The grapevine pretty much says he needs the cash. Unless he can make that much endorsement wise in stl which is doubtful. He had no choice last year but to that the hometown discount. This year its a different deal.
PATRICK MAROON -WHAT IS HE LOOKING FOR?
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Captain Creampuff
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I beg to differ. Sandford definitely does not go to the hard areas of the ice and is terrible at protecting the puck. He has a higher offensive ceiling than Pat does, but is he as effective? No.
Dbrownss
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Maroon is effective because of his line. He's good at holding the puck till Thomas zips in and gets it. I'm not trying to say he's worthless but he didnt make that line work, He was the 3rd wheel. He's not irreplaceable.
I'm no huge fan of Sanford and honestly I doubt he slides down to that line as he's effective with Orielly.
Note Worthy
History Made
cardinalnation
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cardinalnation
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Army has some real decisions to make here. First and foremost is Jake Allen. With Binny due a nice raise do we really want to spend 9 Mill a year on goaltending? The reason in bring it up in this thread is that is the key as to whether Paddy comes back or not. The Cap didn’t go up as much as we thought it would and we still have a 4th line player (Steener) making 5.5. The sooner these issues are taken care of the better for everyone in my opinion. We are really hamstrung by those two contracts. The best thing would have been to trade either of those guys at the draft, maybe we tried. I don’t see how the blues can do anything at all until something gives there. Including McGoon. I wouldn’t mind having him back just to mentor Sanford to be honest but the money is just not there.I could see a scenario where he shines elsewhere and the blues try to trade for him later in the season when they have more Cap space. Paddy was horrible in the first half last year anyways.
$9m a year on goaltending isn't exactly insane.
If we trade Allen then who is replacing him at a significantly lower cost? How much of a downgrade is it? Are we having to give more term to attract a better UFA goalie?
I'd rather have Allen back at $4.35m, knowing that the contract likely won't be a problem to move next summer, than have Maroon back on a multi-year deal at $3m+. Maroon is easier to replace, and while he stepped up in the playoffs that line was also a product of Thomas, and when he got hurt then the line disappeared. It's not dissimilar to the Fabbri-Brouwer situation in that regard.
Brian39
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I don't think Allen or Steen's contracts impact a decision on Maroon at all. We can fit Maroon at $3.5 mil for this year pretty easily. The issue with Maroon is term and at least one of Allen/Steen will be gone next summer. I think there is a good chance neither of them are on the opening night roster in 2020/21 even if we keep both this year.
I have no problem spending $8+ mil on our goaltending in 2019/20. That won't continue into 2020/21.
I don't want to pay market value on Maroon because that likely means a 3 year term that will turn into an anchor. I'd be happy to pay the market AAV on a 1 year deal, but Maroon would be silly to take that. His $9.5 career earnings likely translates to somewhere around $4 mil in real dollars paid. That's a great head start on life, but every silly rumor I've heard about Pat is that he hasn't diligently invested his money the way you would have to in order to make that $4 mil cover him for life at an upper class lifestyle. That's not to say he has been stupid with his money. A guy living what you think of as "the NHL lifestyle" for almost a decade while earning $4 mil total just isn't going to have all of it sitting in investments earning interest even if he is doing everything his financial adviser recommends. Cashing in at market value/term this summer takes him into a completely different ballpark of wealth than where he is currently at. It takes him from "amazing head start and you won't have to worry financially so long as you are smart and work some type of job after your playing career" to "your grandkids are taken care of so long as you don't completely botch this."
cardinalnation
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Like I said I am not advocating to resugn Patrick Maroon. My only point is the money is just not there either way because of our situation with Allen and Steen. I thought Jake made over five a year. That extra one Mill actually does make a difference since the Cap didn’t go as high as we thought it would.
cardinalnation
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Brian I don’t think you are taking into account the fact that some of these players will be getting raises. Binnington’s will be a big one. I see us being right up against the Cap if everyone comes back excluding Maroon.
