Pavel Bure 'skate to stick' move

[Man Bear Pig]

I've never really understood the skate to stick move. It isn't flashy or that effective. The reason, IMO, that he fooled goalies with it was because he was so fast that the goalie doesn't have time to react no matter what he does. An average skater would look foolish trying to pull that off.

 

[arrbez]

First player I ever saw with "modern" hands, for lack of a better term.

Watch a video from the 80's or early 90's and everyone somehow looks like a beer leaguer when they take a shot or stickhandle. Bure from 1992 skated, stickhandled, and shot just like players do today.

 

[Pav96]

Faster than McDavid.

Umm......NO

 

[W75]

God how fast was he?

He was so fast that leading physicists asked him to slow down. Because he made Einstein look bad. That's how fast he was.

 

[bombers15]

Is JetsAlternate actually Pavel Bure?

 

[Ozz]

Watching stuff like this brings back so many memories, also makes me sad that so many other highlights weren't/aren't available. Any time I could catch him playing as a kid was a treat; I remember actually reading the daily papers to follow him along in the scoring race He was the only one I could say was my favorite player aside from Mario.

I've never really understood the skate to stick move. It isn't flashy or that effective. The reason, IMO, that he fooled goalies with it was because he was so fast that the goalie doesn't have time to react no matter what he does. An average skater would look foolish trying to pull that off.

We're not talking about it all these years later for nothing, though. It wasn't the most ridiculously over the top move ever to grace the ice, but it was slick as hell, especially at that speed. When he dropped the puck back, the goalie thought he had him and got completely frozen.

Is JetsAlternate actually Pavel Bure?

I hope so, I'd like to say hi.

 

[djdub]

Is JetsAlternate actually Pavel Bure?

Might just be.

Actually, he seems to have made it his mission to discredit any McDavid love in any thread. He might have a case here though, I'm pretty sure Bure has McDavid in the skating department and you could make a case for much more than that. For me, Bure is one of the top 10 players to ever play the game.

Any Oiler fan should be happy that when McDavid is compared to Bure, the idea isn't completely laughed away.

 

[chis]

Can't agree more djdub. I'm sure McDavid would feel very honoured to be compared to the great Bure.

 

[LaP]

In a lot of these examples players he is comparing aren't even skating in straight lines,

Straight line skating without the puck is not worth all that much anyway. Not in a real game. Rarely you'll have a clear straight line path to the net with the puck waiting for you a couple of meters in front of the net.

Pavel Bure speed was nothing to write home about in a straight line without the puck if you compare him to the best skaters in the history of the game. He was fast. But many other players were to.

What sets Bure apart from most of those other fast players is his speed with the puck deking around players while carrying Marc Tinordi or Derian Hatcher on his back (cause yeah back then holding was perfectly legal). Guy had very strong legs.

 

[TeamRenzo]

Chris Neil did something similar in a shoot out attempt a few weeks ago in his 1000th game celebration...he didnt score.

 

[CrazyDuck4u]

Guys lets not forget, Back in the days when bure and Federov were still playing, The skates were heavier than they are now. The skates the players use now are much lighter. That could impact the acceleration and top speed of a player.

 

[authentic]

Straight line skating without the puck is not worth all that much anyway. Not in a real game. Rarely you'll have a clear straight line path to the net with the puck waiting for you a couple of meters in front of the net.

Pavel Bure speed was nothing to write home about in a straight line without the puck if you compare him to the best skaters in the history of the game. He was fast. But many other players were to.

What sets Bure apart from most of those other fast players is his speed with the puck deking around players while carrying Marc Tinordi or Derian Hatcher on his back (cause yeah back then holding was perfectly legal). Guy had very strong legs.

Of course, so then it makes no sense to be judging players skating from blue line to blue line if they all aren't skating in straight lines or otherwise. Pavel Bure's speed was amazing actually, he just wasn't the fastest skater of all time as some try to paint him. Bure and McDavid are also both extremely agile and their acceleration is about as good as it gets, and the fact they can handle the puck at the speeds they do as well as most can standing still is what makes them special. McDavid I still would bet is atleast a slightly faster skater than Bure ever was, and better overall. Obviously he has the technological advantage but it is what it is.

 

[JA]

Might just be.

Actually, he seems to have made it his mission to discredit any McDavid love in any thread. He might have a case here though, I'm pretty sure Bure has McDavid in the skating department and you could make a case for much more than that. For me, Bure is one of the top 10 players to ever play the game.

Any Oiler fan should be happy that when McDavid is compared to Bure, the idea isn't completely laughed away.

