Podcast (Audio) Ottawa Senators podcasts and blogs discussion

[SensHulk]

I don't disagree with you though in that that Bobby's twitter war may have been a resignation of sorts. If so, nothing Wally could do, full stop. But if Bob was still willing to play ball, and Wally terminated the partnership on the grounds of misaligned values, I'm not enthused.

Brent Wallace can stick by his values, and simultaneously address why he believes his values to be the correct values to his audience. He’s in the business of media, and if he believes his stance is correct, he should not hesitate to articulate why, and allow for a different perspective to do the same.

And again, he could moderate a conversation with Bobby in a constructive and tasteful way that would add value to the women's sports world, and drive ratings forward at the same time. If Bobby intended to stay on, that is.

What’s funny is ppl creating wild scenarios in their heads to convince themselves that Brent is the bad guy in all of this while ignoring the actual tweets Bobby Ryan posted, shows the incredible bias to prop up professional athletes (maybe ppl stilll doubting it should go bobby’s twitter and see his ‘replies’) here’s another example when he asked everyone to name 5-7 ncaa women’s players

 

[Tuna99]

Truth is nobody wanted to watch Bobby Ryan when he was here, and now no one wants to listen to him.

 

[Neil Patrick Harris]

I don't disagree with you though in that that Bobby's twitter war may have been a resignation of sorts. If so, nothing Wally could do, full stop. But if Bob was still willing to play ball, and Wally terminated the partnership on the grounds of misaligned values, I'm not enthused.

Brent Wallace can stick by his values, and simultaneously address why he believes his values to be the correct values to his audience. He’s in the business of media, and if he believes his stance is correct, he should not hesitate to articulate why, and allow for a different perspective to do the same.

And again, he could moderate a conversation with Bobby in a constructive and tasteful way that would add value to the women's sports world, and drive ratings forward at the same time. If Bobby intended to stay on, that is.

Why? Why should Wallace do any of what you suggested?

Bobby went out and kicked a hornet's nest to the point that it attracted the attention of both the hockey news media and the show's sponsors. And he left it to Wally to clean up his mess.

And again - the argument Bobby was making was that 'nobody cares about women's sports' - something that is *very* patently false. There isn't some debate about women's sports to be had here. What conversation can be had when one side can point at the ratings successes of the women's NCAA Final Four, and the other side can only reply in platitudes? God knows what kind of audience that debate would even attract, but I very much doubt it's the kind that Wallace would be interested in attracting.

This was a business decision, and Bobby Ryan was bad for business. The idea that Wallace missed some theoretical boat by not having some debate on the popularity of female sports is a pie in the sky idea.

What’s funny is ppl creating wild scenarios in their heads to convince themselves that Brent is the bad guy in all of this while ignoring the actual tweets Bobby Ryan posted, shows the incredible bias to prop up professional athletes (maybe ppl stilll doubting it should go bobby’s twitter and see his ‘replies’) here’s another example when he asked everyone to name 5-7 ncaa women’s players

See? This is the kinda stuff I'm talking about. How do you have a conservation or a debate when this is the best one side can do?

 

[Micklebot]

What’s funny is ppl creating wild scenarios in their heads to convince themselves that Brent is the bad guy in all of this while ignoring the actual tweets Bobby Ryan posted, shows the incredible bias to prop up professional athletes (maybe ppl stilll doubting it should go bobby’s twitter and see his ‘replies’) here’s another example when he asked everyone to name 5-7 ncaa women’s players

What's interesting is Meghan Chayka replied within minutes to Ryan's prompt to name 7 and did so with grace, listing off a bunch of players (spelled one wrong) and being respectful in doing so, had he respond to her with humility instead of to the people that took his original comment as insulting, it all could have been de-escalated pretty quickly, but instead it was crickets to her reply and fully engaging in the culture war with the others.

 

[Masked]

Truth is nobody wanted to watch Bobby Ryan when he was here, and now no one wants to listen to him.

That's not truth. That's you having a grudge against him.

