Player Discussion Patrik Laine: Part 2 - Healthy Living Edition

[Calendal]

Just going to put this out here with no proof whatsoever.. I think Laine now has a really genuine smile at every single goal celebration (his or someone else's), something I think he's largely missed since leaving Finland.

I don't generally expect or advocate for players to take a discount, but if this keeps up his next contract should be with Montreal and should be with a no move clause and with a decent "discount".

 

[japhi27returns]

Because of all the problems around him and his contract. Which other top player is having the same kind of problems and is being paid 8 millions a year?

Those problems you mentioned were around his ability to stay in the lineup. Which exist today, he is going to play 3/5’s of the games this year, MAYBE, and fans want to re-up him to similar terms that made him a negative asset when we acquired him.

8x10 talk is ludicrous, he plays 50 games a season. And until that changes - and it doesn’t this year - he remains an incredibly flawed asset.

That’s my point on this thread, absolutely love that we have him and hope like hell he puts us in a position where we have to resign him, but that decision point is at least 120 games of healthy hockey away.

How many of you would bet 10k at 1:1 odds that he plays 90% of our games going forward? I bet vegas would have that at 10:1 and I still wouldn’t take that bet.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Just going to put this out here with no proof whatsoever.. I think Laine now has a really genuine smile at every single goal celebration (his or someone else's), something I think he's largely missed since leaving Finland.

I don't generally expect or advocate for players to take a discount, but if this keeps up his next contract should be with Montreal and should be with a no move clause and with a decent "discount".

I could be wrong but I think Laine is after the best contract but team fit formula. I don't think he leaves Montreal if we offer something respectful. Best contract he can get is something around Suzuki or under and this keeps the pressure off of him. He can enjoy the hockey while he puts up 30+ goals and is not on an island by himself with talent.

The opportunity to play with Demidov has to be tantalizing.

 

[Habssince89]

I could be wrong but I think Laine is after the best contract but team fit formula. I don't think he leaves Montreal if we offer something respectful. Best contract he can get is something around Suzuki or under and this keeps the pressure off of him. He can enjoy the hockey while he puts up 30+ goals and is not on an island by himself with talent.

The opportunity to play with Demidov has to be tantalizing.

He clearly is prioritizing legacy and good seasons over a bigger payday. He'll get plenty of money in MTL

 

[Habs Halifax]

He clearly is prioritizing legacy and good seasons over a bigger payday. He'll get plenty of money in MTL

I always liked players who leave a little on the table for their team so they can win. At the end of the day, your family is set for life and 50% of the revenue goes to the players. I don't like greedy players. Leafs might not win a cup because their core is greedy.

In the salary cap era, it's very important that when you rebuild, you build a culture of unselfish players. IMO, this is one of the reasons why we passed on Michkov. Self centered type.

I was always a huge fan of Laine and even a bigger fan now that he really did want to come to Montreal. He wasn't afraid of our pressure and he wanted to join a positive culture with a team that has potential.

 

[Bruce Granville]

He clearly is prioritizing legacy and good seasons over a bigger payday. He'll get plenty of money in MTL

If he stays in Montréal it will be for 8 more years.
Why should he become a free agent with 34 or 35? It is very unlikely he would get another longer contract at that age. Anything less an he will go to a team offering him 7 (or maybe 8) years.
The taxes in Canada are a perfect case for a deferred salary contract to keep the AAV lower.

But keep in mind the cap will probably rise above 100m even before his new contract starts.
So paying him 10m is not that outrageous…

 

[HuGo Sham]

 

[Marioesque]

In Winnipeg they had for some time a line with Scheifele as the center and Laine and Mathieu Perreault as the wingers. That line was one of the best lines in the league as long as they played together. That was during Laine’s 1st NHL season, and then unfortunately after some weeks the Jets got some injury trouble and Maurice mixed the lines, which lead into Laine being separated from both Scheifele and Perreault, and playing mostly with Little and Ehlers, who neither are the type of players that Laine fits too well with.