If I was Pavel Bure, you might have already seen a comeback attempt.

I have only challenged two common claims made about McDavid: that he is a "generational" player, and that he is the fastest skater in the NHL. Both of these claims are based on hearsay.

I have always stated that McDavid would not be as dominant at the NHL level as so many people prior to 2015-16 stated he would be. I said that he would be a top-level player, but would never enter his own tier as Sidney Crosby has done.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/mcdavid-prepared-for-hype-as-the-latest-next-one/

McDavid prepared for hype as latest ‘Next One’
Canadian Press October 15, 2014, 12:11 PM

...

McDavid doesn't remember the first time someone compared him to Crosby. Eleven months after Sportsnet Magazine's cover showed him with the headline, "Better than Crosby," the 17-year-old still thinks it was "pretty insane."

"It's obviously a tremendous honour to be named in the same breath with someone like that," McDavid said. "But by no means do I think I'm deserving."

Scouts disagree. In revealing the International Scouting Service pre-season rankings, director Dennis MacInnins said: "Having the chance to scout Sidney Crosby at the same age, McDavid is even more impressive, true superstar potential."

McKee sees the same things. He played with Crosby on the 2009-10 Pittsburgh Penguins and that was when the pride of Cole Harbour, N.S., was already grown up at 22 and in the middle of a run that included a Stanley Cup and Olympic gold medal.

...

"You can just learn so many little things from him on the ice that's so special," said Strome, whose older brother Ryan plays for the New York Islanders "He's such a world-class player that every time he does something on the ice, you can learn from it."

Lauded for his vision, McDavid isn't quite sure where it came from or how it developed. Shrugging but smiling, he said: "I guess I'm an OK passer."

That's kind of like LeBron James saying he's an OK basketball player. Take it from Brown, who enjoyed a 45-goal, 128-point season alongside McDavid: along with speed and creativity, passing is what makes him great.

"If he sees a guy's open, it's going to get there no matter how many sticks are in the way or who's in between it," said Brown

...

Upon looking back at some of these articles, it appears that some of my observations about his game are issues of translation that he is aware of as well:

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/mcdavid-prepared-for-hype-as-the-latest-next-one/

McDavid prepared for hype as latest ‘Next One’
Canadian Press October 15, 2014, 12:11 PM

...

"To play in the NHL, you have to be a full 200-foot player, you have to be able to score from the outside and do all that stuff," McDavid said. "Those are two areas that I'm not particularly good at. I think I need to be better in my own zone and I need to be able to score more from the outside."

...

https://www.nhl.com/news/connor-mcdavid-jack-eichel-comparison/c-279787684

Comparing McDavid, Eichel in six categories
NHL.com rates top rookies in shot, hockey IQ and more with help of Kevin Weekes
by Mike G. Morreale @mikemorrealeNHL / NHL.com Staff Writer
March 22nd, 2016

...

In an interview with NHL Live earlier this season, McDavid admitted to one obvious difference between junior hockey and the League.

"I think one of the biggest things is that no one really makes mistakes; everyone is always in the right position," McDavid said. "There's never any turnovers to make a quick attack, so I think some of those mistakes you normally would take advantage of in juniors just haven't been there at this level."

...

On the topic of his skating ability, people have made the claim that he is the fastest skater without any definitive evidence. Nobody who claims this has measured his speed; the claim is made from a hunch based on a visual observation.

McDavid is not the fastest player in the NHL. Anyone who believes that he is should provide footage.

Of course, so then it makes no sense to be judging players skating from blue line to blue line if they all aren't skating in straight lines or otherwise. Pavel Bure's speed was amazing actually, he just wasn't the fastest skater of all time as some try to paint him. Bure and McDavid are also both extremely agile and their acceleration is about as good as it gets, and the fact they can handle the puck at the speeds they do as well as most can standing still is what makes them special. McDavid I still would bet is atleast a slightly faster skater than Bure ever was, and better overall. Obviously he has the technological advantage but it is what it is.

Please stop trying to make this claim without any proof to support it. When you can not definitively answer the question and need to preface your statement with clauses such as "I would bet," it means that you are not certain. Offer proof before you make such claims.

I also did not make the claim that "Pavel Bure is the fastest skater of all time." Miles Wood might be faster. Bure had contemporaries who might have been faster -- maybe even his own teammate for two seasons, Russ Courtnall (I have not measured this).

Bure was certainly faster than McDavid is, though.

 

[sr edler]

One of my favorite Bure goals.

