Salary Cap: Pens Summer Salary Thread: Dull days of August... Oooo! A trade!

[Pens1566]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1836463809273434392

Don't need him to make the playoffs I suppose.

Interesting choice to wait a few months after the season ended to go under the knife. Must have been lots of 2nd opinions ...

 

[eXile3]

Everything I hear about our system is that it requires speed on the wings.

So naturally, putting the slowest player in the league there is an automatic.

Uhh I hate to tell you this but slow players are about all we have. I was running names through Edge the other day and we are slow. Just all around slow.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Your discontent is born out of the frustration that Sid is still a thing at all.

You don't understand. My frustration is borne out of the organization not doing everything in its power to return as quickly as possible to contention as it can.
I feel that it's the responsibility of ownership and management to work towards that goal, aggressively, every year. But they are taking many years off. It's like a big holiday.

It's primarily with FSG, since they are forcing a mandate on Dubas, and that affects everything else.
The organization is satisfied with purgatory, and are even making moves to stay there. That is dispiriting for me.
Crosby is just one element of that, albeit a very important one.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

You can't just say "that's not a matter of opinion" to not make it... you know... your opinion.

The core has held up their end to this point. Evgeni Malkin isn't holding the coach and GM hostage and forcing them to make moronic decisions. Kris Letang isn't in charge of the lineup card. You can blame the players for not performing out on the ice but I don't see how they are liable for this team's shitty, coward management, stale egotistical coaching and many years of failed drafting and player development.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

You can't just say "that's not a matter of opinion" to not make it... you know... your opinion.

The core has held up their end to this point. Evgeni Malkin isn't holding the coach and GM hostage and forcing them to make moronic decisions. Kris Letang isn't in charge of the lineup card. You can blame the players for not performing out on the ice but I don't see how they are liable for this team's shitty, coward management, stale egotistical coaching and many years of failed drafting and player development.

It's a fact that this entire process and management mindset would completely turn on its head if all 3 of them weren't here.
I don't blame any players. The core received signals for them to stay in Pittsburgh, so they did. They are doing their jobs to the best of their ability as players. They are fine.

It's ownership that's not. They are NOT doing their jobs to the best of their ability.
Pushing for a retirement tour was not the way to go, at this stage of the Pens cycle. Keeping Sullivan was wrong. The writing was on the wall for all of it, and they ignored it for the sake of short-term profits and saving face on their investment. They are not prioritizing championships, like they said they would.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Imagine what we could have seen with this coaching staff and the center depth of the Minnesota Wild!

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

It's a fact that this entire process and management mindset would completely turn on its head if all 3 of them weren't here.

I think you give Sullivan, Kyle and co. way too much credit.

You take away the core and maybe you pick in a better spot, sure. You've solved one small thing that we'll organically get to soon enough anyway but you still have far bigger problems.

I guess my point is I don't understand pining for the core f***ing off if you're left with a trashpile organization run by buffoons just... without the core. Like... great? Picking high doesn't mean much if the people in charge of handling that talent are certified goofs.

Like... maybe I'm wrong and if so I apologize for misreading what you have been on about. But I feel like your attitude is basically "the core needs to get outta the way and let Mike, Kyle and this front office cook."

Really?

You sure about that?

 

[AuroraBorealis]

You take away the core and maybe you pick in a better spot, sure. You've solved one small thing that we'll organically get to soon enough anyway but you still have far bigger problems.

It's not about the high pick. A full rebuild involves so much more than that.
It's about how all the money gets used when they're committed. A massive chunk of it can be funnelled towards pick acquisition, in the same way that they used a chunk of it for the return for Smith, and what they got for taking on Glass and Hayes. Now imagine that mentality, but on a much larger scale, with much more money to use.
When they stop signing these huge deals and unload what they have, a ton frees up to use towards the correct goal.

I guess my point is I don't understand pining for the core f***ing off if you're left with a trashpile organization run by buffoons just... without the core. Like... great? Picking high doesn't mean much if the people in charge of handling that talent are certified goofs.