 

[Tuna99]

That's not truth. That's you having a grudge against him.

Okay let me reframe that. When Ryan was here he did not want to commit to being I his best, he did the same to his broadcast partners.

Ryan is what he is - a hot mess of a man with $28 million dollars

 

[Crosby2010]

If I am watching women's hockey it had better be a Canada/USA Olympics gold medal game or my daughter had better be playing in it. Now, that's an opinion, you can disagree or agree but it is what it is. It isn't something I bother spending my time watching. Whether it is the WNBA or the PWHL it doesn't interest me at all. And I couldn't name you even three players in either league to be honest. Caitlin Clark. There's one I guess from the WNBA and I only know that because of the NBA All-Star game. So that's my hot take.

Now, do I say that if I have an employer who I know is going to go full Karen mode over it? No, I wouldn't bother. I'd do what most analysts do and pretend to be interested in it. Basically because I probably figure it is far more worthwhile to have a good job like that. Unless I had my own podcast and was my own boss or something, then I'd be more honest. I'll give Ryan credit, he was honest, we actually need a bit more of that. But if I were him, I'd just let the whole thing slide for now and wouldn't have said anything. At the moment the media for the first time in my life is specifically making sure they mention women's hockey/basketball probably because it is the "it" thing to do right now and most of these guys value their jobs.

 

[LuckyPierre]

If I am watching women's hockey it had better be a Canada/USA Olympics gold medal game or my daughter had better be playing in it. Now, that's an opinion, you can disagree or agree but it is what it is. It isn't something I bother spending my time watching. Whether it is the WNBA or the PWHL it doesn't interest me at all. And I couldn't name you even three players in either league to be honest. Caitlin Clark. There's one I guess from the WNBA and I only know that because of the NBA All-Star game. So that's my hot take.

Now, do I say that if I have an employer who I know is going to go full Karen mode over it? No, I wouldn't bother. I'd do what most analysts do and pretend to be interested in it. Basically because I probably figure it is far more worthwhile to have a good job like that. Unless I had my own podcast and was my own boss or something, then I'd be more honest. I'll give Ryan credit, he was honest, we actually need a bit more of that. But if I were him, I'd just let the whole thing slide for now and wouldn't have said anything. At the moment the media for the first time in my life is specifically making sure they mention women's hockey/basketball probably because it is the "it" thing to do right now and most of these guys value their jobs.

The 2014 Sochi women’s gold medal Can v USA game was right up there with the most thrilling games, any sport, I’ve ever seen.

Same with the 2020 women’s soccer gold medal Can v Swe match. Although it became ultimately so intense because of all of the penalty kick misses, which you wouldn’t expect to see at the highest level. Still, edge of the seat stuff.

As well, watching a Canadian woman advance in a grand slam tennis event, or tuning in to see Brooke Henderson in the hunt on a Sunday can be entertaining.

That said, as you pointed out, there’s a clear distinction between international best on best with national pride on the line, and women’s pro leagues. I had tuned into the PWHL out of curiosity, and it was great to see the buzz, and the emerging physicality in the game. However, with so much competition for entertainment dollars and screen time, it’s hard enough to watch a bad Senators on ice product, let alone tune on consistently to watch the women’s game. Their all star three on three also kind of thwarted my enjoyment of their product, because it was some of the sloppiest hockey I had ever seen televised.

My wife had stopped watching the Sens this year by the time the PWHL season rolled around, and couldn’t be bothered to take in a game. Said it’s just not the same.

I hope women’s high level sports continue to develop, but I do believe there is an element of denial involved in terms of the potential for prolonged support and financial viability. Hope I’m wrong.

My honest two cents, and as stated above, I’m not opposed to watching women’s sports generally if the gameplay and theatre passes the entertainment test.

 

[Micklebot]

If I am watching women's hockey it had better be a Canada/USA Olympics gold medal game or my daughter had better be playing in it. Now, that's an opinion, you can disagree or agree but it is what it is. It isn't something I bother spending my time watching. Whether it is the WNBA or the PWHL it doesn't interest me at all. And I couldn't name you even three players in either league to be honest. Caitlin Clark. There's one I guess from the WNBA and I only know that because of the NBA All-Star game. So that's my hot take.