 

[gqmixmaster]

I've never really understood the skate to stick move. It isn't flashy or that effective. The reason, IMO, that he fooled goalies with it was because he was so fast that the goalie doesn't have time to react no matter what he does. An average skater would look foolish trying to pull that off.

Its good because the player can create reach for themselves by temporarily bringing their stick to their feet and kicking it forward to an extended stick effectively varying the shooting angle quickly and screwing up the goalie's own angles.

 

[authentic]

If I was Pavel Bure, you might have already seen a comeback attempt.

I have only challenged two common claims made about McDavid: that he is a "generational" player, and that he is the fastest skater in the NHL. Both of these claims are based on hearsay.

I have always stated that McDavid would not be as dominant at the NHL level as so many people prior to 2015-16 stated he would be. I said that he would be a top-level player, but would never enter his own tier as Sidney Crosby has done.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/mcdavid-prepared-for-hype-as-the-latest-next-one/

Upon looking back at some of these articles, it appears that some of my observations about his game are weaknesses that he is aware of as well:

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/mcdavid-prepared-for-hype-as-the-latest-next-one/

https://www.nhl.com/news/connor-mcdavid-jack-eichel-comparison/c-279787684

On the topic of his skating ability, people have made the claim that he is the fastest skater without any definitive evidence. Nobody who claims this has measured his speed; the claim is made from a hunch based on a visual observation.

McDavid is not the fastest player in the NHL. Anyone who believes that he is should provide footage.

Please stop trying to make this claim without any proof to support it. When you can not definitively answer the question and need to preface your statement with clauses such as "I would bet," it means that you are not certain. Offer proof before you make such claims.

I also did not make the claim that "Pavel Bure is the fastest skater of all time." Miles Wood might be faster. Bure had contemporaries who might have been faster -- maybe even his own teammate for two seasons, Russ Courtnall (I have not measured this).

Bure was certainly faster than McDavid is, though.

Sorry, but where exactly is your "proof" by the way? That video is not actual proof believe it or not. Also Miles Wood is absolutely faster than Bure was.

Also, McDavid is and has been leading the NHL in points for a majority of his second season... on a horrible team, so not sure what you're on about there.

 

[djdub]

Sorry, but where exactly is your "proof" by the way? That video is not actual proof believe it or not. Also Miles Wood is absolutely faster than Bure was.

Also, McDavid is and has been leading the NHL in points for a majority of his second season... on a horrible team, so not sure what you're on about there.

Your words don't hold much weight if you bash a guy for bringing some evidence to an argument, say his evidence is not "proof" and then go on to make a claim yourself without any evidence at all.

 

[fighterfoo]

IIRC that was also a pre-season game. Much easier to try stuff like that when the result doesn't matter.

It would have been very rare that Boston would have traveled all the way to Vancouver for a pre-season game.

 

[authentic]

Your words don't hold much weight if you bash a guy for bringing some evidence to an argument, say his evidence is not "proof" and then go on to make a claim yourself without any evidence at all.

He said I need proof, I really don't though, and what he has provided is not proof. Go make a poll right now I bet a majority of fans don't believe Bure was faster, because he wasn't. He moves his feet very quick and has a distinct skating stride with the way he uses his edges making it appear like he's sprinting on skates but it's easy for me to tell in game situations he's not covering ground as fast as McDavid when they are both in full gear, I've watched them each play upwards of 50 games in real time. I don't care to try to prove something I can see with my own eyes anyway. Even if some actual proof was provided that showed Bure to be faster (not sure this is possible) I would gladly accept that I'm wrong.

 

[McRpro]

It would have been very rare that Boston would have traveled all the way to Vancouver for a pre-season game.

Ya probably very rare. But it was a pre-season game.

 

[PM]

The insecurity about McDavid not being the fastest guy ever is almost as fascinating as the goal this thread is supposed to be about.

 

[StrictlyCommercial]

He said I need proof, I really don't though, and what he has provided is not proof. Go make a poll right now I bet a majority of fans don't believe Bure was faster, because he wasn't. He moves his feet very quick and has a distinct skating stride with the way he uses his edges making it appear like he's sprinting on skates but it's easy for me to tell in game situations he's not covering ground as fast as McDavid when they are both in full gear, I've watched them each play upwards of 50 games in real time. I don't care to try to prove something I can see with my own eyes anyway. Even if some actual proof was provided that showed Bure to be faster (not sure this is possible) I would gladly accept that I'm wrong.

