Proposal: OTT - TOR
- Thread starter GermanSpitfire
- Start date
- Jul 25, 2012
- 42,532
- 39,371
Large overpay by sens
GermanSpitfire
EU Video Scout for McKeen’s | Rest Easy #13
LOL, seriously? Aren’t you an OTT fan?
(I’m not a fan of either team btw)
From OTT’s perspective, I would *consider* either Greig OR the 7th for Nylander (but not necessarily do either unless I knew 100% Nylander was going to extend long term). And under no circumstance would I trade both pieces.
And Nylander is an absolutely fabulous player. For a team that’s right on the edge of competing for a Cup, maybe just one or two players away, you make that trade.
But it might be 2-3 years before OTT is a legit Cup contender (one of the top 8 or 10 teams in the league). So the timing is off for OTT to trade multiple high end young assets for a single older asset who is only locked up contractually for 2 years.
What OTT needs to do is stay the course with their top tier prospects like Greig or whoever they’re going to select at 7th. In 2 or 3 years, that’s when they’ll be at the correct point in their competitive cycle to start trading multiple high end futue assets.
If they want to trade some 2nds/3rds or sign a UFA or two, that’s totally fine. But it’s not the time yet to start mortgaging the future via trade assets.
SensFactor
Registered User
I think Ridley Greig is going to outstanding but he's only 19 right now. I'd do that trade. Nylander would give us the top 6 we need badly.
GermanSpitfire
EU Video Scout for McKeen’s | Rest Easy #13
The future is already here, it’s time to start to see consistency.
Senators need an experienced scoring winger to play in Ottawa’s top 6. Nylander has a contract the Sens could stomach given he only makes $6M in salary.
Leafs get some cost controlled young players and cap space.
Nylander is unequivocally better than Fiala yet people think Fiala has that sort of value, if Nylander were available he’d be a hot commodity and the Sens would have to overpay to make a trade like this with their rivals.
Akrapovince
Registered User
- May 19, 2017
- 3,859
- 4,350
Look at the contract that Nylander has, considering the divisional tax it’s hardly an overpay.
I wouldn’t do it personally because I value the potential three years of 925 and think we can use the Nylander money to find someone equivalent or close to him but he’s a hell of a player to put with Tkachuk and Norris.
Why are Toronto moving on from one of the better contracts on their team? He provides a lot of value and they need that.
I wouldn’t do it personally because I value the potential three years of 925 and think we can use the Nylander money to find someone equivalent or close to him but he’s a hell of a player to put with Tkachuk and Norris.
Why are Toronto moving on from one of the better contracts on their team? He provides a lot of value and they need that.
Leaf Fans
Registered User
- Sep 29, 2017
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The Devilish Buffoon
Registered User
- Dec 24, 2018
- 12,704
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His contract is too short for this to make sense for us.
I wouldn’t give that package for EITHER Nylander or Fiala.
The Senators are NOT a Nylander away from being a legit contender to win 1-2+ rounds in the playoffs.
First and foremost, they need a legit #1 G. Maybe Forsberg is that guy but maybe he isn’t. Maybe he’s a great backup or a decent 1B, but he’s got a way to go to prove he’s a legit #1 starter who can put the team on his back.
Second, they need to wait for guys like Sanderson, Greig, Thomson, Bernard-Docker or a few other players to arrive. They still have other holes (like RHD and D depth in general) and in their depth forwards. Those holes need to be filled in order to have a team that can go on a serious run.
Third, OTT may need some additional time for some great young NHLers to take that next step. Norris, Tkachuk, Batherson, Chabot have already arrived. But others like Pinto, Brannstrom, Formentin and Stutzle still need to get to that next level.
They’re not far off, but they’re not there yet. There are plenty of other moves they can make to greatly improve their team without giving up a 7th overall pick or their second best prospect in Greig.
Adele Dazeem
Registered User
Are you trying to be nice to the Leafs fans who just got their hearts broken?
Nylander isn't the top-6 winger the Sens should be targeting.
GermanSpitfire
EU Video Scout for McKeen’s | Rest Easy #13
Ottawa has been rebuilding since 2018. You can’t rebuild by just continuously stock piling young players and picks and hope they pan out. That’s how you end up as a early 2010’s Oilers or a Modern Day Sabres.
Maybe a little
SI90
Registered User
Think that’s a fair offer and would definitely help the leafs cap situation
The Sabres didn't stock up on young players and picks. They traded most of them away between 2014-16 for RoR, Kane, Bogosian, Lehner.