Now, do I say that if I have an employer who I know is going to go full Karen mode over it? No, I wouldn't bother. I'd do what most analysts do and pretend to be interested in it. Basically because I probably figure it is far more worthwhile to have a good job like that. Unless I had my own podcast and was my own boss or something, then I'd be more honest. I'll give Ryan credit, he was honest, we actually need a bit more of that. But if I were him, I'd just let the whole thing slide for now and wouldn't have said anything. At the moment the media for the first time in my life is specifically making sure they mention women's hockey/basketball probably because it is the "it" thing to do right now and most of these guys value their jobs.

What you did was express an opinion about what you are interested in, whether you do so in front of an employee or not typically doesn't matter. I have little to no interest in golf, I can name Tiger Woods and few other names from the distant past but nobody current, and I am free to say I could care less about the masters, or that I can't understand the appeal, but when it's on TSN I don't suggest that nobody can name current players, call them liars who used Google when the do, or claim that it's time to go pretend golf is a thing as it pulls in record breaking ratings. I am sure you can appreciate the difference.

Now, I personally don't care whether he was being an idiot on twitter or not, I don't tune in to the podcast for culture war nonsense, I tune in for Sens talk, and on the podcast he typically sticks to that (his hoodie last episode aside), I don't have to read his tweets if I don't want to, and he's free to express his opinions, dumb ones or otherwise, as much as he wants, but I can appreciate that sponsors might be hesitant to associate themselves with him if he's a threat to kick up a hornets nest at any time, and freedom of speech is not freedom of consequences.

 

[SensHulk]

If I am watching women's hockey it had better be a Canada/USA Olympics gold medal game or my daughter had better be playing in it. Now, that's an opinion, you can disagree or agree but it is what it is. It isn't something I bother spending my time watching. Whether it is the WNBA or the PWHL it doesn't interest me at all. And I couldn't name you even three players in either league to be honest. Caitlin Clark. There's one I guess from the WNBA and I only know that because of the NBA All-Star game. So that's my hot take.

Now, do I say that if I have an employer who I know is going to go full Karen mode over I'd do what most analysts do and pretend to be interested in it Basically because I probably figure it is far more worthwhile to have a good job like that.

Can you prove the bolded part? Are you in the industry? If not, this is exactly why Bobby upset the ‘Karen’s’ as you put it because he tried to speak for others by proclaiming everyone was ‘pretending to be interested’. Anyone saying ppl are only feigning interest in women’s sports is a delusional moron like Bobby Ryan and there’s enough hard data to prove it

Again, I’m not into women’s sports. Here and there sure but it’s not for me. That is an opinion and I’m not gonna go out of my way to try to belittle or convince someone else that they are not really interested in that thing…that’s called being a narcissistic prick

 

[ACLEVERNAME]

Tuning into some of the American sports chatter shows on TSN1200 you'd be surprised to know there was even a men's tournament going on right now. Almost all the talk is of the women's game - it wasn't like this 5 years ago. Now is this because tastes have changed and the audience has shifted, or is a 'manufactured' push of an agenda on the industry? Remember 'Oscar's so white'? Same idea.

They tell you what to like and if you don't you're 'behind the times'. 'Freedom of speech but not from consequences' lol

 

[SensHulk]

Tuning into some of the American sports chatter shows on TSN1200 you'd be surprised to know there was even a men's tournament going on right now. Almost all the talk is of the women's game - it wasn't like this 5 years ago. Now is this because tastes have changed and the audience has shifted, or is a 'manufactured' push of an agenda on the industry? Remember 'Oscar's so white'? Same idea.

They tell you what to like and if you don't you're 'behind the times'. 'Freedom of speech but not from consequences' lol

Another moronic post. If you don’t want to watch the women’s sports, then don’t. I’m not either.

