Proposal: Penguins-Jackets change of scenery trade

[JohnnyJacket13]

We should be looking at the PLD deal as a benchmark for a Laine trade,

PLD has 7 years remaining, so bigger risk than Laine.
Laine has other issues, so that's the bigger risk over PLD.

Jarry > Kemper so an even up trade would fit that mold.

but I can see if Merz is still something CBJ wants to work on, this deal doesn't make sense.

How about:
POJ + Smith -> Laine + 3rd rounder
or something in that ball park.

We’d be better off holding on to Laine

 

[Viqsi]

We should be looking at the PLD deal as a benchmark for a Laine trade,

Not even remotely close. Not even in the same stratosphere. Laine has never come anywhere near the level of damage to a team and locker room PLD has.

 

[Petes2424]

Penguins trade Rakell (4 years at $5 million AAV) and Jarry (4 years at $5.375 million)
Jackets trade Laine (2 years at $8.7 million) and Merzlikins (3 years at $5.4 million)

The idea here is that the Penguins get the winger upgrade while Columbus gets the goalie upgrade. The Penguins take a little bit more money back in terms of AAV, but get out of a few years of term towards the end of the deals.

The hope for both sides is that the Penguins can rebound Laine's value and end up selling him in the next 2 years, while Jarry stabilizes the starting goalie position for the Jackets (at least more than Merzlikins) and Rakell adds some decent middle-6 scoring.

I think it’s a bit funny you’re getting chirped from Columbus fans, who think they’re getting any value for someone who comes with a $621,000 per goal price tag over the last 4 years, with 2 more years at $8.7.

$621,000 per goal over the last 2 years, and if he was making the $8.7 the two prior years, it remains at $621,000 per goal.

Who’s giving up any significant value to take on that project? This isn’t some bump in the road slump. That’s a full contract for many players.

We’re 4 years, going into the 5th year now, where he can’t complete a season, and he’s averaging 14 goals a year. Further concern is, the league is changing and not letting players set up shop anymore. At least not as a default as they did 5 years ago. Dmen are just to quick these days.

No manager is going to give Columbus anything of value to take on 2 more years, of a 4 year slump at $8.7 million.

Managers get fired for making those type of deals. He’s worth very, very little until teams start seeing something ON THE ICE. His 5 game stretch last year just isn’t enough.

 

[Sidgeni Malkby]

Not even remotely close. Not even in the same stratosphere. Laine has never come anywhere near the level of damage to a team and locker room PLD has.

They were traded for each other, so clearly their value can't be that far from each other.

Besides, you are somehow assuming that locker room cancer is somehow a much bigger problem than than drug/mental-health issues. One can be dealt with stronger leadership in the locker room, the other are all about personal demons, which are tougher to excise.

Look at Evander Kane. Apparently was uncoachable.

We’d be better off holding on to Laine

Well yeah, but that's clearly not going to work if he doesn't play for you.
*edit* the further down the hole he goes, the less you get for him. */edit*

 

[3074326]

I think it’s a bit funny you’re getting chirped from Columbus fans, who think they’re getting any value for someone who comes with a $621,000 per goal price tag over the last 4 years, with 2 more years at $8.7.

$621,000 per goal over the last 2 years, and if he was making the $8.7 the two prior years, it remains at $621,000 per goal.

Who’s giving up any significant value to take on that project? This isn’t some bump in the road slump. That’s a full contract for many players.

We’re 4 years, going into the 5th year now, where he can’t complete a season, and he’s averaging 14 goals a year. Further concern is, the league is changing and not letting players set up shop anymore. At least not as a default as they did 5 years ago. Dmen are just to quick these days.

No manager is going to give Columbus anything of value to take on 2 more years, of a 4 year slump at $8.7 million.

Managers get fired for making those type of deals. He’s worth very, very little until teams start seeing something ON THE ICE. His 5 game stretch last year just isn’t enough.

And I think it’s funny that you missed the part where Emp said he understands their perspective.

They don’t want a downgrade on offense + more term. It’s extremely easy to understand. Nobody in here is giving anything of substantial value. Unless you consider overpaid wingers and goalies on mult-year contracts to be “significant value.”

 

[Viqsi]

They were traded for each other, so clearly their value can't be that far from each other.

