Salary Cap: Pens '24-'25 Salary Thread: The Crosbicles Volume XIX

[Dennis Reynolds]

Never liked POJ. Three first names is too much for a fella.

 

[Khelandros]

POJ moves feels like a big f*** you to Sullivan because Dubas isn't allowed to fire him.

Pretty sure Sullivan didn't want POJ back this past summer, which is why he wasn't tendered. Petts gets hurt, bring back POJ for free, piss off Sullivan cause now he has to play him.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

POJ moves feels like a big f*** you to Sullivan because Dubas isn't allowed to fire him.

Pretty sure Sullivan didn't want POJ back this past summer, which is why he wasn't tendered. Petts gets hurt, bring back POJ for free, piss off Sullivan cause now he has to play him.

I wish Dubas were that cool.

I seriously doubt he is.

 

[SEALBound]

POJ moves feels like a big f*** you to Sullivan because Dubas isn't allowed to fire him.

Pretty sure Sullivan didn't want POJ back this past summer, which is why he wasn't tendered. Petts gets hurt, bring back POJ for free, piss off Sullivan cause now he has to play him.

I don't think that is the case. I mean, Sullivan played POJ with Letang on the top pairing for much of the year. You don't do that with guys you hate.

POJ was a RFA and was arb eligible. I would guess that the Pens wanted him back in the $1mil range for 1-2 years but he was eying that $2-2.5mil range for 2 years+. So I think they elected to not qualify him based on that. Then turning attention to FA, I would imagine he got "ERod'd" a little by his agent thinking that there would be a bigger market for him than there was only to settle in STL where his brother was. So I'd be willing to bet it was more POJ pricing himself out of Pittsburgh rather than it being because Sullivan didn't like him. There's just no evidence of that.

And if you have to play someone new, who would you rather play - a guy who's been with the team and the system before? Or a guy starting from literally square one?

 

[DesertedPenguin]

I don't think that is the case. I mean, Sullivan played POJ with Letang on the top pairing for much of the year. You don't do that with guys you hate.

POJ was a RFA and was arb eligible. I would guess that the Pens wanted him back in the $1mil range for 1-2 years but he was eying that $2-2.5mil range for 2 years+. So I think they elected to not qualify him based on that. Then turning attention to FA, I would imagine he got "ERod'd" a little by his agent thinking that there would be a bigger market for him than there was only to settle in STL where his brother was. So I'd be willing to bet it was more POJ pricing himself out of Pittsburgh rather than it being because Sullivan didn't like him. There's just no evidence of that.

And if you have to play someone new, who would you rather play - a guy who's been with the team and the system before? Or a guy starting from literally square one?

This is the answer. Dubas flat out said they wanted him back and offered him a contract, but they ultimately punted because of arbitration.

 

[BusinessGoose]

Wonder if he was like "cool" or "damn it, I thought I escaped" when his agent called

 

[Dennis Reynolds]

Wonder if he was like "cool" or "damn it, I thought I escaped" when his agent called

I would've climbed the Arch and not looked back.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

I assume Sebastian Aho is injured down on the farm? I doubt they make this move had he been available.

That said, I still think Joseph has some untapped upside as a defender. So I am happy.

 

[AuroraBorealis]

I assume Sebastian Aho is injured down on the farm? I doubt they make this move had he been available.

That said, I still think Joseph has some untapped upside as a defender. So I am happy.

Yes. St. Ivany too.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

I assume Sebastian Aho is injured down on the farm? I doubt they make this move had he been available.

That said, I still think Joseph has some untapped upside as a defender. So I am happy.

Aho is injured, though he appears to be close to returning. St. Ivany is injured. Hollowell is going to the Spengler Cup. The only guys on NHL contracts are Clurman, Kral, and Belliveau. Belliveau isn't remotely close to being ready for the NHL. Kral is all offense. And Joseph is far superior to Clurman.

 

[Turin]

I’m sure the Pens don’t have the pieces but man it would be nice to get Elias Pettersson and reclaim elite C depth.

 

[pistolpete11]

POJ was a RFA and was arb eligible. I would guess that the Pens wanted him back in the $1mil range for 1-2 years but he was eying that $2-2.5mil range for 2 years+. So I think they elected to not qualify him based on that. Then turning attention to FA, I would imagine he got "ERod'd" a little by his agent thinking that there would be a bigger market for him than there was only to settle in STL where his brother was. So I'd be willing to bet it was more POJ pricing himself out of Pittsburgh rather than it being because Sullivan didn't like him. There's just no evidence of that.