But just because things are a bit different from 5 years ago doesn’t mean it’s all a conspiracy and they’re out to get you. Landscapes change, can’t always be the same ol’ country club and ‘the way things were back in my day’ Same shit MAGA morons are parroting down here, now think about that

 

[Micklebot]

Tuning into some of the American sports chatter shows on TSN1200 you'd be surprised to know there was even a men's tournament going on right now. Almost all the talk is of the women's game - it wasn't like this 5 years ago. Now is this because tastes have changed and the audience has shifted, or is a 'manufactured' push of an agenda on the industry? Remember 'Oscar's so white'? Same idea.

They tell you what to like and if you don't you're 'behind the times'. 'Freedom of speech but not from consequences' lol

All actions have natural consequences, to think otherwise is tremendously niaive.

Don't put sunblock on before going to the beach, you may get a sunburn, do it repeatedly you may get skin cancer

Don't show up to work, you might lose your job.

Say dumb things or be an ass hole on twitter, you may have people think you're dumb or an ass hole, perhaps lose followers,

When you use your freedom of speech to suggest that the coverage of women's sports and viewership is nothing more than an agenda being push on the masses, well that's going to shape people's opinions on you; see? Consequences!

 

[BoardsofCanada]

I want you guys to be honest: who here sits down and watches regular season women's sports?

I'm not talking about the NCAA semifinals Caitlin Clark versus Angel Reese or an Olympic gold medal hockey game.

I tuned in to the Clark vs. Reese showdown the other night and was entertained. But I tuned in purely because of all the sensationalism surrounding Clark. Without her, how many would've tuned in?

But who here watches regular season women's sports? I am just curious.

I haven't watched a second of the PWHL and would never watch the WNBA. I wouldn't watch women's soccer, unless Canada was competing in the Olympics and same for the women's basketball team.

That said, I am a tennis fan, and genuinely enjoy watching women's tennis. I am glued to the TV if Leylah Fernandez is playing.

 

[Crosby2010]

What you did was express an opinion about what you are interested in, whether you do so in front of an employee or not typically doesn't matter. I have little to no interest in golf, I can name Tiger Woods and few other names from the distant past but nobody current, and I am free to say I could care less about the masters, or that I can't understand the appeal, but when it's on TSN I don't suggest that nobody can name current players, call them liars who used Google when the do, or claim that it's time to go pretend golf is a thing as it pulls in record breaking ratings. I am sure you can appreciate the difference.

Now, I personally don't care whether he was being an idiot on twitter or not, I don't tune in to the podcast for culture war nonsense, I tune in for Sens talk, and on the podcast he typically sticks to that (his hoodie last episode aside), I don't have to read his tweets if I don't want to, and he's free to express his opinions, dumb ones or otherwise, as much as he wants, but I can appreciate that sponsors might be hesitant to associate themselves with him if he's a threat to kick up a hornets nest at any time, and freedom of speech is not freedom of consequences.

See, I'm alright with the hornet's nest. A sponsor might not, and we can leave it up to them, and I am sure Ryan knew this regardless. My guess is he'd rather be honest than pretend, and I am taking a wild guess and saying that he doesn't need the money after playing in the NHL for 14 years. He could start his own podcast tomorrow and I am sure it would thrive, he's an ex-NHLer. If Paul Bissonette can do it then anyone can. I will say that I do think Biz has gotten a little too corporate for my liking though.

Tuning into some of the American sports chatter shows on TSN1200 you'd be surprised to know there was even a men's tournament going on right now. Almost all the talk is of the women's game - it wasn't like this 5 years ago. Now is this because tastes have changed and the audience has shifted, or is a 'manufactured' push of an agenda on the industry? Remember 'Oscar's so white'? Same idea.