Quoted for the truth. That was easily the best line Laine ever played in, Perreault would puck hound and pass quickly and Laine would be open for shots. I've seen these situations with Newhook, where Laine IS available to receive for that needed second, but Newhook is no Perreault in recognizing those and making the pass.

Also Stastny was a quick passer with good hockey IQ and he won pucks in corners, dished the puck.

 

[Habssince89]

I always liked players who leave a little on the table for their team so they can win. At the end of the day, your family is set for life and 50% of the revenue goes to the players. I don't like greedy players. Leafs might not win a cup because their core is greedy.

In the salary cap era, it's very important that when you rebuild, you build a culture of unselfish players. IMO, this is one of the reasons why we passed on Michkov. Self centered type.

I was always a huge fan of Laine and even a bigger fan now that he really did want to come to Montreal. He wasn't afraid of our pressure and he wanted to join a positive culture with a team that has potential.

Not to mention if he is a star in Montreal and especially if he wins a cup here he's a god in Quebec. Endorsements for life

 

[HabzSauce]

Patrick Laine is just heating up boys............gotta stay healthy, but this is going to keep getting better.
There is way more there, in his tool box.
Not to mention Kirby Dach is hitting his stride also!!

Yup soon with Demidov we will have a lot more options that will open up more lanes for Laine. And as long as he stays healthy he should look even better next year

 

[japhi27returns]

His play at 5 vs 5 isn't optimal at the moment. But saying that he’s been invisible and useless on 5 vs 5 is something. Yes, there has been "bad" games for him for sure. But he has set Newhook like ten times to prime scoring position with no success.

edit:
Give me a break, 5M guy.

Laine is 0.43 GPG and 0.81 PPG player in his career.
Suzuki signed his contract at 22-23 and he was before that 0.23 GPG and 0.68 PPG player and had played 85% games in that moment.
Caufield signed his contract at 23-24 and he was before that 0.41 GPG and 0.68 PPG and had played 50% games in that moment.

PPG means very little if you play 50 games a year. Seriously why is this such a hot take? Am I the only guy that has access to his games played the past 8 years?

He makes 7.5MM now and no one wanted him before the season, yet now, after playing 18 of 46 available games, he is worth 10MM.
? Or even 8MM? All the previous history, failures with other teams go away because he’s on a PP heater shooting nearly twice his career average.

You give me a f***ing break, I’m actually following along. Put emotion aside and truly think about the probability of him staying in the lineup AND continuing at this pace. Because even using your numbers, across a fully healthy season, we are talking about a 36g, 68 point player.

Or maybe you guys are right, he has improved greatly over previous seasons, will be fully healthy, and be a 50g 90 point player.

Seems like fantasy to me, I’ll let you have that position and I will pray it becomes true but don’t call me out…. because we have an 8.5 year track record to go on so calls of him being healthy and more productive then ever ARE the outlier positions.

 

[River Meadow]

 

[elmaco]

Yeah that's a good one, is that 77 there Dach?

 

[Halberdier]

He makes 7.5MM now and no one wanted him before the season, yet now, after playing 18 of 46 available games, he is worth 10MM.
? Or even 8MM? All the previous history, failures with other teams go away because he’s on a PP heater shooting nearly twice his career average.

His cap hit is 8.7M, not 7.5M, and so far he has earned that. 12 goals in 18 games, and most of them really crucial ones. Also I guess 1 shootout goal or so. Handful of great plays resulting in goal that he didn't get an assist for and many created opportunities for others, but just not got in.

His even strength game is getting better and better, and after a bad start, he is now +12 -12 = +-0 on even strength, whereas his linemate Dach is +18 -37 = -19 a.k.a. badly losing on even strength. Only 5 Habs have positive goal differential on even strength, and they are Carrier, Suzuki, Evans, Heineman and Caufield. Lane Hutson whose play I just love is +43 -50 = -7 for instance, as he isn't that great defensively while he is a monster offensively and just a beauty to watch. Lane Hutson alone would be a great reason to watch Canadiens play.

