Waived: [PIT] G Tristian Jarry waived by the Penguins

[Jacob]

Matt Murray: "it's a team effort."
HFChud43190: "see! he said himself he didn't contribute to those Cups!"

 

[Hasbro]

Dubas gave $27 million each to Jarry and Graves on the same day right after he was hired by the Pens.

That’s $52 million in salary to a guy that is now on waivers and another guy that is now a perennial healthy scratch on one of the worst D corps in the league.

Why does/did anyone ever think Kyle Dubas was qualified to run an NHL team?

He has spreadsheets.

 

[Merc29]

I mean, St. Louis took Kapanen off us, we could get lucky

 

[Hasbro]

Is Dubas the worst goalie evaluator of all time?

Bobby Clarke.

 

[Richard]

So question, haven't followed the CBA since '05 ---- if Jarry is in the minors he doesn't count against the cap right?

 

[Wolfpuck]

It would be pretty funny if a GM let the intrusive thoughts win.

 

[Jacob]

So question, haven't followed the CBA since '05 ---- if Jarry is in the minors he doesn't count against the cap right?

Most of it does. Like 1.1 million or so of it doesn't.

 

[Richard]

Most of it does. Like 1.1 million or so of it doesn't.

Rather leave him there, right ? because it extends like two more years if bought out

 

[Jacob]

Rather leave him there, right ? because it extends like two more years if bought out

Probably. Unless they wanna pull a Guerin and buy him out just to send a message to him.

They could just try to make his life miserable and send him to Wheeling and hope he doesn't report, then they can void the contract.

 

[Randy Butternubs]

So question, haven't followed the CBA since '05 ---- if Jarry is in the minors he doesn't count against the cap right?

Most of it does. Like 1.1 million or so of it doesn't.

If buried in the minors you save whatever the league minimum is plus $375k. I think league minimum is $775k so you're saving $1.15m with him in the minors.

 

[Sidgeni Malkby]

There wasn't much else at the time when Jarry was being signed. Blomqvist was a few years out. I do blame Dubas for the term. I don't know why he didn't give him a 2 year term instead.

I can see us either...
1) trading Jarry for someone else's problem at the same space/term (not a goalie though).
2) trading Jarry + pick, only to recover that pick by selling off the saved cap space (like the Hayes deal).
3) burying him in the minors and eating the $4.225 ($5.375M- $1.15M) cap hit.
4) buying him out, though that may be the least attractive option considering term and salary.

#3 leads to a whole set of alternate paths... trading Ned, using Jarry as a backup until Murashov is ready to be in the NHL.

I'd rather take a chance on another teams problem than keeping Jarry in any capacity.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Sooooo many GMs have been screwed over by this recently. Which is why I never wanted my Oil to sign Campbell. Especially coming off TWO years of Mike Smith providing Well Above League average goaltending for a measly 2.3M per. But incessant noise from media to go "fix" goaltending made us not realize how good we had it with Smith even though he was like 37 at the time.

Let's go down the List:
Blake -> Pettersson
Yzerman -> Husso
Holland -> Campbell
Francis -> Grubauer
Sakic -> Georgiev
Sweeney -> Swayman
Dubas -> Jarry
Kekkalainen -> Merzlikens

It's because the nature of how the goaltender position operates is naturally volatile. Sign a Number 1 Defenseman who isn't living up to expectations? Make him your number 3 defenseman. Sign a number 3 defenseman who isn't performing, make him your number 5 defenseman. Not ideal, but you can still move them down lineup easy enough and get some contribution.

Sign a number 1 goaltender to a normal number 1 goaltender contract and he's not performing? To the bench.

Oh, and if a prospect from your system on defense is playing well, likely a whole bunch of options for whom you send down or take out the lineup before the $5.5 million defenseman's spot is on the line. With a goalie? Well you have your starter you signed, and your backup you signed, likely neither of whom is Waiver-Exempt. So what do you do when the guy you're paying like a Number 1 Goalie isn't the best performing goalie that you have right now? You're SOL with a high-priced backup. the 1A/1B thing is fine for regular season, but if you're a Playoff team then come postseason time, you're carrying $5 million of dead cap essentially.

End result is you're naturally going to get a lot of Goaltenders paid like Number 1s sitting on the bench and giving no value. You could I suppose just *never* pay a goaltender and always just sign a Backup and then Waiver Wire pickup if there's no prospect and willingly say we'll invest zero cap into the position. That's often not a great plan for heading into a season for a team with aspirations but could work out in the instances of a prospect that you can reliably plug into net. Since the pads shrunk though, the "throw any guy from your system and it might work out" has been less common of a success plan. 5 out of the last 8 last playoffs had a really good goaltender. If your defense is 2022-23 Knights level good, you could probably get away with going cheap on goaltending, if it's not, it's much more of a crapshoot.

Ultimately, it's reductivist as heck to say, but you just gotta make sure you sign/pay the right guy.

 

[SEALBound]

Moment of truth is almost upon us. I find it highly unlikely that he gets claimed...BUT...if he does, I will donate $50 to charity taking suggestions from people in this thread.

 

[Extra Texture]

As yes, the roster move that any Pens fan could’ve called 18 months ago is finally here. Jarry may have had some decent numbers early in his career, but I think it was obvious from 2021 onward that he just didn’t have “it”. Most of us were saying it but they should’ve let him walk in 2023, and take their chances with a platoon or the trade market. Absolutely anything was better than committing long term to this mentally weak, oft injured, meltdown artist.

