Pittsburgh Penguins Prospects Thread

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cygnus47

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Have you or anyone named a player yet that produced as little as Hall has in juniors and still carved out any type of NHL career?

Interested in any answers to this. It's not like being small where some guys get over it and some guys don't, not being able to produce at all in juniors seems to be 100% indicative of lacking the skills to make the NHL in any meaningful capacity.
 

Jacob

as seen on TV
Feb 27, 2002
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The only close example I can come up with is Engelland, but even he produced better than Hall in the WHL, didn’t make the NHL until 8 seasons and 4 different organizations after his overage season... and has been basically a #7 since then.
 

Jacob

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Lauzon was back tonight. No points, 5 hits, 4 shots and +1 in a 3-1 win over Drozg, who had 1 assist, & Shawinigan

Hopefully his shoulder is good and it’s not some BS where we find out in May that it was hanging by a thread the whole season and needs surgery.
 

Sidney the Kidney

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The only close example I can come up with is Engelland, but even he produced better than Hall in the WHL, didn’t make the NHL until 8 seasons and 4 different organizations after his overage season... and has been basically a #7 since then.

Marc Methot is the only defenseman I can think of who actually carved out a career as a top four defender in the NHL who put up very few points in junior. In his three years with London, he produced 15, 11, and 16 points, respectively.

But that's what makes guys like that the rare exception, and why hoping Hall becomes another exception rather than turning out like 99% of the defensemen who did NOT produce in junior is wishful thinking.
 

Jag68Sid87

Sullivan gots to go!
Oct 1, 2003
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Have I watched all 17 games of the Kitchener Rangers this season? No. I've watched 4 full games, and watched 1 partial game (was flipping between it and another show), and in that time I didn't see a player who had improved at all (or any more than very, very marginally) from when I saw him play as a 17 year old, the year the Pens originally drafted him.

Maybe I just so happened to watch the 5 worst games he played this season. But I somehow doubt it. That would be quite the coincidence that the 5 times I watched him he looked like Rob Scuderi with the puck on his stick, but in the 12 games I missed he showed a vast improvement in his puck skills.

He plays with more authority or confidence, for lack of a better description, when he's on the ice. But that comes with experience. Even kids who never amount to a thing start to play with a bit more swagger when they're 19/20 years old compared to when they were 16/17 rookies or sophomores. But his actual ability with the puck on his stick -- puckhandling, passing, shooting, etc. -- hasn't made any sort of noticeable improvement.

His lack of production just reinforces when I see with the "eye test".

I also don't think there's an agenda. I wanted for him to be like a Travis Hamonic; a physical defensive guy who breaks out offensively after being drafted. But that simply hasn't happened. He's Clark Seymour/Reid McNeil all over again, but instead of being a late draft pick, Pittsburgh for some reason took him in the 3rd round.

Thanks for this. I definitely take what you say into account. I still believe that every prospect, not some, not the vast majority but EVERY prospect, is a unique situation. So, I am not pulling the plug on him yet. It's too soon. But it is concerning, I will grant you.
 

Don'tcry4mejanhrdina

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Aug 4, 2003
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This space.
Marc Methot is the only defenseman I can think of who actually carved out a career as a top four defender in the NHL who put up very few points in junior. In his three years with London, he produced 15, 11, and 16 points, respectively.

But that's what makes guys like that the rare exception, and why hoping Hall becomes another exception rather than turning out like 99% of the defensemen who did NOT produce in junior is wishful thinking.
It'll make it even harder for Hall to have any skill with the puck once Crosby starts chopping off his fingers during training camp.
 
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deakka

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Miletic is on a tear atm.
He had just 3 points in his first 7 games.
He has since then put up 13 points in 6 games.
 

FreeBobbyFarnham

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Lafferty and Angello both played last night. Angello is having a good start so far with 5 pts (1+4) in 6 games. As for Lafferty, he's having a rougher start with only 2 pts (1+1) in 6 games.
 

Jag68Sid87

Sullivan gots to go!
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So last night I was able to watch a LITTLE of Zachary Lauzon in the Canada-Russia Series, and very little of Connor Hall in the Kitchener-London game. The Pens were playing at the same time, plus all kinds of other games everywhere, so I did not see as much as I wanted. That said, Lauzon seems like an Alexei Emelin type of defenseman who likes to seek out the big hit. He took a penalty early but really set the tone with a huge hit. I didn't see much of him after that. He seems like a good skater and a big hitter. I saw even less of Hall, but he seems to play a little the way Chara plays at age 40...he stays close to his own goaltender and likes to protect the house.

The Pens seemed to go out of their way to draft both of these guys, and both are strictly defensive defensemen. It's interesting that they've taken this approach, but maybe the thinking here is that they do not want (or maybe CANNOT) re-sign Ian Cole (or any other defensive defenseman) at the going rate. So they are preparing for life after Cole, maybe? That seems logical to me, although we might need a rental or two before either Hall or Lauzon would be ready to contribute.

