very much looking forward to baseball coming back, hoping the bridge over the queensway will help the crowds.
OT: Ottawa Champions - Ottawa's new Can-Am baseball team!
- Thread starter Canadian91
- Start date
FuriousSenator
Registered User
Not to mention once the LRT is finished...the stadium will be the best connected to transit of any in the city.
Canadian91
Registered User
Directly off the transitway and LRT.. no need for specialty 400 bus routes. They may have already solved the parking problem.
connor macdavid
Press Box Rat
This team lasts two years tops, and here's why.
1) The Rapidz failed in the same league in 2008, when the league was more stable than it is now and the Ottawa baseball market hadn't been out of action for two years.
2) There is no actual owner. The team is owned by the league.
3) If the FatCats averaged 2300 fans in their opening season (according to the club's wikipedia), and most of those were admittedly part of the massive 'free season ticket' campaign they had, how on earth will this team draw more than 2500-3000?
4) The Ottawa sports market is fickle as is. How the HELL are people going to respect a 'professional' baseball team named the 'Champions' when they are inevitably at the bottom of the standings? Selling the whole 'Champions in the Community' idea is great and all, but naming your team Champions without having played a single inning is disrespectful to professional athletes and teams the world over.
5) Competition with the Redblacks and, to a lesser extent, Fury FC, for marquee weekend home gates.
Baseball has failed here three times in the last eight years. Four times, if you include the failed Voyageurs who never took to the field.
This is just one last fledgling attempt by the Can-Am league to save itself in another market.
1) The Rapidz failed in the same league in 2008, when the league was more stable than it is now and the Ottawa baseball market hadn't been out of action for two years.
2) There is no actual owner. The team is owned by the league.
3) If the FatCats averaged 2300 fans in their opening season (according to the club's wikipedia), and most of those were admittedly part of the massive 'free season ticket' campaign they had, how on earth will this team draw more than 2500-3000?
4) The Ottawa sports market is fickle as is. How the HELL are people going to respect a 'professional' baseball team named the 'Champions' when they are inevitably at the bottom of the standings? Selling the whole 'Champions in the Community' idea is great and all, but naming your team Champions without having played a single inning is disrespectful to professional athletes and teams the world over.
5) Competition with the Redblacks and, to a lesser extent, Fury FC, for marquee weekend home gates.
Baseball has failed here three times in the last eight years. Four times, if you include the failed Voyageurs who never took to the field.
This is just one last fledgling attempt by the Can-Am league to save itself in another market.
Canadian91
Registered User
This team lasts two years tops, and here's why.
1) The Rapidz failed in the same league in 2008, when the league was more stable than it is now and the Ottawa baseball market hadn't been out of action for two years.
2) There is no actual owner. The team is owned by the league.
3) If the FatCats averaged 2300 fans in their opening season (according to the club's wikipedia), and most of those were admittedly part of the massive 'free season ticket' campaign they had, how on earth will this team draw more than 2500-3000?
4) The Ottawa sports market is fickle as is. How the HELL are people going to respect a 'professional' baseball team named the 'Champions' when they are inevitably at the bottom of the standings? Selling the whole 'Champions in the Community' idea is great and all, but naming your team Champions without having played a single inning is disrespectful to professional athletes and teams the world over.
5) Competition with the Redblacks and, to a lesser extent, Fury FC, for marquee weekend home gates.
Baseball has failed here three times in the last eight years. Four times, if you include the failed Voyageurs who never took to the field.
This is just one last fledgling attempt by the Can-Am league to save itself in another market.
1) If anything, the fanbase not having baseball for two years will help. Will fans be "rusty" and not want to go to baseball games at a cheap price? That's not how it works. As for previous failures, the Rapidz leaving had everything to do with ownership - same situation as the Rough Riders. Fans supported the Rapidz and the team averaged 2,500 people... that was with bad ownership.
2) You know who else was owned by the league? The Quebec Capitales. They are now the model franchise of the Can-Am League and one of the more successful in all of independent baseball. All due to Miles Wolff's leadership in a market where he couldn't even speak their language! I am not worried about ownership at all.
3) The free ticket campaign was in their final season, not their first. The team was averaging closer to 3,000-3,500 while giving tickets away - even then, how about the 4,120 average during the playoffs when ticket prices were pushing $20? This is a moot point.
4) That's your opinion - not sure how your belief about the Champions somehow disrespecting the entire sports world with a team name
laugh translates into bad attendance and no money coming into the franchise.5) You're right on this one, I'll give you that. It'll be harder when the Fury and RedBlacks have home dates, but luckily the Champions don't have to schedule all of their games in direct correlation with the OSEG teams. So it can be avoided to an extent, even though this does cause some issues.
