Post-Game Talk: Parental guidance advised

[Drivesaitl]

I mean holy c'moly... you guys are missing the forest for the trees. Comparing Skinner to RNH is just... wow!

The obvious, and I mean OBVIOUS point is that coaches don't judge players based solely on their counting numbers. There are two ends of the ice, and when RNH isn't producing on offense, he's still contributing defensively.

I honestly don't know what games you are watching, but I've witnessed RNH save at least half-dozen sure goals against in the last 10 games alone. At least a few of those preserved wins.

McDavid holding his hand? Jeezus... RNH is playing third guy high on every shift in the Ozone so that McDavid can deliver us virtuoso offensive performances... do you even notice? He's not on McDavid's line to drive the net and tap in one-timer's like Hyman... he's on that line to play the defensive/traditional high forward role so that McDavid can be McDavid and Hyman can be Hyman.

I swear sometimes Soundwave... wow!

Thanks. Just finished saying the same. At worst RNH is making solid smart plays 200ft of ice. The bolded is something that hardly anybody seemingly gets. The whole paragraph shouldn't even need to be spelled out as its obvious what role Nuge is afforded on that top line and that McD and Hyman are two players up high cashing.

A team and coach WANTS a reliable winger up high in that situation, and to have one with all the attributes of RNH on affordable contract is a good thing. He's the one taking a cut in his own production further to outscoring of the line and limiting GA. WE have the luxury of a production Center here being deployed in this way being available and willing to do detail assignments and look for counter break risks and to be the first forward back which has been important to team success.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Whats there to distract from at the moment exactly? .920 in his last 11 starts?

But no, my post isn’t about it distraction. I’m not trying to distract from the fact that Skinner has been below average this year. Just pointing out how dumb the hypocrisy is when it comes to judging good goals against or bad goals against.

Can't it be said you're doing the same in your previous comment about Pickard. Nor do I think it was two shit goals. I also think Pickard made multiple stops that Skinner wouldn't get to and the wrap, No way Skinner is even gettng over to that one. Pickard had made 3 stops like that and almost got to that one.

In anycase it seems odd if your mission is to be kinder to goalies here to be modeling the same critiques.

You won't like this but to anybody else it seems as if you do treat Skinner differently in your posting.

Not just you. The broadcasts do the same, and so some of the pushback is on that too. Debrusk basically says "Skinner had no chance" on around 80% of goals that go in which is some fabrication.

 

[TheNumber4]

Can't it be said you're doing the same in your previous comment about Pickard. Nor do I think it was two shit goals. I also think Pickard made multiple stops that Skinner wouldn't get to and the wrap, No way Skinner is even gettng over to that one. Pickard had made 3 stops like that and almost got to that one.

In anycase it seems odd if your mission is to be kinder to goalies here to be modeling the same critiques.

You won't like this but to anybody but you it seems as if you do treat Skinner differently in your posting.

No. Cause it’s really really easy to call out a bad goal against when you aren’t just trying to push an inane and inaccurate narrative that Skinner is the worst goalie in the League.

Skinner lets in a muffin. You’ll hear it from me. Skinner not playing good enough and not the same goalie as last year? Funny I said the exact thing a day before Knob had to mention it himself.

If Skinner let in that muffin wrister UNDER his pad I’d call him out for it too. And if Skinner had shit tier positioning to the point where a wrap around hits off his pad and it’s still a goal, I’d call that out too. Where were you on this analysis of bad goals??? That’s your favorite subject apparently, essays written about it, unless it’s Pickard of course. Nothing said, cause you are still trying to sell the narrative that he’s better than Skinner. Talk about bias lol. Cause your trademark is of course objectivity.

 

[Pip]

Incomplete look. RNH is a consummate 200ft player that plays roles on PP, pk, and EV and is always a plus player with a lower GA rate.

Skinner is a one act pony that doesn't play any special teams well, has been awful here even on 2nd unit PP, is awful at EV and is -11 with much higher than expected GA relative to his toi and his usage. For Skinner to be -11 here is just continuation of the theme of him being a one zone player. If he doesn't like that rep he's well earned it.

Any comparison between RNH and Skinner here, sorry, is odd.

In terms of "actual consequences" what do you mean? Would you actually scratch RNH who is such a good part of the teams play and on special units?