I am Canadian
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WingsMJN2965
Registered User
- Oct 13, 2017
- 18,106
- 17,700
The only thing that will fix Toronto is moving one of the big 3. Nobody wants to admit it, but the right move here is opening up calls on Matthews. Franchise changing trajectory, and you probably have 30 teams calling. Because you can break the record for years without winning a cup with him, or you can do it without him, but you aren't ending that drought until you solve the math problem that is the unbalanced cap. If you want to be a real gangster, you move Marner too. Come back with a King's ransom of blue chippers on cheap deals and make another run in a year or two. You can call me crazy but this is like watching a Greek tragedy, everyone can see how it is going to end but the hubris of the people who can fix it won't let it happen.
You are using examples of 2 other teams who have absolutely NOTHING to do with the Ottawa Senators to try to make a point that is not applicable.
You’re trying to paint 3 different teams/situations with the same brush, which is logical fallacy.
BUF and EDM made very specific mistakes that undermined the success of their rebuilds and caused them to be much longer. And unless OTT makes the same mistakes (and it’s illogical to simply assume they will), they are not destined to have the same results.
For example, look at this…
This ^
AND then BUF also struck out on a few others, like Alex Nylander 8th overall, and having virtually zero impact players from any of their high second round picks.
EDM made a bunch of mistakes or misses — such as Nail Yakupov, trading a first overall pick for a guy who left the organization (Hall>Larsson), an absolutely terrible trade of a 1st (who we now know would have been Eriksson-Ek if they kept the pick) + high 2nd rounder for Griffin Reinhardt, and having very, very little success with picks outside the first round over many years. And EDM in particular did a piss-poor job at getting the kind of quality & character depth players in the bottom half of their D and F group that you need to win and also need to surround your top young players so it’s not a shitty, negative losing environment. (That is specifically the element that both Chicago and Pittsburgh had to surround Toews/Kane and Sid/Geno/Letang that allowed them to compete so quickly and win multiple cups).
OTT, conversely, has been one of the top 5 or so drafting teams in the NHL. And now, like BUF (who is now also on the right track) shoils be 1-2 years away from legitimately competing to make the playoffs and continuing to improve from there.
OTT is on track to be a playoff team in a year or two, and if their existing players & prospects develop well (to say nothing of this year’s 7th overall or other future picks), be on track to be a legit cup contender in about 3 years — and can keep that window open strong and long if they don’t make stupid short-sighted moves.
As I said, you’re not a Nylander-away from contending. You want to plug holes, go sign some UFAs like getting Nick Paul back here in the summer.
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Nac Mac Feegle
wee & free
- Jun 10, 2011
- 35,398
- 9,817
That's a bad trade for Ottawa. Not just as an overpayment, but Ottawa will be boned when Murray inevitably goes down with another injury and we only have one NHL-capable goalie left.
We're not at that point where we should be selling the farm for a "last piece" style trade.
We're not at that point where we should be selling the farm for a "last piece" style trade.
ReginKarlssonLehner
Let's Win It All
For 7th overall + small piece sure. No way we trading both.
Nylander absolutely is a top 6 winger we should be targetting. His cap situation makes it a debate not to, but his abilities would mesh perfectly with our group. IMO, Toronto not utilizing him to his best ability.
Nylander absolutely is a top 6 winger we should be targetting. His cap situation makes it a debate not to, but his abilities would mesh perfectly with our group. IMO, Toronto not utilizing him to his best ability.
You don’t trade the 7th overall puck for two years of William Nylander.
Better off going after fiala. You can at least extend him long term right now as long as he wants
NyQuil
Big F$&*in Q
Its not that bad.
Nylander is a known offensive commodity and while Grieg and the 7th are valuable potential pieces, they still represent potential.
Guys like Nylander under a reasonable contract aren’t usually available.
It’s better than that insane Chabot offer.
Nylander is a known offensive commodity and while Grieg and the 7th are valuable potential pieces, they still represent potential.
Guys like Nylander under a reasonable contract aren’t usually available.
It’s better than that insane Chabot offer.
BondraTime
Registered User
It would be fine to go after Nylander if he was signed longer than 2 seasons or the Sens could negotiate a deal prior to the trade. There’s 0 chance he’s going to stay in Ottawa, and shouldn’t be an option for the Sens. The above price is definitely more than the Sens should be paying for pretty much anyone. 1 or the other, not both.
Sens need a guy signed through the Sens competitive window, which is 2023-2027 or so. Nylander at 2 years doesn’t fit that.
Sens need a guy signed through the Sens competitive window, which is 2023-2027 or so. Nylander at 2 years doesn’t fit that.
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