All in all, you have basically no argument here. Only decent point is the competition in the sports market which exists now. Even then, it's not as if baseball is a dying sport here - the only failure came with the Lynx, 7 years ago. Since then it's been on the upswing, in a proper league that fits the market. Minor league sports is a tough business, but I wouldn't be writing off the Champions just yet and certainly not because of the points you listed.
connor macdavid
Press Box Rat
C91, if the FatCats drew just over 2000 in baseball's return to Ottawa after a three year absence, while playing exclusively on weekends for three months, how the HELL can you expect a team that will play 65-75 home games over the course of May-September to draw well?
Baseball on the upswing? How can you call the Rapidz, Voyageurs (Rapidz 2.0 failure), and the FatCats an upswing? I highly doubt that any of these teams were profitable/viable in the long-term.
Not to mention the stadium - how many millions of dollars of taxpayer money will be dumped into the aging stadium? Yes, it was a state-of-the-art facility twenty years ago when it was built, but now it's a dilapidated relic - I know that from firsthand experience.
Affiliated ball, Low-A in the NY-Penn League preferably, is the only brand of baseball that's viable in Ottawa long-term. And at that, it would probably have to be affiliated with the Blue Jays.
Baseball on the upswing? How can you call the Rapidz, Voyageurs (Rapidz 2.0 failure), and the FatCats an upswing? I highly doubt that any of these teams were profitable/viable in the long-term.
Not to mention the stadium - how many millions of dollars of taxpayer money will be dumped into the aging stadium? Yes, it was a state-of-the-art facility twenty years ago when it was built, but now it's a dilapidated relic - I know that from firsthand experience.
Affiliated ball, Low-A in the NY-Penn League preferably, is the only brand of baseball that's viable in Ottawa long-term. And at that, it would probably have to be affiliated with the Blue Jays.
Tap on the Ankle
Registered User
We are no more fickle than Vancouver, Toronto or Montreal.
I'm tired of this lame argument that "Ottawa is a fickle city, why can't we be like Toronto..." BS
Vancouver - look at the Grizzlies...NBA team, gone in 6 years, never averaged over 18,000 a game even in their first year.... Their Triple A team was gone in 2000. This is a city with a population of what 3-4 million?
Toronto - the 4th largest city in between the US and Canada... Blue Jays....no one cares about them unless they are a top team, or its bobblehead day. The have been ranked in the middle to bottom in attendance for the last 17 years in the AL. In 2010, the Jays averaged less than a 1000 more ticket sales a game than the Senators.... The Argos? in the last 20 years they have had 7 years where they averages less than 19,000 a game (Ottawa CFL only had 6 dating back to 1974), and are on their way to number #8 this year, and haven't drawn over 19,000 once. Hamilton in the last 30 years has 15 years of under 19,000 a game....The Raptors, have only averaged over 20,000 once in their history, their first year. Generally they have as mediocre at the box office as they have been on the court...they've bounced between #8-#19 in the league for ticket sales in the last 10 years.
Montreal - the 2nd biggest city in Canada.... Expos (my team)....gone, I don't think I need to say much..... Alouettes were gone for about 10 years.....
Edmonton - lost their triple A team in 2004
Calgary - lost their triple A team in 2002
Winnipeg - lost the Jets in 1996, drawing only 11,316 fans a game. They never drew over 14,000 a game in their history, despite having the capacity for over 15,000.
Quebec - lost the Nordiques in 1995, they drew fairly well in comparison. stadium held just over 15,000, and they stayed within 1000 of that for the most part, par over year they had under 14,000.
Conclusion:
Ottawa is no more or no less fickle than other cities in Canada
Canadian91
Registered User
C91, if the FatCats drew just over 2000 in baseball's return to Ottawa after a three year absence, while playing exclusively on weekends for three months, how the HELL can you expect a team that will play 65-75 home games over the course of May-September to draw well?
Baseball on the upswing? How can you call the Rapidz, Voyageurs (Rapidz 2.0 failure), and the FatCats an upswing? I highly doubt that any of these teams were profitable/viable in the long-term.
Not to mention the stadium - how many millions of dollars of taxpayer money will be dumped into the aging stadium? Yes, it was a state-of-the-art facility twenty years ago when it was built, but now it's a dilapidated relic - I know that from firsthand experience.
Affiliated ball, Low-A in the NY-Penn League preferably, is the only brand of baseball that's viable in Ottawa long-term. And at that, it would probably have to be affiliated with the Blue Jays.
...it wasn't a three-year absence? There was no baseball in Ottawa for one summer, in 2009. Not sure that you're knowledgable enough to be talking about the situation?
