Rumor: Penguins getting calls on Rust, want to clear space to sign Chris Tanev

[belair]

If you're incapable of looking at context when it comes to games lost, you're not discussing honestly.

His "decline" in production from 18-19 to 19-20 is ENTIRELY because of the pandemic. Hornqvist himself did miss his standard 10-15 games due to injury, but he lost out on an additional 13 games because of the NHL season shutting down. Ignoring that is insanely dishonest.

You're right. He did have a better season this year than last. His point still stands though. The market for a 34 year old checking line winger with the mileage he has will be crickets IMO. He's owed over $5m each year until he's 36. If it's true they're listening on Rust to clear cap space, IMO it's because they can't move the other guy.

 

[Empoleon8771]

You're right. He did have a better season this year than last. His point still stands though. The market for a 34 year old checking line winger with the mileage he has will be crickets IMO. He's owed over $5m each year until he's 36. If it's true they're listening on Rust to clear cap space, IMO it's because they can't move the other guy.

I think Hornqvist's NTC will be a substantially larger stumbling block than his age. Hornqvist himself is an incredibly rare type of player and teams have shown to be willing to give out big bucks to players like him, even after they have started to show signs of decline. Wayne Simmonds last off-season is a perfect example of that. JR would not have problems finding that kind of trade for him, because he's still a top-6 forward right now and hasn't shown any signs of decline.

The problem is Hornqvist's NTC, not a lack of interest in Hornqvist. I guarantee there would be a lot of teams interested in Hornqvist, but Hornqvist can kill any deal because he has a full NTC. Teams aren't going to view Hornqvist as a "34 year old checking line winger" because that's not what he is. He's a top-6 winger who's still one of the best net front guys in all of hockey.

 

[Gurglesons]

You're right. He did have a better season this year than last. His point still stands though. The market for a 34 year old checking line winger with the mileage he has will be crickets IMO. He's owed over $5m each year until he's 36. If it's true they're listening on Rust to clear cap space, IMO it's because they can't move the other guy.

Pavelski is obviously the better player, but just got 7 million a year at 35.

Hornqvist would easily have a market. The issue is his trade protection.

Hornqvist isn't likely returning a ton, but he certainly is the type of player that a soon to be contending Buffalo or a team that feels they got out physicaled like Colorado would likely jump on.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Pavelski is obviously the better player, but just got 7 million a year at 35.

Hornqvist would easily have a market. The issue is his trade protection.

Yeah, that's the funny part to me. Since when have GMs ever shied away from giving out big contracts to players at Hornqvist's age? You see that kind of stuff happen literally all of the time. Fans may be more concerned about it, but most GMs haven't shown that kind of restraint. You see GMs giving big contracts with term to players in their low to mid 30s literally all of the time.

Pavelski, Fleury, Kesler, Giordano, Seabrook, Stastny, Zuccarello, Backes, Edler, Eriksson, Boychuk, Oshie, Steen, Ladd, Stralman and Goligoski are all examples of guys who make more than Hornqvist and signed their current deals while in their low to mid 30s.

 

[Jerkbait]

What we're hearing as Penguins trade talks heat up

For anyone who doesn't know, the Penguins do have Brandon Tanev already, who is the brother of Chris. I don't know that many players have made a big deal out of playing with their siblings before (I know Jordan Staal did), but that may be an advantage the Penguins have.

This isn't new. We knew the pens had interest in tanev a while ago. He fits the bill. The error here is its not Rust......he is gonna stay as they are happy with the top 6. Murray will go, Hornqvist if he waives and ZAR, maybe Simon.... in will be MAF, a third line C and another D

 

[Richard88]

While this may be the case, wasn’t it rumored that Sakic thinks next year is an “all in” year? If that’s true, would probably be the right time to move the 24th OA pick for win now help.

Rust does a lot more than score too. He plays with a ton of energy and grit, can also PK very well. Him and Kadri would form a very frustrating line to play against

Elliott Friedman is the one who said Avs would be "all in" this year, but he was just speculating because he doesn't really have connections to Colorado since the organisation is very tight-lipped in general whether it is about injuries, trades, or contracts.

Sakic's M.O. is to be patient and wait for good deals, and he tends to use non-prime assets in trades (eg. 2nd + 3rd for Burakovsky), and also looks to get value by weaponising capspace (eg. 2nd + Orpik buyout for Grubauer, or retaining 50% on Barrie). I'd be surprised if he moved #24 in what is very much a buyers market, unless it's in a package deal for an elite and/or young player.

