, and push everything in the right direction in the first period but wasn't as strong as the game went on.

I forgot to mention Mueller. He faded in the 3rd but this was the 2nd straight game where he was around the puck a lot and seemed to be in the right places at the right times. Also his skating style looks identical to Peter Schaefer. Another example of why prospect camps don't give great information - he was invisible in those games against crappy teenagers but has looked quite promising in two full NHL preseason games against mostly full-strength Edmonton and Calgary rosters.

Also forgot to mention that I was watching Sprong really closely off the puck today and didn't find much to find fault with. He's obviously never going to be Patrice Bergeron but he was skating hard and generally competing and in responsible positions and looked totally fine.

 

[Bankerguy]

Bains will never make it. its done. he wont be an nhl regular. Aman is a n.13 forward.
Wolainen is a no. 8 or 9 guy on ur depth chart. any higher and ur in trouble.

OT was a joke. so many garbage players. couldnt make an 8 foot pass. turnovers and no puck support. send them all away. trim roster now please.
Sherwood, Hoggy, Rats, Sprong looked okay.

Sprong looks like (his body shape, the way he skates, his speed) if u played EA Sports NHL and created a non-unique superstar stat player, thats what spronger looks like - stats check off all the boxes but hes this soulless make believe thing and doenst really move the needle

 

[biturbo19]

So like...it's obviously never gonna happen, but Wolanin is a lot better at hockey than Forbort, right?

 

[biturbo19]

Sprong looks like (his body shape, the way he skates, his speed) if u played EA Sports NHL and created a non-unique superstar stat player, thats what spronger looks like - stats check off all the boxes but hes this soulless make believe thing and doenst really move the needle

I think describing Sprong as an EA Sports "be a player" is probably a terrifically apt detail. He's like...when you create the player and you don't have enough points...so you put them all in the puck skills and skating and everything else is just like...left to fend for itself

 

[MS]

So like...it's obviously never gonna happen, but Wolanin is a lot better at hockey than Forbort, right?

Yes.

Or at least on at ES. Forbort does seem to have PK utility.

 

[BluesyShoes]

So like...it's obviously never gonna happen, but Wolanin is a lot better at hockey than Forbort, right?

If god forbid Hughes or Hronek get injured, I think we may see Wolanin come in. Otherwise, the minutes Forbort will be filling, Wolanin would likely struggle anyways. I think Tocchet/Foote have every intention of never seeing Forbort cross the red line lol.

It's easy to forget how much even Hughes and Hronek were an adventure in their own zone once they were hemmed in during the post-season. That's hopefully where we see Forbort at his most comfortable, playing below his own end-line and at the net front. I think that's the rationale anyways.

 

[Peen]

Bains will never make it. its done. he wont be an nhl regular. Aman is a n.13 forward.
Wolainen is a no. 8 or 9 guy on ur depth chart. any higher and ur in trouble.

OT was a joke. so many garbage players. couldnt make an 8 foot pass. turnovers and no puck support. send them all away. trim roster now please.
Sherwood, Hoggy, Rats, Sprong looked okay.

Sprong looks like (his body shape, the way he skates, his speed) if u played EA Sports NHL and created a non-unique superstar stat player, thats what spronger looks like - stats check off all the boxes but hes this soulless make believe thing and doenst really move the needle

A guy like Gadjovich, who looked far worse & slower than Bains has this preseason when he left us, has gone on to play 40 games three years in a row. And most recently on a cup winning team.

Last season was the first year Zac Dalpe didn’t play a game in the NHL.

Karlsson is another internal example of a player better than those two.

Sometimes it’s just opportunity, luck, timing is my point.

But, I do agree neither of them are there yet. And once they’re down, that’s probably it for Karlsson and he’ll head back to Sweden. And Bains is getting up there in age to where it won’t be long until he’s considered nothing more than a AHL guy.

Especially hard for them given Lekkerimaki will be given preference if a scorer goes down, and Raty/Sasson, potentially Aman if he goes down have center ice call up priority.

 

[Peen]

Yes.

Or at least on at ES. Forbort does seem to have PK utility.