They tell you what to like and if you don't you're 'behind the times'. 'Freedom of speech but not from consequences' lol

It doesn't feel organic I guess, and maybe that's the thing with me. We watch McDavid, Matthews, MacKinnon, etc. and then we are supposed to get propped up for the top women's hockey player in the world? Yeah, sorry, I am all hockey-ed out by then. Ditto with the WNBA. It is just a different league than the NBA. Can anyone even dunk? I am all about a free market and such so if a league can survive then bless their heart. I do remember the Oscars thing you were talking about. I can remember the fuss and I remember specifically saying that I knew they HAD to do the polar opposite the following year with the movie that was the best picture. And it was, the movie was "Moonlighting" with a black cast. So again, I'll say how organic and natural is all of this? The same thing applies here. Is there a specific push to try and persuade people to watch these leagues? Yeah, it looks like it. You don't have to convince me to watch an Oilers/Avs game. I'll watch it. But even watching a Coyotes/Sharks game that was on today can be painful, and that's professional men.

Can you prove the bolded part? Are you in the industry? If not, this is exactly why Bobby upset the ‘Karen’s’ as you put it because he tried to speak for others by proclaiming everyone was ‘pretending to be interested’. Anyone saying ppl are only feigning interest in women’s sports is a delusional moron like Bobby Ryan and there’s enough hard data to prove it

Again, I’m not into women’s sports. Here and there sure but it’s not for me. That is an opinion and I’m not gonna go out of my way to try to belittle or convince someone else that they are not really interested in that thing…that’s called being a narcissistic prick

I can't prove it, no. I mean how can I? No one that values their job is going to go against their network. For example, for years the WNBA couldn't draw flies. I don't even know what the attendance is now, or the ratings, but for the first time in my lifetime anyway I am seeing things I never saw before as far as coverage. People forget, there was women's basketball and hockey before this. It existed. The sports networks didn't care though, even up until a year or two ago. Is the push we are seeing organic? I'll leave that up to the viewer. The PWHL is mere months old. I am not going to predict it will last, nor that it won't. But these leagues do need help to get propped up or else no one cares about them. This is why the other attempts to start a women's league didn't last. We'll see.

 

[DrEasy]

See, I'm alright with the hornet's nest. A sponsor might not, and we can leave it up to them, and I am sure Ryan knew this regardless. My guess is he'd rather be honest than pretend, and I am taking a wild guess and saying that he doesn't need the money after playing in the NHL for 14 years. He could start his own podcast tomorrow and I am sure it would thrive, he's an ex-NHLer. If Paul Bissonette can do it then anyone can. I will say that I do think Biz has gotten a little too corporate for my liking though.



It doesn't feel organic I guess, and maybe that's the thing with me. We watch McDavid, Matthews, MacKinnon, etc. and then we are supposed to get propped up for the top women's hockey player in the world? Yeah, sorry, I am all hockey-ed out by then. Ditto with the WNBA. It is just a different league than the NBA. Can anyone even dunk? I am all about a free market and such so if a league can survive then bless their heart. I do remember the Oscars thing you were talking about. I can remember the fuss and I remember specifically saying that I knew they HAD to do the polar opposite the following year with the movie that was the best picture. And it was, the movie was "Moonlighting" with a black cast. So again, I'll say how organic and natural is all of this? The same thing applies here. Is there a specific push to try and persuade people to watch these leagues? Yeah, it looks like it. You don't have to convince me to watch an Oilers/Avs game. I'll watch it. But even watching a Coyotes/Sharks game that was on today can be painful, and that's professional men.



I can't prove it, no. I mean how can I? No one that values their job is going to go against their network. For example, for years the WNBA couldn't draw flies. I don't even know what the attendance is now, or the ratings, but for the first time in my lifetime anyway I am seeing things I never saw before as far as coverage. People forget, there was women's basketball and hockey before this. It existed. The sports networks didn't care though, even up until a year or two ago. Is the push we are seeing organic? I'll leave that up to the viewer. The PWHL is mere months old. I am not going to predict it will last, nor that it won't. But these leagues do need help to get propped up or else no one cares about them. This is why the other attempts to start a women's league didn't last. We'll see.

I agree with you that it doesn't feel organic, and I wish people would at least concede that point. Then again not much is organic when it comes to North American sports...