Then they gave 31-year-old Matt Grzelcyk $2.75M instead

 

[OtherThingsILike]

I'm finding that with the emergence of Pickering, Grzelcyk is much more tolerable with the reduced minutes he's getting.

Grzelcyk in a Gostisbehere-like role wouldn't be awful.

 

[chethejet]

Dubas was buying time here and Pickering is here earlier than expected. pens at least gave some nice prospects now for the D.

 

[SEALBound]

I'm finding that with the emergence of Pickering, Grzelcyk is much more tolerable with the reduced minutes he's getting.

Grzelcyk in a Gostisbehere-like role wouldn't be awful.

Gryz and Graves on the bottom pair in reduced minutes isn't the worst thing but that's also counter balanced a bit by Letang and Karlsson not being complete and total abominations on ice at the moment. I think where it will get really interesting is when Pettersson is back. I don't think we'll see that many games with him healthy (before being traded) but realistically they could make:

POJ-Letang
Petts-Karlsson
Pickering-Gryz/Graves/Shea

And that would an acceptable defense. Once you trade Petts, Pickering slides up with Karlsson.

 

[Ryder71]

Gryz and Graves on the bottom pair in reduced minutes isn't the worst thing but that's also counter balanced a bit by Letang and Karlsson not being complete and total abominations on ice at the moment. I think where it will get really interesting is when Pettersson is back. I don't think we'll see that many games with him healthy (before being traded) but realistically they could make:

POJ-Letang
Petts-Karlsson
Pickering-Gryz/Graves/Shea

And that would an acceptable defense. Once you trade Petts, Pickering slides up with Karlsson.

I hate to say it, but Graves has been much better than last year. Now, that in and of itself might not be saying much, but there is improvement there if we're being honest.

 

[SEALBound]

I hate to say it, but Graves has been much better than last year. Now, that in and of itself might not be saying much, but there is improvement there if we're being honest.

I'm not going to disagree but I do think there's an aspect of "Graves on the third pairing this year vs Graves on the top pairing with Letang last year" that's helping that perception.

Ultimately, I think he's still underperforming in his "role".

 

[Ryder71]

I'm not going to disagree but I do think there's an aspect of "Graves on the third pairing this year vs Graves on the top pairing with Letang last year" that's helping that perception.

Ultimately, I think he's still underperforming in his "role".

I agree that he needs to be insulated and playing less.

 

[Gurglesons]

Graves hasn't been good. He's just playing 15 minutes a night.

Dude has 0 points and is 37% GF at 5v5.

Which is lowest on the team outside of Letang who everyone knows has been a tire fire.

 

[Turin]

I think Graves has been worse than last year. At least last year he started out somewhat ok the first month ish. He’s just been consistently bad/useless

 

[Peat]

Fwiw, last 10 games, Graves has the 9th best xGF% on the team at 49.56.

 

[chethejet]

Until Sullivan is gone, I really can't judge anyone playing D. Graves can be a solid D man of he is not asked to pinch or join the rush. But next year I do think if the Pens miss the playoffs Sullivan is gone. Pens need to clean house and get fresh eyes and coaching. Until they do that, same old same old.

 

[Gurglesons]

Fwiw, last 10 games, Graves has the 9th best xGF% on the team at 49.56.

Isn't this the issue with Graves throughout his career though? His expected and per 60 stats make him look like he's a sufficient enough player. The eye test and decision making makes it obvious he isn't...

 

[Peat]

Isn't this the issue with Graves throughout his career though? His expected and per 60 stats make him look like he's a sufficient enough player. The eye test and decision making makes it obvious he isn't...

I haven't watched him enough through his career to comment.

This is the first season in his career he's had a positive relative xGF% though, which I don't think I'd ever looked at before and in hindsight screams stay the f*** away. Generally good rate stats, but bad relative.

I can't say I've been watching him super hard out there for us either. But, just statistically, the idea that recently Graves the third pairing guy isn't a killer on ice passes a quick sniff check.

 

[vodeni]

Graves hasn't been good. He's just playing 15 minutes a night.

Dude has 0 points and is 37% GF at 5v5.

Which is lowest on the team outside of Letang who everyone knows has been a tire fire.

Graves and Shea last night was one of the worst performances I witnessed, totally incapable of getting puck out of zone, just got lucky that they did not get scored on multiple times
Now that may have been more due to Shea being total trainwreck, but still and Geno got the honor to have them behind a lot