Patrick Kane subject of police investigation III [READ MOD OP]

[417th]

Who says she's not an alien from another galaxy ? I mean if we're just going to be posting speculation then I think that's a legitimate possibility.

[MOD] At least people are for the most part refraining from calling Kane a scum bag rapist so far and that is a good thing.

 

[dechire]

I guarantee you with almost 100% certainty that there will be a civil suit after.

Only way I can see one not taking place is if they settle out of court.

Literally none of the women I've known that have been victims of sexual assault have filed civil suits including the ones that filed criminal charges so no actually there is absolutely no guarantee

 

[Ishad]

How would she get a payday in a criminal court?

There is also civil court. See Ben Roethlisberger.

 

[sparxx87]

Until recently, rape was defined in such a way that only females could be victims. The old FBI definition explicitly said "...against a woman". State laws often referred to vaginal penetration as a criterion for rape. Sexual assault is a more general term that has become synonymous with rape in common usage.

Absolutely. Sexual assault could be pinching a girls booty without consent. That's significantly different then forcing sex on someone.

Is there any report accusing him of rape specifically? All I've heard is sexual assault.

 

[meedle]

Literally none of the women I've known that have been victims of sexual assault have filed civil suits including the ones that filed criminal charges so no actually there is absolutely no guarantee

Alot of people don't have they type of money a Bill Cosby or Patrick Kane has tho. If it's a regular joe, the lawyer fees will be more than what you can get out of a person.

 

[Rhodes 81]

The State has the burden to prove that Kane committed a crime. They need more than the accuser's testimony to get a conviction.

Which is why whenever a woman feels assaulted, they must immediately go get a rape kit done, regardless of how invasive or uncomfortable it feels right after an assault. There's so much involved with proving sexual assault, and every bit of evidence helps. I was an RA in college, and we got more training on how to respond to a suspected assault than pretty much everything else combined. The last thing anyone wants is for a guilty party to walk free because proper procedures weren't followed, which is why we likely won't be hearing any details on this case for quite some time. Proof in the eyes of the law is much different than proof in the eyes of common sense.

 

[Mario Lemieux fan 66]

If Kane was cautious and had camera everywhere in the house, could he still face jail time despite the sex was consensual if the girl was unaware of being on camera ?

 

[Felix Unger]

Absolutely. Sexual assault could be pinching a girls booty without consent. That's significantly different then forcing sex on someone.

Is there any report accusing him of rape specifically? All I've heard is sexual assault.

The alleged victim's hospital visit + the idea that the police are investigating forensics definitely seem to point in that direction.

 

[jford]

Literally none of the women I've known that have been victims of sexual assault have filed civil suits including the ones that filed criminal charges so no actually there is absolutely no guarantee

Were any of the rapists millionaires? There's no point to a civil suit without assets for a judgment.

Kane has the assets.

 

[Leafsdude7]

Who says she's not an alien from another galaxy ? I mean if we're just going to be posting speculation then I think that's a legitimate possibility.

So many inappropriate jokes to make. Must. Restrain. Self.

Absolutely. Sexual assault could be pinching a girls booty without consent. That's significantly different then forcing sex on someone.

Is there any report accusing him of rape specifically? All I've heard is sexual assault.

There are numerous reports of the use of a rape kit. I'd suggest that's an implicit statement of it being a rape allegation as opposed to some kind of lesser sexual assault report.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

Literally none of the women I've known that have been victims of sexual assault have filed civil suits including the ones that filed criminal charges so no actually there is absolutely no guarantee

While I know nothing about the situations they were in, high profile cases almost always end in a civil suit. Kane has a lot of money and, if he is found guilty, she deserves a large chunk of that.

Now if he was a garbage man, a civil suit would not be even close to worth it.

Also, there is a pretty major distinction between sexual assault and rape.

 

[dechire]

Alot of people don't have they type of money a Bill Cosby or Patrick Kane has tho. If it's a regular joe, the lawyer fees will be more than what you can get out of a person.

And not every woman wants to be dragged through the mud for a second time for maybe a little bit of cash. It's inaccurate and misleading to say that a woman will absolutely file a civil case. But if she was assaulted and she does file a civil suit then I hope she takes every penny he has.

Also, there is a pretty major distinction between sexual assault and rape.

As I and others have already said several times, no there isn't.

 

[Jacob]

This reflects poorly on the sport. I hope the accusations are bogus.

 

[Beerz]

Who says she's not an alien from another galaxy ? I mean if we're just going to be posting speculation then I think that's a legitimate possibility.

I'm giving no credence to the claim that its a money grabbing ploy. But saying its not because you can't get damages from a criminal trial doesn't prove anything. Civil cases usually happen after criminal trials.

 

[sparxx87]

If Kane was cautious and had camera everywhere in the house, could he still face jail time despite the sex was consensual if the girl was unaware of being on camera ?