I feel like you have to give a vet like that a few weeks. Regardless I’ve been saying for months they need to target a D on waivers or jump the queue for one if a good opportunity arises, but I don’t think Forbort is actually THIS bad.

 

[biturbo19]

Credit to a bunch of depth guys who worked hard and showed a lot of structure to get this game to OT against a loaded Oilers lineup.

- Desharnais-Wolanin pair played a ton in the highest-leverage minutes and were outstanding. Desharnais was really good - showed some range in his play, made some surprisingly cute plays on the breakout under pressure, was an octopus for Oiler players to get around all night. Wolanin also had by far the best game he's had in the preseason and playing with a more reliable partner instead of a fringe guy like Woo probably helped a lot. Skated well, moved the puck well.

Yeah. I was impressed with Desharnais. At the level we're at in the preseason, he stands clearly head and shoulders above as a legit NHL defenceman. He looks...like a beer league situation where you've got an absolute ringer. Which bodes well for the season, because that's how a legit NHL defenceman should look right now, against this sort of roster. He should stand out and look easily composed. And he did.

Wolanin too though. He looked...every bit an NHLer to me. He did a lot of work to help Desharnais too, by just making the game easier for each other. I honestly like that better than Forbort-VD as a third pairing until they make a trade to fix the crappy blueline.

- Pettersson-Juulsen pairing mostly got by but were burned on the 1-1 goal. Pettersson's stock has lowered in this preseason relative to Kudryatsev - reaction times were too slow on several occasions, has a lot of work to do getting up to the speed of the NA pro game. Juulsen was meh.

I like D-Petey and his potential to eventually be a solid bottom-pairing filler for cheap. But yeah...he looks further than i thought he was, from actually filling that role.

- Lekkerimaki is trying but just isn't finding ways to get space and time to make plays and isn't strong enough to make plays with guys on top of him.

Lekky is an odd one. He is actually impressing me, but there are a lot of instances where it's very clear that he needs to adjust to "small ice" game. There's actually more there than i thought previously though. It's just a matter of figuring out how to translate his obvious skill to smaller, more crowded ice.

- Suter and Sherwood both had really strong games, easily the team's best two forwards. Suter had been having a pretty weak preseason so it was good to be reminded that he can be pretty effective.

Both also guys who stand out like VD, as dudes who are a very clear cut above most of the competition. They're "role players" and "filler" in the real season...but in a game like this, they stand out...as they should. There's an element of "ease" to the way they play at this level that isn't just "lazy taking camp off" like some more solid Pros. But still just carries a presence to their play that...it's kind of "easy" for them at this level.

- interesting goaltending battle. Round 1 went to Silovs. Round 2 clearly goes to Lankinen who was excellent tonight. Looked big, looked athletic, very good showing.

I don't really know that there's going to be any sort of "battle" in goal. It's really more just...ride the hot hand between the two...until Demko is back. Whenever that is. And for however long this time.

 

[Wry n Ginger]

I went to look, but all I found was an in depth conversation about how one of the mods here is a crayon eater

I mean, crayons definitely have the better consistency, but scratch and sniff stickers are a better over-all experience. Plus, the banana sticker is smiling and giving you a thumbs up. That positivity goes a long ways.

 

[biturbo19]

Yes.

Or at least on at ES. Forbort does seem to have PK utility.

There is that element to factor in. But idk...it's not like Wolanin can't PK, and jaysus cripes our defence could certainly use Wolanin's mobility the rest of the time. We also have a lot of guys who are PK minute dudes. But yeah...inevitably, Forbort is locked in.

 

[biturbo19]

If god forbid Hughes or Hronek get injured, I think we may see Wolanin come in. Otherwise, the minutes Forbort will be filling, Wolanin would likely struggle anyways. I think Tocchet/Foote have every intention of never seeing Forbort cross the red line lol.

It's easy to forget how much even Hughes and Hronek were an adventure in their own zone once they were hemmed in during the post-season. That's hopefully where we see Forbort at his most comfortable, playing below his own end-line and at the net front. I think that's the rationale anyways.

It just seems like such a...the wrong kind of adventure to potentially have a Forbort-VD pairing. Desharnais was actually pretty impressive in this one...but at an actual full on NHL level...i have so many reservations out that.