I agree that Skinner doesn’t bring the all around game that RNH does and I am not advocating for the same treatment.

I am advocating that other players get a look on that top line and see if RNH can find a spark on another line.

I mean holy c'moly... you guys are missing the forest for the trees. Comparing Skinner to RNH is just... wow!

The obvious, and I mean OBVIOUS point is that coaches don't judge players based solely on their counting numbers. There are two ends of the ice, and when RNH isn't producing on offense, he's still contributing defensively.

I honestly don't know what games you are watching, but I've witnessed RNH save at least half-dozen sure goals against in the last 10 games alone. At least a few of those preserved wins.

McDavid holding his hand? Jeezus... RNH is playing third guy high on every shift in the Ozone so that McDavid can deliver us virtuoso offensive performances... do you even notice? He's not on McDavid's line to drive the net and tap in one-timer's like Hyman... he's on that line to play the defensive/traditional high forward role so that McDavid can be McDavid and Hyman can be Hyman.

I swear sometimes Soundwave... wow!

This is a lot of excuses for a very concerning lack of production stapled to the best player in the world. Also whenever McDrai are loaded up he doesn’t produce on his own line either.

Obviously his defensive play earns him more leeway than someone like Jeff Skinner but he shouldn’t be above criticism or a demotion in the lineup if he isn’t producing at evens.

There are plenty of defensively responsible forwards that would kill for that spot.

 

[Drivesaitl]

No. Cause it’s really really easy to fallout a bad goal against when you aren’t just trying to push an inane and inaccurate narrative that Skinner is the worst goalie in the League.

Fair argument could be made he's the worst #1 starter in the league. In anycase you've shown clear record of being one sided backing Skinner. Which is fine. When somebody notes that maybe roll with it.

edit to edit I don't see you critiquing many Skinner goals against. Not saying you don't but haven't seen much of this.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Sorry for responding twice but I can't watch Skinner interviews without thinking he's the kid in class in back row mocking everything the teacher does that gets sent to the office all the time. Always struck me that he's a class clown sort. Being that he got to this level it served him well being affable and not bothered by too much. But its also his own challenge and baggage in never having become part of something that is great. Is Skinner cynical. I've wondered this before about the player. The lol plus cynicism would be setting any Head coach off and it has. I don't see any part of Skinner taking responsibility here. Just saying things like its not going, bad luck, I dunno. Further to the classroom analogy Skinner would be first to know he's not doing his homework.

The scuttle in Buffalo was always along the lines that Skinner wasn't good in the room. He wasn't much good on 200ft ice either.

Skinner: "Its hundreds of variables" Nah, it isn't really.

 

[TheNumber4]

Fair argument could be made he's the worst #1 starter in the league. In anycase you've shown clear record of being one sided backing Skinner. Which is fine. When somebody notes that maybe roll with it.

edit to edit I don't see you critiquing many Skinner goals against. Not saying you don't but haven't seen much of this.

We have 2 and half years of Skinner stats to go off of. Please go make that argument then. Cause above League average save percentage in those 2 years will make it a tough one for you.

Or are we just gonna make arguments on fee fees?

Yeh everyone ignores it. Cause when I say that’s a bad goal and can’t happen, which I say often. Everyone fixates on the seethe and rage instead. Cause seethe and rage is what gets eyeballs on the Internet.

 

[Drivesaitl]

We have 2 and half years of Skinner stats to go off of. Please go make that argument then. Cause above League average save percentage in those 2 years will make it a tough one for you.

Or are we just gonna make arguments on fee fees?

Yeh everyone ignores it. Cause when I say that’s a bad goal and can’t happen, which I say often. Everyone fixates on the seethe and rage instead. Cause seethe and rage is what gets eyeballs on the Internet.

Maybe cite 3 instances this month where you've been critical of 3 different Skinner GA. heh. Just playing around.

I was speaking specifc on Skinner vs other #1's. Particularly ones that are deemed being #!. Not necessarily those only in the spot due to injury.

 

[Soundwave]

RNH has an shockingly bad points/60 5-on-5 this year pretty much all with the best player in the world.

Like we're talking worse than Derek Ryan levels. The stats were posted prior I'm not going to shift through a bunch of pages to finding but it's stunning.

