Oshawa Generals 2024-25 Season Thread, Part 1

[dirty12]

Exactly nobody’s going to know for about 2-3 years.

If Oshawa wins the championship gotta say a championship surely wins the trade. If they don’t win and choke in the second round for instance then they gave up 2 future great OHL players and a bunch of picks for nothing.

Naming a winner of the trade in November makes absolutely 0 sense

Also about Owen Sounds draft picks what if 2 of those guys they get from draft picks in the 2nd/3rd end up being NHL guys? Lots of things to consider.

Barlow minus Bedowski and Delisle is not nearly the upgrade of Rehkopf or for that matter Uronen for pick(s). Bedowski was the gens #3 D imo, that is what made the trade costly. The team will either need to trade for a top 4; or upgrade D'Amato and add a reliable depth D. Giving up additional 2,3,4 picks rather than Bedowski would have been preferable I think; and because of DeGray's demands, I think the colts did the right thing passing on Barlow.

 

[OMG67]

I can definitely see Oshawa moving Smith at the deadline if needed.

The way I see it. Oshawa needs 2 more Dman and 1 Forward. Likely 1 of the Dman will be to upgrade over D'Amato as an OA, another Dman to replace Rodriguez, then another Forward as it's very unlikely Roobroeck returns now.

I agree with this. But, there were early rumblings that Oshawa committed to Smith and the family moved to Oshawa. Is that true? I don’t know, just what I read on here.

I am not sure how Oshawa will manage to acquire those three pieces to really nail the door shut but I cannot see them being able to do it without trading Smith.

I also feel that list wouldn’t be two D-Men if Bedkowski weren’t a part of the Barlow deal. This is why I am intrigued to get to the deadline to see what the real prices are and whether Oshawa proved to get a good deal on Barlow or whether they paid too much.

The one caveat to all of this is looking at the Rehkopf and Leenders deal, we see two teams that were loaded with expendable draft picks so they had the luxury of overpaying to a degree. Oshawa wasn’t’ in that same position. So, did Oshawa overpay because those other two teams were flush with picks and overpaid? Or, is that the true market value this year? We won’t know until the deadline when we see the likes of Msuty, Pinelli, Luchanko, Andonovski, and Romani all potentially traded.

 

[HUSH10]

I agree with this. But, there were early rumblings that Oshawa committed to Smith and the family moved to Oshawa. Is that true? I don’t know, just what I read on here.

I am not sure how Oshawa will manage to acquire those three pieces to really nail the door shut but I cannot see them being able to do it without trading Smith.

I also feel that list wouldn’t be two D-Men if Bedkowski weren’t a part of the Barlow deal. This is why I am intrigued to get to the deadline to see what the real prices are and whether Oshawa proved to get a good deal on Barlow or whether they paid too much.

The one caveat to all of this is looking at the Rehkopf and Leenders deal, we see two teams that were loaded with expendable draft picks so they had the luxury of overpaying to a degree. Oshawa wasn’t’ in that same position. So, did Oshawa overpay because those other two teams were flush with picks and overpaid? Or, is that the true market value this year? We won’t know until the deadline when we see the likes of Msuty, Pinelli, Luchanko, Andonovski, and Romani all potentially traded.

I can't speak to the Brady Smith family matters. I am not aware as such.

I think if Smith and their remaining picks are available, they can make it happen.

Roger Hunt is one of the smarter GMs in the league so I have come to trust his process. Time will tell in 2 months.

 

[OMG67]

I can't speak to the Brady Smith family matters. I am not aware as such.

I think if Smith and their remaining picks are available, they can make it happen.

Roger Hunt is one of the smarter GMs in the league so I have come to trust his process. Time will tell in 2 months.

Maybe someone can back me up on this to save me the time from scrolling back to the comment regarding Brady Smith and them making a commitment to keeping him? Anyone?

It will really come down to the level of player that the Generals are targeting. As of right now, the Generals have two distant 2nds and two distant 3rds plus a lot of 4ths. Plus they have Smith. I don’t think they can afford to move Griffin but there is a possibility depending on the package where they could move him I guess.

