Proposal: Penguins-Hurricanes-Stars 3-way trade

[Empoleon8771]

Hurricanes get Karlsson at $7 million
Penguins get Dallas' 2026 2nd, Carolina's 2025 3rd and Badinka
Stars gets Burns

This deal basically breaks down into Burns and Morrow for Karlsson at $7 million followed by Burns for a 2026 2nd. Dallas was apparently not interested in Karlsson or Jones due to the term left on their deals (numerous good RFAs needing to sign this summer and next summer), but Burns gives them a rental replacement for Heiskanen that doesn't have any commitment beyond this year. The Canes upgrade from Burns to Karlsson to make a monster Slavin-Karlsson top pair. The Penguins get some more futures.

Edit: reworked with taking Morrow out and replacing him with a 2025 3rd and Badinka

Click to read more...

 

[Baksfamous112]

Burns is completely washed up so I don’t know why Dallas would want him. Hurricanes doesn’t need Karlsson. They already have Ghost and Nikishin coming in next year.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Burns is completely washed up so I don’t know why Dallas would want him. Hurricanes doesn’t need Karlsson. They already have Ghost and Nikishin coming in next year.

If Burns is completely washed up (he has definitely regressed but I wouldn't call him "washed up"), why wouldn't Carolina need Karlsson? Karlsson is replacing Burns in this setup. Gostisbehere is their 2nd pair LD and Nikishin appears to be their 3rd pair LD going forward.

Nikishin is replacing Orlov when Orlov leaves and this would have Karlsson replacing Burns. Now they could just replace Burns with Morrow, I bet that is their current plan, but that's a lot to ask of a young guy to immediately jump into that kind of role. Even with how good of a partner Slavin is.

 

[All Mod Cons]

I think Dallas and Carolina say no to this.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

Jesus Christ what an absolutely awful proposal for the Canes. Canes would only be interested in EK if he came at a similar cap hit and acquisition cost as Burns. Morrow is off the table entirely in an EK trade. And while Burns is declining and not an ideal option on the 1st pair at this point, he still has value.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Jesus Christ what an absolutely awful proposal for the Canes. Canes would only be interested in EK if he came at a similar cap hit and acquisition cost as Burns. Morrow is off the table entirely in an EK trade. And while Burns is declining and not an ideal option on the 1st pair at this point, he still has value.

I believe that entirely, but where would Morrow even be playing if the Canes got Karlsson? They'd have these D pairs for at least the next 2 years:

Slavin-Karlsson
Gostisbehere-Walker
Nikishin-Chatfield

With Walker and Chatfield both having 15 team NTCs as well. I think the Canes trading Morrow for EK would be extremely uncharacteristic of them, but acquiring EK makes Morrow seem entirely redundant in at least the short term. It's a price I'm skeptical they'd pay for Karlsson but it's also a piece that looks expendable with acquiring Karlsson.

Karlsson's value is likely around a 1st rounder based on the Seth Jones trade. I would imagine that Morrow's value is roughly equal to that.

 

[Bruce Granville]

Stars and Canes get worse…I couldn‘t guess whose fan OP might be…

 

[Empoleon8771]

Stars and Canes get worse…I couldn‘t guess whose fan OP might be…

How exactly do either the Stars or Canes get worse? Burns is an upgrade on Dumba (who Burns would be pushing out of the lineup for Dallas) and Karlsson is an upgrade on Burns.

Feel free to say that Morrow is too much from the Canes but saying the Canes and Stars get worse is pretty laughable.

 

[FerrisRox]

Hurricanes get Karlsson at $7 million
Penguins get Morrow and Dallas' 2026 2nd
Stars gets Burns

This deal basically breaks down into Burns and Morrow for Karlsson at $7 million followed by Burns for a 2026 2nd. Dallas was apparently not interested in Karlsson or Jones due to the term left on their deals (numerous good RFAs needing to sign this summer and next summer), but Burns gives them a rental replacement for Heiskanen that doesn't have any commitment beyond this year. The Canes upgrade from Burns to Karlsson to make a monster Slavin-Karlsson top pair. The Penguins get a top RHD prospect in Morrow to replace Karlsson along with an additional pick.

Why would Dallas want Brent Burns and it what world does Burns replace Heiskanen? That's insane.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Why would Dallas want Brent Burns and it what world does Burns replace Heiskanen? That's insane.

Because their current RD depth is Lyubushkin, Ceci and Dumba, and Dumba is notably terrible.