No one's even saying staple Skinner to McDavid, but can he get even 3 games to have a f***ing fair chance with McDavid?

3 out of 34 games or so? Did McDavid marry Lauren last summer or Nuge? Like when did "Nuge can never be moved off McDavid's line ever" become a thing? Even Tippett gave James Neal plenty of time to be tried with McDavid over RNH and it's not like Tippett wasn't a defensive oriented coach.

 

[TheNumber4]

Maybe cite 3 instances this month where you've been critical of 3 different Skinner GA. heh. Just playing around.

I was speaking specifc on Skinner vs other #1's. Particularly ones that are deemed being #!. Not necessarily those only in the spot due to injury.

Well we all know from discussions past we won't see eye to eye, when you think it's a bad goal if a 2 on 1 one timer goes into an empty cage on him lol. Even in the world of "#1's" you'd be hard pressed to make that argument. For goalies that played over 40 games, Stu ranked 10th for save percentage 2 years ago, then 18th for save percentage the next year. That's a 2 year sample showing he is what he is, an average goalie/starter.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Well we all know from discussions past we won't see eye to eye, when you think it's a bad goal if a 2 on 1 one timer goes into an empty cage on him lol. Even in the world of "#1's" you'd be hard pressed to make that argument. For goalies that played over 40 games, Stu ranked 10th for save percentage 2 years ago, then 18th for save percentage the next year. That's a 2 year sample showing he is what he is, an average goalie/starter.

But this doesn't account for Skinner being a starter on a club that limits almost everything he has to face. A team that shutsdown as well as any team in the league and that despite that Skinner is getting subpar stats for starters. I know you acknowledge he's "average" he isn't even that in respect of expected save stats or what he faces in HDSC.

 

[TB12]

But this doesn't account for Skinner being a starter on a club that limits almost everything he has to face. A team that shutsdown as well as any team in the league and that despite that Skinner is getting subpar stats for starters. I know you acknowledge he's "average" he isn't even that in respect of expected save stats or what he faces in HDSC.

Like.

 

[brentashton]

Like.

I second your like.

I’ve decided that emojis are so 2024, now that the calendar is due to turn. (Plus my button is gone for a few months).

 

[TheNumber4]

But this doesn't account for Skinner being a starter on a club that limits almost everything he has to face. A team that shutsdown as well as any team in the league and that despite that Skinner is getting subpar stats for starters. I know you acknowledge he's "average" he isn't even that in respect of expected save stats or what he faces in HDSC.

Well that's how teams are built Drive. That's why we got away with average goaltending on way to 99.7% of the way to a Cup. The most significant stat are GAs when talking about defense. It trumps save percentage, and expected GA and all that shit. That's why despite Sheshterkin being an elite tier goaltending, the Rags are complete trash and the Oilers are once again the odds on favorite to win the cup (WITH Stu in net).

 

[TB12]

I second your like.

I’ve decided that emojis are so 2024, now that the calendar is due to turn. (Plus my button is gone for a few months).

hahaha same same!

 

[OilerTitanFan]

Scoring more than a 6 goal season pace would be nice for a starter considering he's playing with arguably the best passer and 2nd best player in the world. I think its a problem when we or the team decides "this is good enough for Drai" The same team that let players go that would be better options.

I don't look simply at the contract sticker price. Thats par for the course when you're gettting players that have nowhere else to land. Pods is occupying a roster spot (and he's earning that much but comensurate with bottomsix results) Trouble is he's playing topsix with a guy feeding him an average of 5 sweet feeds a night and botching almost everytime.

Kapanen isn't coming in here and saying well I'm only getting paid 1M I'm not gonna knock myself out producing. Kapanen has 4 goals here and 5 on the season in half the toi that Pods has been granted in topsix here.

ps this is Edmonton, not Vancouver. Yeah a 1M salary pays the rent.

pps Gretzky was on average paid about 1M./ season. Didn't seem to deter him from getting production.

I think the main problem is how knob deploys the lines. It's not podz fault that he is on the second line. The bigger issue is RNH on the top line. Moving RNH to 3rd line C would shake our lines up quite a bit in a positive manner.

When gretzky was paid a million bucks, houses and land could be had for under 50k.

 

[CycloneSweep]

RNH has an shockingly bad points/60 5-on-5 this year pretty much all with the best player in the world.