The fact that Jarry got that fat extension 2 years later is both an indictment of Dubas AND the Pens org, which has been enamored with Jarry for years now, inexplicably. With this Jarry moves, and Grabes being benched, Dubas is conceding that his two big signings from 2023 are massive duds, and it hopefully means FSG wakes the hell up realizes both he and Sullivan are massive frauds who have been playing them for fools. That won’t happen, because FSG are gullible morons, but it would be nice.

Should never of moved on from Marc-Andre Fleury like 10 years ago maybe less..

Oh, right, this tired bullshit again. So the Pens shouldn’t have ditched Fluery for….Matt Murray, who was still very good, cost controlled, younger, cheaper, had just backed them to a second cup and unburdened by off ice problems in 2017?

Until they won the cup in 2016, Fleury was THE MAIN reason this Pens team were playoff failures year after year. For years his antics torpedoed good playoff teams. He played well in the 2017 run, but once again he shit the bed in the ECF and had to bailed out by a 23 yr old Murray. The rewriting of history here has to stop. Even when Fleury was quality, he still failed in the clutch. Murray came in as a kid and showed him how it was done.

There is a reason gaffes by subsequent pens goalies have greeted by jibes of “Marc Andre Murray” or “Marc Andre Jarry”. A few relatively stable years since have convinced everyone MAF somehow the better option in 2017. If they keep him and get rid of Jarry, he probably goes back to being the smiling gaffe machine Yinzers love so much.

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

I hate that every Pens transaction thread never ends up being about the player and always revolves around Dubas. I just wanna read some informative commentary on the roster move and potential implications.

Dubi is the Leafs' ex who's moved on and they can't stop thinking about it.

 

[Jacob]

I think obviously this is hindsight, but even at the time, nobody would've faulted Dubas for letting Jarry walk and just going with 3 cheap goalies to battle it out. We had DeSmith, who is mediocre, and Nedeljkovic, who was coming off a bad season but has proven to be a little bit better than Jarry and a *lot* cheaper, and maybe you get a Talbot or some other veteran on a 1 year deal to battle for starts. So instead of $6 million invested in one flake you're at $4 million between 3 guys, any of which you can easily bury in the minors, and you probably get the same or even slightly better results if you just ride the hot hand.

I think Dubas had some plan that he was going to keep Jarry and also acquire Neds because of their puckhandling. That seemed like a theme to me in getting Nedeljkovic *and* keeping Jarry and then trading DeSmith. His little spreadsheets must've put high value (or lower perceived value league-wide) on puckhandling goalies, I guess. Didn't work, obviously.

Nedeljkovic is far from great but he's been at least adequate for the price. And he seems like less of a sulker when things aren't going well. Less likely to drag the team down when he's not on his game. More of a battler, which teams will respond positively to.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

And Leaf fans balked when everyone and their uncle said that Dubas was awful.

Good times

Literally everyone on the Leafs board resents Dubas except for 2 fanboy bots and one guy who is like 15.

 

[SEALBound]

I think obviously this is hindsight, but even at the time, nobody would've faulted Dubas for letting Jarry walk and just going with 3 cheap goalies to battle it out. We had DeSmith, who is mediocre, and Nedeljkovic, who was coming off a bad season but has proven to be a little bit better than Jarry and a *lot* cheaper, and maybe you get a Talbot or some other veteran on a 1 year deal to battle for starts. So instead of $6 million invested in one flake you're at $4 million between 3 guys, any of which you can easily bury in the minors, and you probably get the same or even slightly better results if you just ride the hot hand.

I think Dubas had some plan that he was going to keep Jarry and also acquire Neds because of their puckhandling. That seemed like a theme to me in getting Nedeljkovic *and* keeping Jarry and then trading DeSmith. His little spreadsheets must've put high value (or lower perceived value league-wide) on puckhandling goalies, I guess. Didn't work, obviously.

Nedeljkovic is far from great but he's been at least adequate for the price. And he seems like less of a sulker when things aren't going well. Less likely to drag the team down when he's not on his game. More of a battler, which teams will respond positively to.

Tough market that year and the alternatives are just as cringy. I am on the Jarry is 99% bad side. That 1% is my better judgement reminding me that this team under Sullivan is a defensive zone nightmare. By and large lately, decent players that come to this team instantly look like shit. Guys go away and they find their game again.

So if we go back and Dubas balks at resigning Jarry and signs Talbot instead (and we assume that TJ goes elsewhere) and the combo of Talbot and...? CDS? Neds? Whoever, if they tank, Dubas looks even worse, ESPECIALLY if Jarry signs elsewhere and performs at an average level - which is extremely plausible after getting away from Mike Sullivan.

The conversation simply changes from "why did he resign Jarry! He stinks!" to "Why didn't he resign Jarry! Talbot stinks!" The scenario of "my god, signing Talbot was the smartest thing a GM has done!" seems more unlikely given, ya know, Mike Sullivan.

 

[Curufinwe]

Goalies are a nightmare for GMs

 

[Randy Butternubs]

Moment of truth is almost upon us. I find it highly unlikely that he gets claimed...BUT...if he does, I will donate $50 to charity taking suggestions from people in this thread.

I'll give $20.

 

[Sideline]

Moment of truth is almost upon us. I find it highly unlikely that he gets claimed...BUT...if he does, I will donate $50 to charity taking suggestions from people in this thread.

Canadian National Institute for the Blind Foundation. Because some GM is clearly not able to watch Jarry play if he gets claimed.