Here is where the Barlow trade value comes into play significantly. If the Barlow trade value is accurate and on point for market value, then the assets Oshawa has to trade are relatively meaningless. To get one more comparable player to Barlow, it would literally need to include Brady Smith plus the two 2nds and one 3rd (comparable to the Taylor plus picks for Owen Beck last year). So, IMO, Oshawa cannot fill three holes and get another impact player back IF IF IF the true market value for Barlow was accurate and not an overpay. If the Generals are able to get Konnor Smith, Andonvovski and Cooper Foster or some sort of similar group of players then the prices will have to be relatively cheaper at the deadline than the comparable for Barlow early. That has and will continue to be my point.

Effectively speaking, if the Barlow deal was a good deal and fair market value, how on Earth can the Generals fans think for a second that they can get more than one more impactful player? They may be able to get that one impactful player but the remainder of the players will be depth players at best. The only way they can get multiple impact players is if the market folds in and the players are available cheap which by definition makes the Barlow trade an overpay.

 

[HUSH10]

Maybe someone can back me up on this to save me the time from scrolling back to the comment regarding Brady Smith and them making a commitment to keeping him? Anyone?

It will really come down to the level of player that the Generals are targeting. As of right now, the Generals have two distant 2nds and two distant 3rds plus a lot of 4ths. Plus they have Smith. I don’t think they can afford to move Griffin but there is a possibility depending on the package where they could move him I guess.

Here is where the Barlow trade value comes into play significantly. If the Barlow trade value is accurate and on point for market value, then the assets Oshawa has to trade are relatively meaningless. To get one more comparable player to Barlow, it would literally need to include Brady Smith plus the two 2nds and one 3rd (comparable to the Taylor plus picks for Owen Beck last year). So, IMO, Oshawa cannot fill three holes and get another impact player back IF IF IF the true market value for Barlow was accurate and not an overpay. If the Generals are able to get Konnor Smith, Andonvovski and Cooper Foster or some sort of similar group of players then the prices will have to be relatively cheaper at the deadline than the comparable for Barlow early. That has and will continue to be my point.

Effectively speaking, if the Barlow deal was a good deal and fair market value, how on Earth can the Generals fans think for a second that they can get more than one more impactful player? They may be able to get that one impactful player but the remainder of the players will be depth players at best. The only way they can get multiple impact players is if the market folds in and the players are available cheap which by definition makes the Barlow trade an overpay.

For Defence, we just need Depth and Size. Not necessarily a TOP 2 D man. Perhaps a Mayich could help fill a role on Defence for cheaper than a K.Smith, Ride, or Andonovski

 

[OMG67]

For Defence, we just need Depth and Size. Not necessarily a TOP 2 D man. Perhaps a Mayich could help fill a role on Defence for cheaper than a K.Smith, Ride, or Andonovski

And if that is the approach then I 100% agree with you. I think there are unrealistic expectations. However, at the same time, why trade Smith if you aren’t getting an Impact player? Sort of goes hand in hand, no?

Mayich won’t be available I don’t think. He is worth more to the 67’s than a 2nd and 3rd round pick.

 

[HUSH10]

And if that is the approach then I 100% agree with you. I think there are unrealistic expectations. However, at the same time, why trade Smith if you aren’t getting an Impact player? Sort of goes hand in hand, no?

Smith may be used to get the Forward we need but like I said, I feel we need 2 Dman and not all of them have ti be expensive. Just veteran Depth. Mayich wouldn't cost too much IMO

 

[OMG67]

Smith may be used to get the Forward we need but like I said, I feel we need 2 Dman and not all of them have ti be expensive. Just veteran Depth. Mayich wouldn't cost too much IMO

Mayich won’t be available and if he is, he will only be available for an overpay. He is the defence partner for Eshkawkogan and Eshkawkogan is flourishing. I cannot see them move Mayich for pennies.

IMO, Mayich is the highest valued OA on the 67’s. If they move him it would need to be for a value that represents him as the highest value. The reality is the rest of the league wouldn’t value Mayich as high as Ottawa. Mayich would need to request a trade I think.

 

[OMG67]

With respect to OA’s in general, the Contenders (with the exception of Brampton) all have three capable OA’s. Any contender that is looking for an upgrade will have to pay a true upgrade price. For example, it would not make sense for Oshawa to try to justify trading for a player like Mayich for a 4th round pick. The 3rd best OA on Oshawa is worth that or more already.