Like we're talking worse than Derek Ryan levels. The stats were posted prior I'm not going to shift through a bunch of pages to finding but it's stunning.

No one's even saying staple Skinner to McDavid, but can he get even 3 games to have a f***ing fair chance with McDavid?

3 out of 34 games or so? Did McDavid marry Lauren last summer or Nuge? Like when did "Nuge can never be moved off McDavid's line ever" become a thing? Even Tippett gave James Neal plenty of time to be tried with McDavid over RNH and it's not like Tippett wasn't a defensive oriented coach.

What has Skinner done this year to show he can handle NHl minutes let alone top. He hasn’t done ANYTHING to deserve icetime.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I think the main problem is how knob deploys the lines. It's not podz fault that he is on the second line. The bigger issue is RNH on the top line. Moving RNH to 3rd line C would shake our lines up quite a bit in a positive manner.

When gretzky was paid a million bucks, houses and land could be had for under 50k.

When Gretz was paid a million the average journeyman was making 30-35/hr. Fast forward and players are making over 10M and journeyman got about a 5 dollar raise, maybe 10. Something wrong with the math. Thing thats changed is that pro sports and entertainment have priced themselves out of any reasonable range.

In anycase you'd made the case that a Million a year wouldn't afford housing here in Edmonton. You could buy the house for that. Buy two, why not....

What has Skinner done this year to show he can handle NHl minutes let alone top. He hasn’t done ANYTHING to deserve icetime.

Just because. Listen to the logic.

 

[brentashton]

Just because. Listen to the logic.

Ba ha ha.

 

[brentashton]

Man there is a real Killjoy hanging around these threads lately. The PGT from @Mr Kot was actually funny. And only one reply from @Soli and it’s locked.


I hope whoever is the fun-sucker, f***s off really fast. Your not welcome.

 

[Soli]

Man there is a real Killjoy hanging around these threads lately. The PGT from @Mr Kot was actually funny. And only one reply from @Soli and it’s locked.


I hope whoever is the fun-sucker, f***s off really fast. Your not welcome.

 

[harpoon]

Skinner is a one act pony that doesn't play any special teams well, has been awful here even on 2nd unit PP, is awful at EV and is -11 with much higher than expected GA relative to his toi and his usage. For Skinner to be -11 here is just continuation of the theme of him being a one zone player

You sure do love to go after the low hanging fruit. I’m just curious. You keep banging on and on about Skinner’s terrible +/- yet you somehow have nothing but praise for Kapanen. Kapanen’s +/- is as bad as Skinner’s in fewer games, similar TOI, but playing with better line mates. He’s also shooting double what Skinner’s SH% is.

 

[TheNumber4]

Consider the source. Cyclone is a knowledgeable guy but he’s extremely consistent with his takes on the team.

This guy has been a doubter ever since I’ve been on here lol. Shit loss. And to a certain extent he’s right because the Skinner/Arvidsson signings haven’t panned out at all. While LA has had a strong start like last year.

But as I said earlier, it’s December. A lot can happen in 46 games.

Yeh hes extremely consistent in that he expects us to lose against everyone and anyone.

Not sure what you mean. Pickard kept this from being a rout.

2 muffin goals from Pickard. And some solid saves. The muffin goals killed us.

 

[TheNumber4]

Have you ever read your own posts my dude?

Relevant comeback.

 

[TheNumber4]

I mean holy c'moly... you guys are missing the forest for the trees. Comparing Skinner to RNH is just... wow!

The obvious, and I mean OBVIOUS point is that coaches don't judge players based solely on their counting numbers. There are two ends of the ice, and when RNH isn't producing on offense, he's still contributing defensively.

I honestly don't know what games you are watching, but I've witnessed RNH save at least half-dozen sure goals against in the last 10 games alone. At least a few of those preserved wins.

McDavid holding his hand? Jeezus... RNH is playing third guy high on every shift in the Ozone so that McDavid can deliver us virtuoso offensive performances... do you even notice? He's not on McDavid's line to drive the net and tap in one-timer's like Hyman... he's on that line to play the defensive/traditional high forward role so that McDavid can be McDavid and Hyman can be Hyman.

I swear sometimes Soundwave... wow!

I can’t believe were 13 years into Nuges career here and people still need to be explained what his value outside of production is to the team.