Dubas is not a buffoon, especially not with drafting and development. That's his expertise, since he did it for many years in the AHL.
There's no reason to believe he couldn't execute a rebuild well. His trades since the deadline lend credence to that. It's good asset management. His draft history is good.
He's winning these trades too, at least on paper.
His weakness is more with the overly generous AAV's he hands out. He's not good at negotiating with agents. But he is good at negotiating with other GMs.

Like... maybe I'm wrong and if so I apologize for misreading what you have been on about. But I feel like your attitude is basically "the core needs to get outta the way and let Mike, Kyle and this front office cook."

Really?

You sure about that?

Well I'm not sure if Dubas will ultimately succeed, but I am sure that this current course will lead nowhere in the playoffs.
So I'm certain that the right thing to do in this situation is to at least try an avenue that has some hope attached to it, instead of wasting time.
It's the default option. There's nothing to lose when you have nothing to begin with.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Training Camp: Glass (09.18.24) | Pittsburgh Penguins

Glass speaks with the media

www.nhl.com

This guy is coming in with a massive chip on his shoulder. Pullin for him.

 

[SEALBound]

Here's a beauty from the Facebook world:

Christian Dvorak
Dmitri Kostenko

for

Hayes
Brunicke
2026 4th

Given what we saw from Brunicke, hard no.

 

[SEALBound]

It's not that that's clever. It's that the status quo is stupid and pointless. Why spend 5 years on a sinking ship when you can work towards something in that time?
Even if it takes 10 years, I'd prefer the team to be ready by 2032 instead of 2037, ya know?

It's 100% a core problem. That's not a matter of opinion. It's not just about their cap or their return. It's about how them being here affects the decisions of others. It's a domino effect.
Dubas and ownership would have fully committed to rebuilding already if they weren't here. Karlsson wouldn't have come here. Graves would not have come here. Petts wouldn't get re-signed (like they plan to do). They wouldn't have re-signed Jarry to that deal. 2024-2027 would be very critical years for the organization, instead of half-ass years.
They are holding the whole revitalization process hostage by staying.

If they were still in a Cup window that'd be totally fine. But that's long gone. When it's like that you have to move on to the next step in the cycle of rebirth.
Fighting the natural order in the league does not lead to anything good.

Thems da breaks when you have generational talents that give you a 15+ year run of perennial Stanley Cup contention while winning it three times and an additional trip to the dance and an additional ECF.

This isn't Pavs and Thornton, here. These aren't guys that you can simply step away from and say "Oh, we want to suck now so we can get better without you". You wanna know how I know that? Because the proof is right in front of us.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I think you give Sullivan, Kyle and co. way too much credit.

You take away the core and maybe you pick in a better spot, sure. You've solved one small thing that we'll organically get to soon enough anyway but you still have far bigger problems.

I guess my point is I don't understand pining for the core f***ing off if you're left with a trashpile organization run by buffoons just... without the core. Like... great? Picking high doesn't mean much if the people in charge of handling that talent are certified goofs.

Like... maybe I'm wrong and if so I apologize for misreading what you have been on about. But I feel like your attitude is basically "the core needs to get outta the way and let Mike, Kyle and this front office cook."

Really?

You sure about that?

This idea that if only Sid, Geno and Co. would f*** off, we'd start that rebuild that will result in a dynasty a lot sooner ignores the fact this organization has tied its fortunes to Mike Sullivan and that means Sullivan will be guiding that rebuild.

I don't know who in their right mind thinks that's going to result in something good. Gee, I wonder what Sullivan will do with those 18 and 19 year studs we draft high? Probably make them learn to play the right way on the 4th line while his 30 year old grinder brigade get the cushy minutes.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

I'm hoping Sullivan and the team have a mutual parting of ways after he embarrasses himself and USA hockey at the Milan Olympics, and the Pens have their fourth straight playoff miss in 2025-26.