Is he NHL ready though? I don’t know much about him but his AHL stats are quite unimpressive.

And he plays RW right? Which we really don’t need. So if we get the 1st we can draft a different position that we do need like center

Kaut got a 9 game call up in March and looked very good. I know it'll probably get sneered at, but Kaut is very much a player who plays better with better players, especially in a system. The AHL is very individualistic rather than systems/team oriented which hurt his production. Also note that most of his points were primary points. For an example of his skill watch some tape of him from the WJC on a line with Zadina and Necas, he was great with them.

RW is his primary position, but he's also played C on the PP, and can also play LW though RW is much more common.

The rebuild? lol.

In two seasons we still have Crosby, Guentzel, Zucker, Marino, Pettersson, Dumoulin, and like Jarry all under contract. That is a fine team even if Malkin or Letang decide to walk. Which is highly doubtful.

Kaut + 1st for Rust would be a decent enough deal.

Malkin and Crosby aren't getting any younger, and the last two postseasons (where Pittsburgh has been swept by NYI and bumped out by Montreal for like 1 win in their last 10 playoff games) don't bode well.

 

[Gurglesons]

Elliott Friedman is the one who said Avs would be "all in" this year, but he was just speculating because he doesn't really have connections to Colorado since the organisation is very tight-lipped in general whether it is about injuries, trades, or contracts.

Sakic's M.O. is to be patient and wait for good deals, and he tends to use non-prime assets in trades (eg. 2nd + 3rd for Burakovsky), and also looks to get value by weaponising capspace (eg. 2nd + Orpik buyout for Grubauer, or retaining 50% on Barrie). I'd be surprised if he moved #24 in what is very much a buyers market, unless it's in a package deal for an elite and/or young player.



Kaut got a 9 game call up in March and looked very good. I know it'll probably get sneered at, but Kaut is very much a player who plays better with better players, especially in a system. The AHL is very individualistic rather than systems/team oriented which hurt his production. Also note that most of his points were primary points. For an example of his skill watch some tape of him from the WJC on a line with Zadina and Necas, he was great with them.

RW is his primary position, but he's also played C on the PP, and can also play LW though RW is much more common.


Malkin and Crosby aren't getting any younger, and the last two postseasons (where Pittsburgh has been swept by NYI and bumped out by Montreal for like 1 win in their last 10 playoff games) don't bode well.

Malkin this year put up the same PPG to "prime monster' MacKinnon with Crosby being in the Eichel PPG range. Last year Crosby put up a higher PPG to MacKinnon.

If Colorado can win a cup with MacKinnon being their main weapon. PIT will be just fine with an aging Sid and Geno being their main weapons especially when you look at their depth pieces..

Figure a COL fan would remember what Sakic and Forsberg did into their mid 30s and early 40s....

 

[Richard88]

Malkin this year put up the same PPG to "prime monster' MacKinnon with Crosby being in the Eichel PPG range. Last year Crosby put up a higher PPG to MacKinnon.

If Colorado can win a cup with MacKinnon being their main weapon. PIT will be just fine with an aging Sid and Geno being their main weapons especially when you look at their depth pieces..

Figure a COL fan would remember what Sakic and Forsberg did into their mid 30s and early 40s....

Maybe 2 years was a bit harsh, but my point was that Pittsburgh need to go all-in the next few years while Crosby and Malkin are still capable of producing at PPG level. That's why Rutherford paid a steep price for Zucker and Kapanen.

 

[Gurglesons]

Maybe 2 years was a bit harsh, but my point was that Pittsburgh need to go all-in the next few years while Crosby and Malkin are still capable of producing at PPG level. That's why Rutherford paid a steep price for Zucker and Kapanen.

Steep? Not really..?

The Kapanen price is a little overwhelming, but I wouldn't call it "steep". 24 year old on a cost controlled deal for the next two years that also helps save the franchise real dollars for a mid round 1st and a bottom six prospect (who would definitely not even be a top five prospect in most team's pools) isn't crazy.

Zucker cost a 1st and Addison while dumping Galchenyuk. Fair deal for his contract as well.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

If Rust isn’t getting PP1 time like he did when Guentzel was out we’ll see his numbers regress. I think it’s smart to sell high if you’re filling a need elsewhere. Rutherford probably sees Kapanen filling the 2RW hole which makes Rust somewhat expendable.

Thing is Rust isn't paid very much. So even if he "regresses" he's still making a pretty bargain contract. That's not something you want to move, especially for a cap-ceiling team in this COVID environment of cap space being such a rare value.