Wolanin isn't anything like a defensive trainwreck, he's actually very solid. But he can actually move...himself, and the puck...sometimes even both at once. And that's something this defence could really use.

Other side note...

PDG wearing an "A" basically means he's a roster lock, right?

I mean, crayons definitely have the better consistency, but scratch and sniff stickers are a better over-all experience. Plus, the banana sticker is smiling and giving you a thumbs up. That positivity goes a long ways.

If we're bringing smell into it...what about markers? They're potent as heck on the smell scale.

 

[Canucks LB]

You'd think they would have got pounded given the lineups, but overall this group played the Oilers pretty much even up. Probably not a full effort by the Oilers but the Canuck youngster exposed some definite problems Edmonton have.

Good

Desharnais - ungainly at times but effective in keeping Oilers to the outside and getting people off the puck. Showed some vet leadership. At this point seems a good pick up.

Kudryavtsev - continually got the puck out of trouble and provided excellent spacing for his defensive partner. Sees the ice well and seemed always in position to keep pucks in. Made very good decidions with the puck. Plays a very controlled game. Real good prospect.

Friedman - If you are using this game, he might fit well on the 3rd pairing. Had an excellent game. Showed good mobility and smart puck movement.

Suter - was good against McDavid and very good on forecheck. Any doubts about him making the team should be gone. Was miscast in an offensive role too much last year. Can kick in a few goals but forte is as a checker. And part of being effective in that role is keeping the puck in the o-zone which he did well tonite.

Sherwood - as advertised as far as being a pest. Has shown better wheels and hands than expected. Had great first period. Might have been first star.

Not Good

Pettersson - has some real problems to overcome. First, he is not fast enough to get up the ice to support the play (opposite of Kudryavtsev) Second, he is a puck watcher making it easy for players to slip behind him. Third, his skating is still too awkward around his net .so he does adjust quickly enough. Strung some decent shifts together in the second and through the third but too often got used as a pylon when the pressure was on. Far from ready for this level of hockey

Juulsen - clumsy, gettng screwed up in his assignments, making poor passes and poor decisions with the puck. Has shown nothing all pre-season and looks like a cut as of now.

Others

Sasson - always does enough to give you some hope.

Raty - thought he was pressing too hard. Had chance to make plays but never really did.

Wolanin - not bad. You wonder if he will through waivers.

Bains - does produce chances but this is more a result of thrashing around in front of the net. Actually does display some talent along the offensive end boards and that can lead to goals. Trouble is he so erratic in the rest of the play. Doesn't get back in tranistion and makes the kind of plays that put you in trouble - like blind back passes, lateral passes in traffic etc.. Good in limited area but not good in the general flow of the play. Can be a very frustrating player.

Lekkermaki - just can't get the separation to make plays. Little better defensively in this game.

Hoglander - had chances but mishandled the puck too much. Got little done. You wonder if it came down to a decision between Hoglander and Sprong, whether it might be better to move Hoglander to get help on the defense,

Aman - Tocchet shows a lot trust with this player. Just too bad his offense is so limited. Will, I think, start as 4th line center if Suter plays higher in the lineup.

Canucks have certainly given the young players a chance and some have risen to the occasion and some have not.

Spot on tonight

 

[Bubbles]

A guy like Gadjovich, who looked far worse & slower than Bains has this preseason when he left us, has gone on to play 40 games three years in a row. And most recently on a cup winning team.

I just looked it up and he missed the 41 game threshold to be on the Cup. But the Panthers petitioned and got his name engraved.

 

[Canucks LB]

Forbert was honestly brought to be a pk of specialist, and that’s what I believe he will be.

Just needs to survive playing 11 minutes night.

 

[Wry n Ginger]

If we're bringing smell into it...what about markers? They're potent as heck on the smell scale.

I think the "encased in hard plastic" would really reduce the mouthfeel.

Perhaps another member of the board has some experience on the matter? Bananas and mouthfeel just seems like a subject this particular board has most likely covered before?

 

[Blue and Green]

A guy like Gadjovich, who looked far worse & slower than Bains has this preseason when he left us, has gone on to play 40 games three years in a row. And most recently on a cup winning team.