Burns has regressed from where he once was, but he's still an upgrade on Dallas' RD group because of how bad it is with Heiskanen out.

 

[Baksfamous112]

If Burns is completely washed up (he has definitely regressed but I wouldn't call him "washed up"), why wouldn't Carolina need Karlsson? Karlsson is replacing Burns in this setup. Gostisbehere is their 2nd pair LD and Nikishin appears to be their 3rd pair LD going forward.

Nikishin is replacing Orlov when Orlov leaves and this would have Karlsson replacing Burns. Now they could just replace Burns with Morrow, I bet that is their current plan, but that's a lot to ask of a young guy to immediately jump into that kind of role. Even with how good of a partner Slavin is.

Because they already have Ghostibehere filling that offensive role on the team and they don’t need a 7M 2nd pair RHD who clearly checked out a couple of seasons ago already. There are much better ways to spend the assets/money than on Karlsson.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Because they already have Ghostibehere filling that offensive role on the team and they don’t need a 7M 2nd pair RHD who clearly checked out a couple of seasons ago already. There are much better ways to spend the assets/money than on Karlsson.

But those guys are playing 2 different roles, Karlsson would be a top pair RD and Gostisbehere would be a 2nd pair LD. Those two don't serve the same role, you aren't limited to only having 1 OFD on your team.

They already have a setup of 2 offensive defensemen in those roles with Gostisbehere and Burns, they'd be upgrading on Burns in this case. And even if they don't do that, they'll still have those roles set up because Morrow is another OFD as well.

 

[FerrisRox]

Because their current RD depth is Lyubushkin, Ceci and Dumba, and Dumba is notably terrible.

Burns has regressed from where he once was, but he's still an upgrade on Dallas' RD group because of how bad it is with Heiskanen out.

Upgrading on Dumba is a low bar and they could certainly find a better option than bringing in Brent Burns.

 

[Baksfamous112]

But those guys are playing 2 different roles, Karlsson would be a top pair RD and Gostisbehere would be a 2nd pair LD. Those two don't serve the same role, you aren't limited to only having 1 OFD on your team.

They already have a setup of 2 offensive defensemen in those roles with Gostisbehere and Burns, they'd be upgrading on Burns in this case. And even if they don't do that, they'll still have those roles set up because Morrow is another OFD as well.

Not at the expense of the assets you’re trying to pry out of Carolina and not at the cap hit Karlsson would come at either, especially at his age

 

[Empoleon8771]

Not at the expense of the assets you’re trying to pry out of Carolina and not at the cap hit Karlsson would come at either, especially at his age

They'd be paying a recently drafted 2nd round prospect and a 3rd to upgrade from Burns to Karlsson in this case. Karlsson would be coming at a $7 million AAV in this deal, which is going to be less and less a fraction of the cap as the cap skyrockets.

Upgrading on Dumba is a low bar and they could certainly find a better than option than bringing in Brent Burns.

There aren't any rental RD that could be traded that are better than Burns at this point, even with how much he has regressed. The rental RD group is extremely shallow.

 

[SEALBound]

$7mil for two season of EK is still pretty damn valuable. As we saw in 4 Nations, he's still an offensive force when put with the right players. Carolina immediately gets better replacing Burns with Karlsson.

Another point of order - while I do realize Nikishin is playing in the KHL and Morrow is a quality prospect, I have doubts on whether or not Tulsky opts to replace Orlov-Burns with Nikishin-Morrow. Nikishin has never seen NHL/NA ice and Morrow has 4 NHL games. Not saying they are not capable players but I don't think most serious contenders replace minute-eating vets with two newbies, no matter how good they might be.

I think they would still welcome the opportunity to bring in a minute eating RD like Karlsson. Judging by FA and the trade market, I'm not sure there's a much better fit out there if you can get him from the Penguins at $7mil or so. Bringing him in at that price doesn't affect any present or future plans either.

 

[GhostfaceWu]

That's all you're getting for eating 3 million for the next two seasons.

 

[Chrispy]

I believe that entirely, but where would Morrow even be playing if the Canes got Karlsson? They'd have these D pairs for at least the next 2 years:

Slavin-Karlsson
Gostisbehere-Walker
Nikishin-Chatfield

With Walker and Chatfield both having 15 team NTCs as well. I think the Canes trading Morrow for EK would be extremely uncharacteristic of them, but acquiring EK makes Morrow seem entirely redundant in at least the short term. It's a price I'm skeptical they'd pay for Karlsson but it's also a piece that looks expendable with acquiring Karlsson.