By no means Laine is even close to the worst player 5-on-5 or even strength, as some hot take was on this thread. His corsi is among the worst (+196 -251), but corsi is a pretty useless stat anyway, and again Dach has almost the exact CF% than Laine so the 2nd line did not get worse corsi-wise when Laine came. They just started doing things less stupid and more effective. He is very far from his best form, obviously, but there is no reason to expect he wont get back to that level of 5-on-5 play he had already on CBJ and WPG, and that's a really good level except his atrocious 20-21 season as a Blue Jacket.

Injuries are a major concern on Laine, there is no way around that fact. Yes, some of them have been awful luck, but not all I guess.

 

[sampollock]

Yup soon with Demidov we will have a lot more options that will open up more lanes for Laine. And as long as he stays healthy he should look even better next year

Two more assists tonight not bad

 

[tazsub3]

I always liked players who leave a little on the table for their team so they can win. At the end of the day, your family is set for life and 50% of the revenue goes to the players. I don't like greedy players. Leafs might not win a cup because their core is greedy.

In the salary cap era, it's very important that when you rebuild, you build a culture of unselfish players. IMO, this is one of the reasons why we passed on Michkov. Self centered type.

I was always a huge fan of Laine and even a bigger fan now that he really did want to come to Montreal. He wasn't afraid of our pressure and he wanted to join a positive culture with a team that has potential.

fully agree, No one did it more then bergeron in boston. Heck he even retired a bruin and i am sure left a ton of money on the table elsewhere

 

[Bruce Granville]

Two more assists tonight not bad

Finally. Or “is it time” like a former line mate used to say…
Teams taking away shooting lanes and doubling coverage on Laine leaves open space for others. And finally the others move into those spots.

 

[Halberdier]

Finally. Or “is it time” like a former line mate used to say…
Teams taking away shooting lanes and doubling coverage on Laine leaves open space for others. And finally the others move into those spots.

That's also the other argument why Laine should play with the best, and Newhook & Dach aren't that, esp. Newhook. Counterargument for the time being is obviously that there aren't many other options for secondary scoring right now and Nick & Cole are doing great together. Hopefully Demidov fixes some of that or then someone like Heineman gets a shot there (after he recovers). Also while Laine-Newhook-Dach might not be the best, at least they get a lot of time to build up some chemistry so it should get better over the time.

 

[Bruce Granville]

That's also the other argument why Laine should play with the best, and Newhook & Dach aren't that, esp. Newhook. Counterargument for the time being is obviously that there aren't many other options for secondary scoring right now and Nick & Cole are doing great together. Hopefully Demidov fixes some of that or then someone like Heineman gets a shot there (after he recovers). Also while Laine-Newhook-Dach might not be the best, at least they get a lot of time to build up some chemistry so it should get better over the time.

If only there were another Stastny… he was not the fastest, but he could win faceoffs, was defensively responsible and was a good passer. And he did know how to put the in the net occasionally.
Maybe someone like Nelson or Granlund, but they will likely go to a top contender.

 

[Mulletman]

Watching Laine pick up assists and playmake instead of shoot and score just feels wrong! It's kind of like watching Hulk Hogan wrestle in Japan:

 

[Zub]

This is actually true. And I say it with having had similar struggles as well. I know I turned it into a joke a few pages earlier but I agree, he is definitely not clear of yhe struggles yet. But great to see him doing this well already on the ice. Goals are like medicine for him on the ice.

A Swedish Laine fan? This is nice to see

 

[BLONG7]

I'm glad we have some time with him to do a "trial" of sorts before we need to consider an extension.

He obviously has one of the best shots in the league and can lift people out of their seats generating a scoring chance on his own off the rush with his handling ability. He gives our 2nd line a serious offensive threat that makes opposing coaches really contemplate how they plan to defend our top two lines. He's fun to watch on the PP.

I'd really like to see more out of him without the puck. He has such a big reach and frame and if he can find ways to use it a bit more effectively without the puck, he'd be a complete monster out there.

If he isn't scoring, it might be fair to ask the question - "what else is he doing?". There are inconsistencies. But in the right environment, he can pot 40 - 50 goals, and very few players can do that.

I wonder how much Hughes would be contemplating for a contract extension. It will be a big decision to make.

2 Assists last night.............it's coming.
The guy is just getting going.