Captain Creampuff
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Maroon has always been effective playing with players who can really move the puck around in the offensive zone, i.e Thomas, McDavid, Getzlaf, etc. Why should that be a knock on him? The argument was Sanford taking on Maroon's role. Maroon is certainly replaceable, but not by Sanford.
Brian39
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Assuming these (which I think are slightly on the high end*)
Eddy: $3.25
Binny: $4.5
Sunny: $2.5
Barby: $2
Then we would have somewhere around $2-$2.5 mil to spend on Maroon once we fill in the rest of the roster with our RFAs/youth (depending what some RFAs get and which guys make the roster). Frankly, that's all I want to spend on Maroon on a deal with term regardless of how Steen/Allen's contracts impact the cap this year.
That's less than he should get in UFA, so he should chase the money. But assuming he turns that type of money down from us, I certainly don't have interest in downgrading the backup job or Steen's 4th line role in order to give a bad contract to Maroon. Allen and Steen are both absolutely overpaid, but replacing them with cheaper options is almost certainly going to downgrade their current roles AND giving any of those savings to Maroon with term is going to make it harder to fit Petro/Dunn/Schenn into the 2020/21 lineup.
*In terms of their actual play, I think all these guys are generally worth more than these numbers. But they are all RFAs and given the current CBA, they don't have much actual leverage. There is about a 0% chance Barby/Eddy/Sunny are getting an offer sheet and about a 1% chance for Binny. Eddy is coming off a down year which would hurt him in arbitration, Barby doesn't have arbitration rights and Sunny excels in all the areas that are extremely hard to quantify using the evidence admissible during arbitration. For better or worse (depends on your perspective), these guys don't have much leverage to get huge raises. Guys with under 200 NHL games of experience and fewer than 60 career points (regular season and playoffs) have a very difficult time eclipsing the $2 mil mark when they have 2+ RFA years remaining.
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67Blues
Got it for Bobby
This fits into the same narrative.
2016: How did we let Brouwer go? He scored that huge goal in the Chicago series and we lose that grit in front of the net.
2019: Troy Brouwer contract bought out by Calgary.
2019: How did we let Maroon go? He scored that huge goal in the Dallas series and we lose that grit in front of the net.
2016: How did we let Brouwer go? He scored that huge goal in the Chicago series and we lose that grit in front of the net.
2019: Troy Brouwer contract bought out by Calgary.
2019: How did we let Maroon go? He scored that huge goal in the Dallas series and we lose that grit in front of the net.
Dbrownss
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How many premium scoring chances did Maroon whiff on from Thomas? I dont expect an actual # but it was noticable. If were still talking about Sanford, he has the ability to finish those passes in tight.
Captain Creampuff
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How many chances did Sanford whiff on playing with O'Reilly and Perron for nearly 60 games this year? You're arguing semantics. If you seriously think Sanford is a better or even an effective player than Pat Maroon then idk what to tell you other than I think you're flat out wrong. This isn't even about resigning Maroon. Its thinking Sanford can take his place doing the same things Maroon does.
David Dennison
I'm a tariff, man.
What exactly does Maroon do that is so irreplaceable? He's alright around the net, but let's not act like 10 regular season goals are irreplaceable.
Dbrownss
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I dont care to continue to argue this, but this idea Maroon was some lynchpin to success is just misguided. The dude was getting run out of town till Thomas was put on that line. The few things he does well is not some elite skillset.
Captain Creampuff
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Quote me once where I said he was irreplaceable. Quit putting words into my mouth.
Captain Creampuff
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Never said it was an elite skillset but it's a better one than Sanford brings. Quit regurgitating the same BS in your posts each time instead of actually reading what I'm saying. I've stated a few times now that Maroon is replaceable but not with what Sanford brings. Idk how hard that is to get down your throat.
JoshFromMO
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Sanford also showed up on the scoreboard in the Final, 4pts in 5gp, +5 while maroon was 0pts in 7gp, -5 mostly without Thomas to carry the line for him