 

[Tuna99]

Just a shout out to Dean Brown for his call today near the start of the second period
Won’t post it because it’ll get political and deleted but a call I’ll never forget and im glad he said something about.

 

[Crosby2010]

Just a shout out to Dean Brown for his call today near the start of the second period
Won’t post it because it’ll get political and deleted but a call I’ll never forget and im glad he said something about.

Sounds intriguing. Can you give at least some sort of backstory to it? This would be tonight's game with the Sens and Caps right? If this is the Dean Brown I am thinking about.

 

[Micklebot]

Sounds intriguing. Can you give at least some sort of backstory to it? This would be tonight's game with the Sens and Caps right? If this is the Dean Brown I am thinking about.

Clearly refering to when he said Charlie lindgren catching with his right hand is weird...

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Gotta love the chuds backing Ryan with "yeah but he's right" when it has absolutely nothing to do with being right or not.

Ryan is entitled to his opinion and to share it. However he chose to be a dick about it and so now he deals with the fallout of choosing to be a dick.

No one would have cared about him saying women's sports are not popular, but people did notice him going full chud and yeah, chuds get cancelled because chuds are awful and people don't tend to want to associate with dicks.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

Gotta love the chuds backing Ryan with "yeah but he's right" when it has absolutely nothing to do with being right or not.

Ryan is entitled to his opinion and to share it. However he chose to be a dick about it and so now he deals with the fallout of choosing to be a dick.

No one would have cared about him saying women's sports are not popular, but people did notice him going full chud and yeah, chuds get cancelled because chuds are awful and people don't tend to want to associate with dicks.

Chudly Doowright done wrong

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Chudly Doowright done wrong

I mean, you are the poster boy for "consequences for thee but not for me".

I wonder how people you know IRL would react to knowing you are chud. You paid attention to Buffaloed.

 

[Sensatauro]

What a classic sens issue. The podcast is now unsubscribed in my lands. Brent is a clown, for reasons far beyond this incident.

 

[Joeyjoejoe]

Tuning into some of the American sports chatter shows on TSN1200 you'd be surprised to know there was even a men's tournament going on right now. Almost all the talk is of the women's game - it wasn't like this 5 years ago. Now is this because tastes have changed and the audience has shifted, or is a 'manufactured' push of an agenda on the industry? Remember 'Oscar's so white'? Same idea.

They tell you what to like and if you don't you're 'behind the times'. 'Freedom of speech but not from consequences' lol

Yeah that must be it, must be a conspiracy to force people to watch women sports, oh the horrors. What a child like response. this thread has gotten so f***ing dumb.

 

[5ive4Fighting]

I think a lot of what may appear inorganic is the coming together of a few different elements. There is no question that in many sports, women have historically simply been behind. Female athletes have not had the same history of decades of ever-improving development streams where the opportunity for excellence truly starts to emerge. Girls didn't get to routinely play in a kid's hockey league 50 years ago, but they did 25 years ago. Eventually that continued growth and support bears some fruit. I often hear people say they enjoy women's golf and tennis on par with men's. Some enjoy it more. The history of those pro sports for women began in the 50's and 60's. Basketball was at least 10 or 20 years later in the late 1970's. Hockey probably not until the 90's. The point is that we are on a timeline here that eventually produces a critical mass. Like all critical mass, it only seems sudden.

Secondly, high speed interent is now ubiquitous to the point of being in our literal pockets. The ability to increase access and exposure to games of whatever has grown exponentially in recent years without nearly the overhead of years past. TSN 1,2,3,4,5,LMNOP anyone? More exposure would be reasonably expected to drawn in both more players and more viewers.

Even the focus on trans women in sport has brought the topic of women's sport generally into the zeitgeist. If we're talking about it, we might be thinking about it more than we ever have. If we're thinking about it more than we ever have, that can change behaviours - in programmers and in viewers.

There is of course also some social element of "hey let's give this a boost because women deserve the same opportunites". And so what. It's not untrue, and it's extremely unlikely to be the most significant force in any changes we are seeing. There's nothing wrong and probably everything right with equity in promotion and access.