He like just did that. There's a reason we refer to McDavid as 'Bure-fast'. Not sure why you seem to think that Bure is definitively slower. It's like you think it's a bad thing that McDavid is in the conversation as one of the fastest players ever, instead of everyone coronating him immediately.

 

[authentic]

He like just did that. There's a reason we refer to McDavid as 'Bure-fast'. Not sure why you seem to think that Bure is definitively slower. It's like you think it's a bad thing that McDavid is in the conversation as one of the fastest players ever, instead of everyone coronating him immediately.

It was an attempt of proof. Unfortunately those videos don't prove a thing due to a variety of factors already stated. I don't think it's a bad thing, I just think it's blatantly false. Just like the threads he constantly posted propping Bure up to players like Ovechkin's level and making Forsberg out to be some myth of a player who wasn't nearly as good as he seemed, or bring down McDavid currently. He has a clear agenda.

 

[JA]

It would have been very rare that Boston would have traveled all the way to Vancouver for a pre-season game.

It was a preseason game.

In fact, it was Bure's second game in nearly 11 months. He suffered his infamous knee injury on November 9, 1995 and missed the remainder of the 1995-96 NHL season.

This game was his second game back from the injury, and his first home game.

Artistic licence: Bure dazzles as Canucks bore into Bruins: [Final C Edition]
Bell, Terry. The Province [Vancouver, B.C] 26 Sep 1996: A66.

...

But no tour of this exhibition would be complete without scrutiny of a work of creative beauty by an artist of rare talent, Pavel Bure. The crew of the space shuttle Columbia were in the house Wednesday, but it was a Russian Rocket firing on all cylinders.

With Jyrki Lumme in the penalty box, Bure gave the Canucks a 1-0 lead 8:45 into the first period scoring his second goal of the preseason. The goal shot down any doubts that he's back.

Picking up the puck in the neutral zone after Bruins defenceman Ray Bourque couldn't keep it inside the blueline, Bure raced down the right side, swept in on goalie Scott Bailey, banked it off his own skate before shooting it into the net.

"Well, I kicked it in with my right leg," joked Bure when asked if he had regained his speed after last November's season-ending operation on his right knee.

"We just laughed," said Trevor Linden, when asked about the bench's reaction to the tally. "It was beautiful. I've always said he's the most exciting player in the league. He'll be doing that a lot this year."

...

Rocket blast downs Bruins: Pavel Bure powers Canucks in a game that Vancouver almost blows by allowing two third-period Boston goals.: [FINAL C Edition]
MacIntyre, Iain. The Vancouver Sun [Vancouver, B.C] 26 Sep 1996: F.1.

Although he claims nothing matters until the regular season, the dash of magic offered Wednesday by Pavel Bure meant a lot to the Vancouver Canucks and a crowd of 14,389 at GM Place.

In what may be regarded as the Russian Rocket's unofficial point of return from injury, Bure livened a National Hockey League pre-season victory over the Boston Bruins that otherwise was about as exciting as a day-long seminar on grout.

Showing the skill and bravado fans badly missed last season when Bure's knee was blown out in November, the superstar right winger started the 5-3 triumph with a stunning breakaway goal at 8:45 of the first period, pulled the puck into his skates before kicking the disc back up to his stick and swept it in.

...

The scoreboard replay of Bure's goal drew gasps and cheers from the crowd. Later, Bure received a partial standing ovation after dominating a shift, twice getting up from the ice to weave through Bruins like a Porsche through pylons.

"Pavel turned it on tonight," Canuck Gino Odjick said. "He proved to himself and everybody else he's still got it."

...

Bure goal kick-starts a season of excitement: [Final Edition]
Stall, Bob. The Province [Vancouver, B.C] 27 Sep 1996: A10.

Down by the barn Wednesday night, I realized that for most of a year I've been missing Pavel Bure. Bure's first goal in 11 months at GM Place Wednesday was so dazzling that the Canucks' play-by- play announcer was too stunned to mention that he scored.

Jim Hughson told me and his CKNW radio audience that Bure had pounced on a puck at the Boston Bruins' blue line, that he had a breakaway, that he was cutting in on the net . . . and then, over the roar of the crowd, Hughson yelled: "WHAT A PLAY!!!"

I slapped the little Radio Shack radio in my shirt pocket.

"What?" I said.

"Oh, baby!" said Hughson's color commentator, Tom Larscheid.

"What happened?" I asked. Milton the horse shrugged.

...

Hughson did not shrug like Milton. No neigh-sayer, he yipped, blurted, hollered and whooped.