That's the primary reason I don't want to see Rust moved. You're getting a guy who looks like he could score 20+ goals and 50-ish points all while making less than $4 million per year. For a team right against the cap, how are you replacing that production at that cap hit?

 

[Drew311]

Thing is Rust isn't paid very much. So even if he "regresses" he's still making a pretty bargain contract. That's not something you want to move, especially for a cap-ceiling team in this COVID environment of cap space being such a rare value.

That's the primary reason I don't want to see Rust moved. You're getting a guy who looks like he could score 20+ goals and 50-ish points all while making less than $4 million per year. For a team right against the cap, how are you replacing that production at that cap hit?

A prospect that Rutherford and his scouts think is NHL ready and can put this kind of production up on an ELC. That’s the beauty of having elite centers. They can elevate the play of even average wingers.

 

[Hockeyholic]

Pittsburgh would be crazy to do this. But they probably will do it with Rutherford in charge. Overpay for a guy that misses half the season.

 

[themelkman]

Rust for LaBlanc and a pick makes a whole lotta sense.

PIT wouldn't be forced into giving LaBlanc the promised asset and San Jose gets the better player.

Uh no thank you. We need an additional RW, not to replace our young cheap one with an older expensive one. You guys got Kapanen for that. I like Rust but paying heavy for one year of production is a massive mistake

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

A prospect that Rutherford and his scouts think is NHL ready and can put this kind of production up on an ELC. That’s the beauty of having elite centers. They can elevate the play of even average wingers.

They're 33 and 34 years old, respectively. Their days of turning 20-point wingers into 50-point wingers are dwindling and I'd rather management not force them into having to do that.

Plus, you're not getting an ELC player who can produce roughly 20 goals and roughly 45 points in a trade. Guys who produce like that on their ELC are guys with elite upside and won't be dealt by their current teams. Pens aren't getting Gurionov, for example, for Rust.

 

[Gurglesons]

Uh no thank you. We need an additional RW, not to replace our young cheap one with an older expensive one. You guys got Kapanen for that. I like Rust but paying heavy for one year of production is a massive mistake

I don't see what the Sharks could trade the Pens realistically then.

 

[Toby Flenderson]

Rust and Murray to the sharks for Labanc and Tampa 1st

Assuming they can get out of the Jones contract. Maybe Detroit would take him for the interim years before they are actually competing

 

[Breakers]

Sang Tanev’s praises for years about how elite he was defensively, like truly top 3 in his own zone.
but those years are gone with him.

 

[JoeThorntonsRooster]

Uh no thank you. We need an additional RW, not to replace our young cheap one with an older expensive one. You guys got Kapanen for that. I like Rust but paying heavy for one year of production is a massive mistake

Labanc is probably going to be making more money on his next contract than Rust.

 

[Gurglesons]

Labanc is probably going to be making more money on his next contract than Rust.

I think that is true in San Jose, but I feel like PIT could probably get him on a 3 million dollar contract.

 

[JoeThorntonsRooster]

I think that is true in San Jose, but I feel like PIT could probably get him on a 3 million dollar contract.

You mean the same PIT team that just gave that same contract to Jared McCann?

 

[themelkman]

Rust and Murray to the sharks for Labanc and Tampa 1st

Assuming they can get out of the Jones contract. Maybe Detroit would take him for the interim years before they are actually competing

zero chance of that deal, but if it did it would have to be Jarry not Murray

 

[themelkman]

Labanc is probably going to be making more money on his next contract than Rust.

Thats fair, I thought Rust was making like 4.5, but I would assume Labanc makes about the same at 3.5. I still dont do that deal because honestly I dont think Rust is really that much better and he is older. I dont really think Rust should be getting traded for more than a late first, but if some team makes that mistake good on the pens

 

[Gurglesons]

You mean the same PIT team that just gave that same contract to Jared McCann?

Jared McCann plays center and yes. I think a 25ish pt ES scorer is worth around 3 mil if he wants to play hard ball with a franchise that didn't promise him something else after what's looking like a career year.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The only way I'd trade Rust is if you're getting back an ELC or cheap top-9 forward with top-6 potential for him. If you can't get someone like Beauvillier back for Rust, don't trade Rust. I have absolutely no clue what similar players to Beauvillier that teams can offer for Rust, but that's the centerpiece I'd want in a Rust trade. If the Penguins wouldn't be able to get that, I wouldn't move him.

 

[RSPens]

He has an 8 team not trade list and I could see the devils being on it.

His 8 team NTC kicks in next year. Currently he doesn't have to waive for anyone. Thus it is very difficult to trade him.