Poor reasoning. At the time they were traded for eachother, their situations were very different from what they are now. Since then, Laine has both greatly improved when on the ice and run into many health issues actually staying on the ice, and PLD has demonstrated that he had not yet begun to defile himself when he forced the trade.

Besides, you are somehow assuming that locker room cancer is somehow a much bigger problem than than drug/mental-health issues. One can be dealt with stronger leadership in the locker room, the other are all about personal demons, which are tougher to excise.

I frankly think it's the other way around. Strong cameraderie can help one overcome personal demons, but someone who's just doggedly determined to not give a f*** is not going to give any more of a f*** just because the locker room is different.

Also, the contract situations - and the cap situations of the teams involved - are very, overwhelmingly different. The Kings needed the cap space to retain guys and were facing three and a half times as many additional years; the Jackets have plenty of space and so would have no issue coasting with the existing contract and just leaving him LTIRetired if that's what it took.

They really aren't comparable.

 

[domi28]

Also, the contract situations - and the cap situations of the teams involved - are very, overwhelmingly different. The Kings needed the cap space to retain guys and were facing three and a half times as many additional years; the Jackets have plenty of space and so would have no issue coasting with the existing contract and just leaving him LTIRetired if that's what it took.

They really aren't comparable.

Objection, assumes facts not in evidence.

It's just as likely Priest has huge issues paying out whatever insurance may not cover of the very real $18.2m Laine is owed over the next two years if Laine ends up LTIR as it is likely Priest says don't spend assets to move Laine. It's also just as likely Waddell is counting on that cap space to pay out ELC bonuses and shore up the defense as it is assuming he's fine just leaving Laine's cap hit on the books the next two years. LTIR might be great for veteran playoff teams but it causes headaches for teams like the Jackets with a lot of good players on ELC bonus laden contracts.

 

[Viqsi]

Objection, assumes facts not in evidence.

It's just as likely Priest has huge issues paying out whatever insurance may not cover of the very real $18.2m Laine is owed over the next two years if Laine ends up LTIR as it is likely Priest says don't spend assets to move Laine. It's also just as likely Waddell is counting on that cap space to pay out ELC bonuses and shore up the defense as it is assuming he's fine just leaving Laine's cap hit on the books the next two years. LTIR might be great for veteran playoff teams but it causes headaches for teams like the Jackets with a lot of good players on ELC bonus laden contracts.

Cool. Now go back to the actual context in which the comparison is being made against Pierre-Luc Dubois.

 

[Neutrinos]

Jackets <-- Smith, Jarry

Penguins <-- Laine, Merzlikins

 

[Fro]

I think it’s a bit funny you’re getting chirped from Columbus fans, who think they’re getting any value for someone who comes with a $621,000 per goal price tag over the last 4 years, with 2 more years at $8.7.

$621,000 per goal over the last 2 years, and if he was making the $8.7 the two prior years, it remains at $621,000 per goal.

Who’s giving up any significant value to take on that project? This isn’t some bump in the road slump. That’s a full contract for many players.

We’re 4 years, going into the 5th year now, where he can’t complete a season, and he’s averaging 14 goals a year. Further concern is, the league is changing and not letting players set up shop anymore. At least not as a default as they did 5 years ago. Dmen are just to quick these days.

No manager is going to give Columbus anything of value to take on 2 more years, of a 4 year slump at $8.7 million.

Managers get fired for making those type of deals. He’s worth very, very little until teams start seeing something ON THE ICE. His 5 game stretch last year just isn’t enough.

Then why would you trade for him...way to trade neg it

 

[Viqsi]

Then why would you trade for him...way to trade neg it

That poster isn't here to discuss a trade for Laine.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Jackets <-- Smith, Jarry

Penguins <-- Laine, Merzlikins

I think this is a reasonable alternative if Jackets fans are concerned with Rakell's term, but I imagine there may be some pushback in not getting back more assets than just Smith and Jarry.

 

[Gurglesons]

I think this is a reasonable alternative if Jackets fans are concerned with Rakell's term, but I imagine there may be some pushback in not getting back more assets than just Smith and Jarry.

Nope.

 

[Viqsi]

I think this is a reasonable alternative if Jackets fans are concerned with Rakell's term, but I imagine there may be some pushback in not getting back more assets than just Smith and Jarry.

Pretty much, yeah. If there has to be a winger switch Smith is far more palatable than Rakell, but I still think in the end we're better off just running with the contracts we have in that exchange.