Last season was the first year Zac Dalpe didn’t play a game in the NHL.

Karlsson is another internal example of a player better than those two.

Sometimes it’s just opportunity, luck, timing is my point.

But, I do agree neither of them are there yet. And once they’re down, that’s probably it for Karlsson and he’ll head back to Sweden. And Bains is getting up there in age to where it won’t be long until he’s considered nothing more than a AHL guy.

Especially hard for them given Lekkerimaki will be given preference if a scorer goes down, and Raty/Sasson, potentially Aman if he goes down have center ice call up priority.

Gadjovich is a bit of a different animal; he is in the NHL because he is a very good fighter. If he couldn't fight so well, he'd be in the AHL. Bains is more similar to Kole Lind. Karlsson is toast because he just can't skate.

 

[LemonSauceD]

Gadjovich is a bit of a different animal; he is in the NHL because he is a very good fighter. If he couldn't fight so well, he'd be in the AHL. Bains is more similar to Kole Lind. Karlsson is toast because he just can't skate.

Fwiw I’ve been saying for awhile Lind should be in the NHL. Seattle kind of dicked him around and they had too many veteran depth. Lind has looked excellent in pre season with Dallas, I think he might make it.

Bains is more like a Gaunce to me.

 

[David71]

who stays and who goes. sprong/pdg as 13th fwd. friedman as the 7th guy juulssen just flatout sucks. lekerammaki cut but be a callup as soon as injury hits. raty makes the team. once bluger/joshua are healthy he gets sent down too

 

[oilers4life5]

I went to look, but all I found was an in depth conversation about how one of the mods here is a crayon eater

I think you know which one.

 

[VanJack]

If god forbid Hughes or Hronek get injured, I think we may see Wolanin come in. Otherwise, the minutes Forbort will be filling, Wolanin would likely struggle anyways. I think Tocchet/Foote have every intention of never seeing Forbort cross the red line lol.

It's easy to forget how much even Hughes and Hronek were an adventure in their own zone once they were hemmed in during the post-season. That's hopefully where we see Forbort at his most comfortable, playing below his own end-line and at the net front. I think that's the rationale anyways.

Agreed.....but looking across at the other side of the ice, can you imagine what happens to the Oilers blueline if Bouchard were to go down? Still not a guarantee that Nurse will be available to start the season as well.

That Oiler blueline tonight was beyond 'frightening'.

 

[kanucks25]

I don't think Bains is done as a prospect but the organization needs to make it clear to him that he needs to work on his "NHL game" and of course keep working on his skating. He can obviously make a play but if he wants to carve out a career in the NHL he'll need to find a path to being a bottom-6 guy that coaches can trust. The reason why someone like Aman keeps getting games is because he's not going to hurt you defensively and he can simply skate. Even if he doesn't offer anything else, that seems to be enough for players to get regular 4th line minutes.

Let Bains - Sasson - Lekk do damage in the AHL and reassess when there's an injury and someone needs to be called up.

Speaking of Aman, just don't see him having a spot on this team anymore. There are at least 12 forwards, especially when healthy, that offer "something" over his overwhelmingly vanilla skillset. PDG is in the same boat when it comes to players you don't really want in your starting 12.

Forbort is definitely a PK specialist and ought be given limited minutes outside of the PK. If it turns out he's literally unplayable 5-on-5 then you have Friedman as a stop-gap until you can find something better via waivers or trade. And if all the veteran options don't work out you can give Kud a cup of coffee to see what he can do. In any case, I imagine management knows they will need to bolster this defence via trade eventually if they want to be a legit contender come playoff time.

Overall, when it comes to the forwards, we're hoping at least one of Sprong, Hoglander, Sherwood or Heinen find chemistry in the top-6 and offer massive surplus value. The others are good enough to still be valuable in the bottom-6. It'll be interesting to see how everything plays out in the regular season.

 

[biturbo19]

Forbert was honestly brought to be a pk of specialist, and that’s what I believe he will be.

Just needs to survive playing 11 minutes night.

This is actually terrible though. Because hockey.