Any contender making an OA acquisition will likely pay a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th. Why? Because the contender is trying to acquire a specific player. That alone makes the player valuable. If I am a team holding a player that a contender wants, I am not trading that player for a discount. Why? Why take a 3rd or 4th round pick from a contender for an OA? The contender wanting to add my player proves my player is a contender capable OA. That makes the player worth more.

If I am Owen Sound holding Konnor Smith and the offers I am getting from a contender are in line with a 3rd and 5th round pick, then the contender really doesn’t value the player so why would I engage? I would wait until the contender comes with a real offer even if it means there is no trade. Odds are pretty good that the contender is only trying to use that offer as leverage with another team.

Odds are pretty good that OS could trade Konnor Smith to a middling team for a 3rd and 5th so what are they losing for holding ground witht he Contender?

 

[HUSH10]

With respect to OA’s in general, the Contenders (with the exception of Brampton) all have three capable OA’s. Any contender that is looking for an upgrade will have to pay a true upgrade price. For example, it would not make sense for Oshawa to try to justify trading for a player like Mayich for a 4th round pick. The 3rd best OA on Oshawa is worth that or more already.

Any contender making an OA acquisition will likely pay a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th. Why? Because the contender is trying to acquire a specific player. That alone makes the player valuable. If I am a team holding a player that a contender wants, I am not trading that player for a discount. Why? Why take a 3rd or 4th round pick from a contender for an OA? The contender wanting to add my player proves my player is a contender capable OA. That makes the player worth more.

If I am Owen Sound holding Konnor Smith and the offers I am getting from a contender are in line with a 3rd and 5th round pick, then the contender really doesn’t value the player so why would I engage? I would wait until the contender comes with a real offer even if it means there is no trade. Odds are pretty good that the contender is only trying to use that offer as leverage with another team.

Odds are pretty good that OS could trade Konnor Smith to a middling team for a 3rd and 5th so what are they losing for holding ground witht he Contender?

I think you give D'Amato too much credit. I would happily take a Mayich or a K Smith over him.

I really do not see D'Amato being on this team in 2 months. If we upgrade our Defensive OA, it will be to trade D'amato plus 2 picks is my guess.

 

[HUSH10]

I also want to clarify, I'm not saying Mayich is Oshawa top choice. He is just the kind of defender that Oshawa needs imo.

Top 5 Dman i think Oshawa should pursue if available are (no particular order)
K.Smith
Andonovski
Ride
Mayich
Gibson (I don't know as much about him but I've heard other speak high of him so I will add him to the list)

 

[OMG67]

I think you give D'Amato too much credit. I would happily take a Mayich or a K Smith over him.

I really do not see D'Amato being on this team in 2 months. If we upgrade our Defensive OA, it will be to trade D'amato plus 2 picks is my guess.

It is not about giving Player “A” too much credit. Brampton has an open OA slot. They would be doing a disservice to the rest of the team if they acquired a low cost OA. They should and will target a high end OA. That player should cost in the range of a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th.

Maybe Oshawa can acquire an OA to replace D’Amato and use him in the deal but it should still cost Oshawa a 2nd and a 3rd if they expect to get back a key OA player.

The OA market is saturated which means players that would normally go for a decent value are worthless but the OA’s that are considered more impact will not have a lower value. They will still be the targets of the contenders which makes them valuable. No contender is going to go out there and marginally upgrade their OA for a 5th round pick. Why bother? Oshawa isn’t going to spend a 4th round pick and D’Amato to get a 3rd pairing D-Man. They will want an impactful physical D-Man and that player will still cost normal value. It is not like there are 10 of those out there. There are maybe three? There are probably a dozen .9 point per game average to below average sized wingers though. If Brampton were to decide they only wanted a 3rd line smallish winger, they could get one for cheap but what does that say to their players? Not much of a motivator.

Barrie paid pretty big for Wakely. Great player for sure. No doubt. Kingston paid big for Guindon (a centre which there are less of). Windsor paid for Mathurin. Brampton paid for Sova. Even Niagara paid for VanVliet who is a Tier II OA.

There will be no bargains out there for the contenders in the OA market unless they are targeting average wingers. Any moves that contenders make in the OA market will equate to at least a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th give or take.

 

[OMG67]

I also want to clarify, I'm not saying Mayich is Oshawa top choice. He is just the kind of defender that Oshawa needs imo.