Earlier in this thread, someone gave an example of someone using their security footage to disprove. Apparently he showed her willfully participating in various acts and the case was subsequently throw out.

The alleged victim's hospital visit + the idea that the police are investigating forensics definitely seem to point in that direction.

Oh she did take a test? I thought the argument was why she didn't.

Good to know.

 

[Tatar Shots]

Wow... the conversations that are going on in this thread

Can we all just agree that if Toews had more intangibles whatever even that did occur would not actually have transpired?

 

[Habs178]

If she is initiating, then yes. Not really the same scenario otherwise.

Example:
Man and woman are drunk. Man has ***** and initiates sex = he is saying yes.
Man and woman are drunk. Woman initiates sex and is wet = she is saying yes.

If one or the other is not ready to go from the onset then things are different as both can be turned on forcefully (for lack of better wording ATM). This would be rape.

More clear?

Well I'm a woman, and I've been making out, which in turn develops lubrication. I've done this drunk. I've also been drunk, making out, and then my brain kicks in and it's like NO. The minute I say NO, whether I'm wet or not, whether my tongue was down your throat for half an hour, it's ****ing NO. PERIOD.

 

[Micklebot]

I'm giving no credence to the claim that its a money grabbing ploy. But saying its not because you can't get damages from a criminal trial doesn't prove anything. Civil cases usually happen after criminal trials.

Logically, that makes sense, because depleting the accused's financial resourses by requiring them to defend themselves in a criminal case might improve your chances in the second go round...

 

[GoJetsGo55]

And not every woman wants to be dragged through the mud for a second time for maybe a little bit of cash. It's inaccurate and misleading to say that a woman will absolutely file a civil case. But if she was assaulted and she does file a civil suit then I hope she takes every penny he has.

I'll bet you a coke that, if the criminal trial goes even remotely bad for Kane, a civil trial will take place. I'll bet you a second coke that she gets paid before a trial.

As I and others have already said several times, no there isn't.

And as I, others, and the law has already said, yes...there...is.

Being wilfully ignorant isn't helping you out here.

All rape is sexual assault.
Not all sexual assault is rape.

http://frankjsmith.hubpages.com/hub/The-Difference-Between-Rape-and-Sexual-Assault

"Rape
Rape refers specifically to forced sexual intercourse. If an individual’s actions fall short of actual intercourse, the perpetrator committed sexual assault, not rape."


Edit:

Also to add:

"What Crimes are Considered Sexual Assault?
Sexual assault could even include crimes like voyeurism, exhibitionism, incest, and sexual harassment."

If you cannot see the difference between voyeurism and rape, then I just don't know what to tell you.

DOUBLE EDIT:

And just in case your counter point is that my linked page is not valid, here's another

http://www.womenslaw.org/laws_state_type.php?id=13048&state_code=PG

 

[Juicy Pop]

You said it yourself. Rape is a form of sexual assault. There is not a "major difference" between the two things. So you're actually agreeing with me and showing that you didn't even bother to read my first post on it before insulting my intelligence.

A square is a type of rectangle but not every rectangle is a square.

 

[Flair Hay]

I'm not going to even get too technical because the law isn't my moral code at all.

He deserves to get punished hard if the girl told him a firm no.

If he wasn't told a firm no, there shouldn't and won't be much of a case.

Either way Kane is pretty clearly a dirt ball, which we already knew. Need to wait to find out if he's a menace or just a spoiled brat.

 

[HydroF]

So what does EA do about the cover of their game? With the game a month from release they don't have time to wait to see how this all plays out. Doubt they want their game cover to feature a guy who ends up being charged and possibly convicted of rape.

 

[Edmonton East]

You said it yourself. Rape is a form of sexual assault. There is not a "major difference" between the two things. So you're actually agreeing with me and showing that you didn't even bother to read my first post on it before insulting my intelligence.

THEY ARE NOT THE SAME THING.

I'll break it down even further for you:

Rape = Sexual Assault
Sexual Assault Charge does NOT equal rape.

Seriously man. Come on. How is this even up for debate?

[MOD]

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

So what does EA do about the cover of their game? With the game a month from release they don't have time to wait to see how this all plays out. Doubt they want their game cover to feature a guy who ends up being charged and possibly convicted of rape.

Awkwardly ask Toews if he'll pose by himself?

 

[meedle]

And not every woman wants to be dragged through the mud for a second time for maybe a little bit of cash. It's inaccurate and misleading to say that a woman will absolutely file a civil case. But if she was assaulted and she does file a civil suit then I hope she takes every penny he has.



As I and others have already said several times, no there isn't.

Pretty sure most of these type of civil cases are sealed and not available to the public. Also if he is convicted it is pretty much a cakewalk to winning a civil suit. Considering many people may have PTSD or some form of depression or whatever and is going to need professional help, I would think she would want to get as much money as she could from the assailant.