Karlsson's value is likely around a 1st rounder based on the Seth Jones trade. I would imagine that Morrow's value is roughly equal to that.

If Carolina brings in Karlsson in the off-season, it's likely they move one of Chatfield or Walker to then make the right side

Karlsson
Walker/Chatfield
Morrow

If they don't, they may bring in a more defensive RD and run:

defensive RD
Walker/Chatfield
Morrow

Or the third scenario, they have Ghost or Slavin mentor Morrow next year:
Slavin-Morrow/Walker
Nikishin-Chatfield
Ghost-Walker/Morrow

If Morrow is ready, there isn't any reason to use him to bring in Karlsson for a couple of years. Morrow and Nikishin are part of opening the next window.

 

[SEALBound]

Or the third scenario, they have Ghost or Slavin mentor Morrow next year:
Slavin-Morrow/Walker
Nikishin-Chatfield
Ghost-Walker/Morrow

If Morrow is ready, there isn't any reason to use him to bring in Karlsson for a couple of years. Morrow and Nikishin are part of opening the next window.

I'm not disagree with you necessarily, but at the same time, I don't think bringing in EK delays either Nikishin or Morrow. There are 4 sign dmen next season. Add those two, it's 6. Most teams what to have that depth up to 8 or so. Injuries happen.

I don't think the Hurricanes should be in the business of skimping at this point. They need to start putting some playoff wins together instead of worrying about the next corner with the crop of prospects.

 

[Empoleon8771]

If Carolina brings in Karlsson in the off-season, it's likely they move one of Chatfield or Walker to then make the right side

Karlsson
Walker/Chatfield
Morrow

If they don't, they may bring in a more defensive RD and run:

defensive RD
Walker/Chatfield
Morrow

Or the third scenario, they have Ghost or Slavin mentor Morrow next year:
Slavin-Morrow/Walker
Nikishin-Chatfield
Ghost-Walker/Morrow

If Morrow is ready, there isn't any reason to use him to bring in Karlsson for a couple of years. Morrow and Nikishin are part of opening the next window.

Yeah that makes sense, thanks for the clarity. I would question how well Gostisbehere, Nikishin and Morrow would mesh, because my impression was that both Nikishin and Morrow were more OFD and Gostisbehere is established as an OFD. I wouldn't be surprised to see them move Chatfield and just have Nikishin-Morrow as a 3rd pair.

Either way, I figure that 3rd scenario is most likely what Carolina is going to end up doing. Gradually ease Morrow into the NHL and eventually have him as a Burns replacement with Slavin.

 

[WreckingCrew]

I don't think even taking Canes to a Brazilian steakhouse is enough to soften this blow...that's f***ing brutal for the Canes unless it were EK @ 50%, even then...

 

[Empoleon8771]

I don't think even taking Canes to a Brazilian steakhouse is enough to soften this blow...that's f***ing brutal for the Canes even if it were EK @ 50%

I'm absolutely fascinated to hear how Burns, Badinka and a 3rd for Karlsson is "f***ing brutal" for the Hurricanes.

With Morrow? Yeah, I get that reply. But with what Morrow was replaced with? How exactly is that "f***ing brutal"?

 

[SEALBound]

I'm absolutely fascinated to hear how Burns, Badinka and a 3rd for Karlsson is "f***ing brutal" for the Hurricanes.

With Morrow? Yeah, I get that reply. But with what Morrow was replaced with? How exactly is that "f***ing brutal"?

We're talking to a team fanbase with PTSD after the Guentzel trade debacle and the upcoming Rantanen-trade debacle.

 

[WreckingCrew]

I'm absolutely fascinated to hear how Burns, Badinka and a 3rd for Karlsson is "f***ing brutal" for the Hurricanes.

With Morrow? Yeah, I get that reply. But with what Morrow was replaced with? How exactly is that "f***ing brutal"?

Because Canes already got bit in the ass by the last 2 years of an aging Burns contract, no interest in a repeat with EK

 

[Empoleon8771]

Because Canes already got bit in the ass by the last 2 years of an aging Burns contract, no interest in a repeat with EK

Burns was 37 when the Canes acquired him. Karlsson today is 34. Karlsson's deal expires before he even turns 37.

The Canes also got one great year at age 37 and one good year at age 38 out of Burns, so I don't know why you think a 34-36 year old Karlsson would somehow be a problem.