He babbled about what Pavel Bure had just done and somewhere in there he eventually said, "He scored," which was good to know but, I guess, incidental to how Bure had done it.

"Oh, baby!" said Larscheid again while the crowd roared as loud as the first time -- this time in appreciation of the replay on the giant screen in the arena.

"I didn't know you could do that in hockey," Hughson said.

"What? What?" I asked.

He explained that Bure, in full flight around goalie Scott Bailey, had passed the puck from his stick to his skate, kicked it back to his stick and flipped it past the mesmerized Bailey.

Later that night I tried but failed to stay awake for Sports Page, SportsDesk and everywhere else you can see highlights after 11 p.m. But yesterday morning I made it up in time for the 5 a.m. re- broadcast of TSN's Sportsdesk. Bure's goal was shown once at the beginning of the half-hour show, twice in the middle and three times at the end. The host said it wasn't just the highlight of the night, but probably the hockey highlight of the year and maybe the decade.

Canada AM's sportsperson said that, although it is now just the pre-season, Bure's goal will undoubtedly stand up as the prettiest anyone will score this season. Don't be so sure. We infected Bure fans know that he will do lots more stuff like that this season, just as we realize how much he was missed during the year he was injured and out.

Yesterday was the first time in two years I got up to see a sportscast at 5 a.m. Last year there was no point.

...

Bure an artist with the ice his canvas: [FINAL Edition]
McDonald, Archie. The Vancouver Sun [Vancouver, B.C] 27 Sep 1996: F.1.

The creative artist in Pavel Bure has a vision. He has the puck behind the opposition net late in an important game. In the bumper car traffic of forwards and defencemen he sees a chance to do something that no one else has done.

He flips the puck over the head of the goalie and darts around to receive his own pass. In one motion he sweeps the puck into the net.

"It is my dream to score a goal like that," says Bure. "I practise it a lot."

He almost got the image on to the canvas against Toronto in the second game of the Stanley Cup semi-final in 1994. He lobbed the puck over Felix Potvin and then raced around to accept his own feed. He did not get a good shot away. But someday he will. It's a promise.

The talk of what Bure might do for an encore came up after he had unveiled an original work of art in the first period against Boston Bruins Wednesday night. Going at top speed on a breakaway, leaving all-star defenceman Ray Bourque in his jet stream, he pushed the puck from his stick to his right skate and back on to his stick and into the net.

His teammates were the least surprised people in GM Place. They had seen him do it in practice, but it took the scoreboard replay to reveal just how exquisite it was.

Bure is back at his dazzling best and may be pointed towards his greatest season. That's saying a lot considering that he had back-to-back 60-goal seasons and then scored 16 goals in helping the Canucks into the 1994 Stanley Cup final.

...

Sitting on the sidelines last year he had an opportunity to work on other parts of his life. People close to him said he was bright and had a great sense of humor. He's now letting the rest of the world in on his secret. At 25 he's grown up.

He is nattily attired in a sincere blue suit and light-blue tie as he comes to face the cameras and tape recorders to talk about THE goal. He is obviously delighted with his creation.

"I like to play exciting," he says. "I try to create some moves in practice and use them during a game."

...

Across the room captain Trevor Linden underlines the value of having Bure back. "I have said for a long time he is the most exciting player in hockey."

Given all the right circumstances he might even prove he is the best player, period. As the Wayne Gretzky, Mark Messier, Mario Lemieux era fades away there is opportunity for a new generation to come to the fore. Eric Lindros is the obvious candidate to become the touchstone of the game but his chances may be compromised by injuries. Bure compares favorably with the likes of Joe Sakic, Peter Forsberg, Jaromir Jagr, Paul Kariya and Teemu Selanne and is more genuine than fellow Russians Sergei Fedorov and Mogilny.

...

 

[JA]

It was an attempt of proof. Unfortunately those videos don't prove a thing due to a variety of factors already stated. I don't think it's a bad thing, I just think it's blatantly false. Just like the threads he constantly posted propping Bure up to players like Ovechkin's level and making Forsberg out to be some myth of a player who wasn't nearly as good as he seemed, or bring down McDavid currently. He has a clear agenda.

Stop this madness. You can't blind yourself to someone's proof and then accuse them of an agenda when I have asked you to provide some evidence of your claim and you refuse to do so.

I have based my claim on evidence. You have based your claim on nothing. I have asked you on numerous occasions here to provide EVIDENCE of your claim.

I have offered a clip of Bure skating at a particular speed over a 57 ft distance. All you need to do is show that McDavid has skated faster than that. If you can not, then you have no argument.