Anyway, it's interesting that we have these two guys in the system and I will continue to try to monitor their progress when I can. It's not all doom and gloom imo, so long as we also develop more offense-oriented blueliners in the years to come.
 

Peat

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The Pens seemed to go out of their way to draft both of these guys, and both are strictly defensive defensemen. It's interesting that they've taken this approach, but maybe the thinking here is that they do not want (or maybe CANNOT) re-sign Ian Cole (or any other defensive defenseman) at the going rate. So they are preparing for life after Cole, maybe? That seems logical to me, although we might need a rental or two before either Hall or Lauzon would be ready to contribute.

Anyway, it's interesting that we have these two guys in the system and I will continue to try to monitor their progress when I can. It's not all doom and gloom imo, so long as we also develop more offense-oriented blueliners in the years to come.

There's a fair few other big abrasive dmen introduced to the system in the last two years as well.

I'm not sure its an Ian Cole replacement method because there's going to be quite a gap if he goes this season. But we are going to need some more ELC dmen asap and big abrasive guys who can play hockey well enough for Sully's system don't grow on trees. I buy the thought process even if the early returns on the selection process aren't great.
 

Empoleon8771

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Aug 25, 2015
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Lauzon looked more like a Dumoulin type player than a bruiser when I watched him, I thought. He skates well, makes a good first pass and is very sound positionally. Maybe I just didn't see the side of grit that he brought, but I was thinking Dumoulin 2.0 when I watched him.

He's not an Ian Cole replacement, because Hunwick is the Ian Cole replacement and someone like Bengtsson or Corrado is going to be the other guy on the bottom pair. However, that is the spot I do see him taking up in the long run, maybe even with Bengtsson as the RD on that pair. I'm a fan of Lauzon.
 

FreeBobbyFarnham

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Angello adds a goal and an assist in a 6-1 win against St. Lawrence. Cornell has been hot with a 7-0 start and so has Angello with 7 pts in 7 games.

Lafferty on the other hand isn't having the start I expected from him. Only 2 pts in 7 games. Hopefully he turns it around.
 

deakka

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Miletic with back to back 3 point games this thursday and friday. After just 3 points in his first 7 games. He has since scored 20 points in 9 games.
 
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Jacob

as seen on TV
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I caught a London game this week (it was actually from a few weeks ago but I recorded it and just watched it on Wednesday) and Miletic looked pretty solid. Hard to describe him as a player because he seems to do a little bit of everything but doesn't really stand out in any area. It seemed like the puck gravitated towards him and when he got it he would hold it and make good, high percentage plays with it, nothing real fancy.

If I had to come up with an NHL comparable, not in terms of upside or expectations but just style, it'd be Joel Ward.
 

deakka

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Bellerive is really consistent . Have only been held without a point 3 times in 19 games.
Has 25 points so far.
 

deakka

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Is D'Orio injured? Not that he has been good lately after a good start. But he hasnt even dressed the last 2 games .
 

FreeBobbyFarnham

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Lafferty played last night and picked up an assist. Now has a total of 3 points (1+2) in 8 games.

Angello played also but went scoreless in their first loss of the season to Clarkson.
 

cygnus47

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Sep 14, 2013
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I caught a London game this week (it was actually from a few weeks ago but I recorded it and just watched it on Wednesday) and Miletic looked pretty solid. Hard to describe him as a player because he seems to do a little bit of everything but doesn't really stand out in any area. It seemed like the puck gravitated towards him and when he got it he would hold it and make good, high percentage plays with it, nothing real fancy.

If I had to come up with an NHL comparable, not in terms of upside or expectations but just style, it'd be Joel Ward.

It's hard to judge 20 year old CHL players. They tend to just be physically too good for younger players. You never know if you're getting nothing, Max Talbot or a legit late bloomer.
 

Sidney the Kidney

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Been watching LDN highlights and Militec's on a roll for sure. Noticed he pk's as well.

I wouldn't put too much stock, if any, into the bolded. In junior, the better players tend to be used in all situations, regardless if they're actually good defensively or not.
 

deakka

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Bellerive with 3 more points tonight . Om pace for almost 100 points. Not bad for a free agent signing whos not an overager. Hes only in his draft+1 year.

Edit: he is 5th in scoring and 4th in ppg for u19 players this season in the WHL. Not playing on a powerhouse either. They only have 17 points in 21 games.
 
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FreeBobbyFarnham

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Sam Lafferty with a 2-goal performance last night. He's been much better lately, had a bit of a slow start, but he has turned it around. He's got 5 pts (3+2) in 9 games so far.
 

deakka

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I guess we should have heard something by now. But is there any chance of Tieffels or Blueger making the olympics?

Both were playing in the world cup this spring.
 
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