The amount of taxpayer money going into the stadium is the amount necessary to make this work. It's not being wasted. However, we can talk about wasted taxpayer money - in the proposed double-A deal. $40M vs the $3-4M that will be used here. You can be thankful for this team if you are worried about paying taxes.
connor macdavid
Press Box Rat
FuriousSenator
Registered User
I'll probably be prioritizing the fully pro teams like Fury and Redblacks this summer but I'll definitely take in a few Champions games. Once renovated (in progress), the stadium will be a beaut and after LRT goes in it'll be easily the most accessible sports venue in Ottawa.
connor macdavid
Press Box Rat
Champions just signed a guy who hasn't professional baseball in two full seasons...
Massarini last played for Colorado's High-A team.
Decent numbers over three years of pro ball, but he literally hasn't played in two years.
Massarini last played for Colorado's High-A team.
Decent numbers over three years of pro ball, but he literally hasn't played in two years.
C91, if the FatCats drew just over 2000 in baseball's return to Ottawa after a three year absence, while playing exclusively on weekends for three months, how the HELL can you expect a team that will play 65-75 home games over the course of May-September to draw well?
Baseball on the upswing? How can you call the Rapidz, Voyageurs (Rapidz 2.0 failure), and the FatCats an upswing? I highly doubt that any of these teams were profitable/viable in the long-term.
Not to mention the stadium - how many millions of dollars of taxpayer money will be dumped into the aging stadium? Yes, it was a state-of-the-art facility twenty years ago when it was built, but now it's a dilapidated relic - I know that from firsthand experience.
Affiliated ball, Low-A in the NY-Penn League preferably, is the only brand of baseball that's viable in Ottawa long-term. And at that, it would probably have to be affiliated with the Blue Jays.
The Fat Cats were in the Inter-county league teams would be lucky to get 200 out to a game more or less it is a semi pro league at best now with that said no questions its a good league but people saying they should get thousands a game please.
As for attendance games vs Winnipeg will draw very well I could see games selling out and games vs Japan should draw very well.
Welcome to 'Raymond Chabot Grant Thornton Park'
dear god, I know ever sponsor helps, but doesn't exactly roll off the tongue too well.
dear god, I know ever sponsor helps, but doesn't exactly roll off the tongue too well.
I will be going to games, as I am a big baseball fan...but I guess the best thing to do when you have a (IMO) weird team name is to have a weird name for the stadium
pepty
Let's win it all
- Feb 22, 2005
- 13,457
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connor macdavid
Press Box Rat
"Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the field, you're (0-8) Champs!"
RCGT Park! Can't actually say the full name because it'll take you till the 4th inning to finish it.
RCGT Park! Can't actually say the full name because it'll take you till the 4th inning to finish it.
FuriousSenator
Registered User
I'm actually kinda pumped about this. Hasn't happened since Jetform to my knowledge...
Really shows that this ownership group is doing this thing up right. Making all the rights calls and putting all the pieces in place for the team to be a success.
Hopefully the lawyers will pitch in some money for renos as well.
Really shows that this ownership group is doing this thing up right. Making all the rights calls and putting all the pieces in place for the team to be a success.
Hopefully the lawyers will pitch in some money for renos as well.
I meant a nickname for the stadium actually. Just something that is a bit quicker to say, kind of like Bell Centre -> Phone Booth GM Place -> Garage (those aren't shorter, but hopefully this one would be). I can't think of anything law-related that would fit. There's the Court Room, but that's pretty dumb for a stadium.
DrunkUncleDenis
Condra Fan
- Mar 27, 2012
- 11,825
- 1,694
I meant a nickname for the stadium actually. Just something that is a bit quicker to say, kind of like Bell Centre -> Phone Booth GM Place -> Garage (those aren't shorter, but hopefully this one would be). I can't think of anything law-related that would fit. There's the Court Room, but that's pretty dumb for a stadium.
The Firm.
Done.
DrunkUncleDenis
Condra Fan
- Mar 27, 2012
- 11,825
- 1,694
Ya so all those folks living in.... the Trainyards shopping complex.... can attend games?
I'm sort of half joking, I guess if they built it there was a need and demand for it, but I don't see many housing developments close by. Mind you, if it's summer time, people might be willing to walk longer distances (people living around St. Laurent south) to get to the game instead of bussing. I'm a West Ender, so what do I know.
DrunkUncleDenis
Condra Fan
- Mar 27, 2012
- 11,825
- 1,694
I meant a nickname for the stadium actually. Just something that is a bit quicker to say, kind of like Bell Centre -> Phone Booth GM Place -> Garage (those aren't shorter, but hopefully this one would be). I can't think of anything law-related that would fit. There's the Court Room, but that's pretty dumb for a stadium.
Do people really call the Bell Centre "the phone booth"? Weird.