Cuz yeah, as much as I'm over this no man's land bullshit where they're not good enough to even have a prayer of competing, but not bad enough to land top picks--I absolutely do not want that guy in charge of coaching the next crop of premium prospects. I've been saying that for years.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I'm hoping Sullivan and the team have a mutual parting of ways after he embarrasses himself and USA hockey at the Milan Olympics, and the Pens have their fourth straight playoff miss in 2025-26.

Cuz yeah, as much as I'm over this no man's land bullshit where they're not good enough to even have a prayer of competing, but not bad enough to land top picks--I absolutely do not want that guy in charge of coaching the next crop of premium prospects. I've been saying that for years.

Scouts: "Gavin McKenna's the type of offensive weapon that can turn a franchise around almost immediately."

Sullivan: "But how is he on the PK?"

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Sullivan will be here until at least 2027. We know that.

So like... why are we trying to shove the core out the door, again? Make it make sense.

Also do we REALLY think that the team is going to take that potential cap space and sign and flip players every year like they're pieces of real estate or something? These guys can't even bring themselves to trade Marcus Pettersson FFS.

 

[Gurglesons]

This idea that if only Sid, Geno and Co. would f*** off, we'd start that rebuild that will result in a dynasty a lot sooner ignores the fact this organization has tied its fortunes to Mike Sullivan and that means Sullivan will be guiding that rebuild.

I don't know who in their right mind thinks that's going to result in something good. Gee, I wonder what Sullivan will do with those 18 and 19 year studs we draft high? Probably make them learn to play the right way on the 4th line while his 30 year old grinder brigade get the cushy minutes.

His comments on McG were perfect on how shit this dude is at prospects.

I wonder who the Sully fan base will blame when he starts treating these A list prospects like he did the C list ones when their excuse was “our prospects suck”.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

His comments on McG were perfect on how shit this dude is at prospects.

I wonder who the Sully fan base will blame when he starts treating these A list prospects like he did the C list ones when their excuse was “our prospects suck”.

Boy Scoob I'm beginning to wonder if all these prospects really DID suck or if there is some other mysterious unknown force at play?!?

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Can we stop talking about a premature end for the core? They're all retiring as Penguins. End of the story. Geno has two years left. Just enjoy them.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Can we stop talking about a premature end for the core? They're all retiring as Penguins. End of the story. Geno has two years left. Just enjoy them.

Unfortunately I think Geno himself is going to make that hard for us to do.

If not your boy will make sure of it.

 

[GilbertSeinfeld]

Can we stop talking about a premature end for the core? They're all retiring as Penguins. End of the story. Geno has two years left. Just enjoy them.

Have you met this board?

 

[DesertedPenguin]

Unfortunately I think Geno himself is going to make that hard for us to do.

If not your boy will make sure of it.

If Geno's play falls off a cliff, I think he's self-aware enough to pull the plug himself.

But it hasn't yet. He's within reach of a few milestones. Just let him play.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

If Geno's play falls off a cliff, I think he's self-aware enough to pull the plug himself.

But it hasn't yet. He's within reach of a few milestones. Just let him play.

How long you think he'll take to hit 500? I'm thinking a month but I'm a fan so you'll have to forgive my optimism.

Ricky Raks and Beauviller or whatever garbo he gets stuck with won't be much help but at least he'll get half a minute or so on the second PP unit a game to play next to big dogs like Hayes and DOC.

 

[K Fleur]

I think Malkin is going to have a good year and I’m a season ticket holder which means I’m smarter than you.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

How long you think he'll take to hit 500? I'm thinking a month but I'm a fan so you'll have to forgive my optimism.

Ricky Raks and Beauviller or whatever garbo he gets stuck with won't be much help but at least he'll get half a minute or so on the second PP unit a game to play next to big dogs like Hayes and DOC.

If Malkin takes a month while healthy to hit 500, I'll change my avatar to a fire Sullivan meme of your choice.

I bet Malkin hits the milestone in the first five games, and that's being conservative.

 

[K Fleur]

Beauvillier tweeted that one time at Anna Kendrick and got her to respond.

Dude is a dork of a hockey player though.