Top 5 Dman i think Oshawa should pursue if available are (no particular order)
K.Smith
Andonovski
Ride
Mayich
Gibson (I don't know as much about him but I've heard other speak high of him so I will add him to the list)

Gibson and Andonovski will likely require Smith in return because Oshawa doesn’t have the draft picks and lessor prospects to make an equatable deal. I think those two guys will end up going to a team with more trade flexibility but Oshawa can move Brady Smith so that may tip the scales in their favour. The issue is it will deplete a lot of assets and make it super hard to fill the other holes.

Konnor Smith is the most likely target but it will be like I have said… at least a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th, probably more.

Ride? I am not sure what motivates North Bay but I think he is like Mayich, a player I don’t see being made available and if he is available, it probably won’t be at a price worth it. If I were Oshawa, I wouldn’t be ponying up for the price both Ottawa and North Bay will want for those two players. They won’t be worth it becuase their role on OShawa will not be as important, thus the value gap.

 

[HUSH10]

Gibson and Andonovski will likely require Smith in return because Oshawa doesn’t have the draft picks and lessor prospects to make an equatable deal. I think those two guys will end up going to a team with more trade flexibility but Oshawa can move Brady Smith so that may tip the scales in their favour. The issue is it will deplete a lot of assets and make it super hard to fill the other holes.

Konnor Smith is the most likely target but it will be like I have said… at least a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th, probably more.

Ride? I am not sure what motivates North Bay but I think he is like Mayich, a player I don’t see being made available and if he is available, it probably won’t be at a price worth it. If I were Oshawa, I wouldn’t be ponying up for the price both Ottawa and North Bay will want for those two players. They won’t be worth it becuase their role on OShawa will not be as important, thus the value gap.

There's also others out there that could help fill depth that we aren't thinking of. No suspected Sandhu last year and he is now playing regularly playing in the 1st line D every night. Time will tell. There is a lot out there defensively that is better than Rodeiguez as a regular starter as well.

 

[OMG67]

There's also others out there that could help fill depth that we aren't thinking of. No suspected Sandhu last year and he is now playing regularly playing in the 1st line D every night. Time will tell. There is a lot out there defensively that is better than Rodeiguez as a regular starter as well.

100%. And that is where those 4th round picks come into play.

I am only suggesting that unless you want three depth players, it will be tough to not use Brady Smith and if you use Brady Smith, you want to use him on an impact player but the impact player will also require likely two 2nds and a 3rd with Smith. That restricts the picks left for depth players.

This is why it is really tricky for Oshawa. Other teams have so much more flexibility to make trades work.

I think Oshawa ends up with Konnor Smith plus another decent depth player for Brady Smith. Oshawa may get a draft pick back in that deal as well. That then opens the door to then package the draft picks for another impact player. Then they round it out with another cheap depth winger or something.

I know using Brady Smith to get Konnor Smith seems like overkill but it opens up more options. Definitely not what I would prefer to do but it may be the path of least resistance.

 

[HUSH10]

100%. And that is where those 4th round picks come into play.

I am only suggesting that unless you want three depth players, it will be tough to not use Brady Smith and if you use Brady Smith, you want to use him on an impact player but the impact player will also require likely two 2nds and a 3rd with Smith. That restricts the picks left for depth players.

This is why it is really tricky for Oshawa. Other teams have so much more flexibility to make trades work.

I think Oshawa ends up with Konnor Smith plus another decent depth player for Brady Smith. Oshawa may get a draft pick back in that deal as well. That then opens the door to then package the draft picks for another impact player. Then they round it out with another cheap depth winger or something.

I know using Brady Smith to get Konnor Smith seems like overkill but it opens up more options. Definitely not what I would prefer to do but it may be the path of least resistance.

I can see K.Smith being for D'amato plus 2 or 3 picks. Circa Moore/Serpa.

Brady Smith would be used to get the impactful forward.

The remainder would be packaged for another depth Dman. This is how I see it going.

 

[Generalsupdates]

I can see K.Smith being for D'amato plus 2 or 3 picks. Circa Moore/Serpa.

Brady Smith would be used to get the impactful forward.

The remainder would be packaged for another depth Dman. This is how I see it going.

I’d be more inclined to use Smith to get a stud D (Allen in GUE, Gibson in SSM, etc.) and use picks to add a middle 6 F and a bottom 6 F

 

[dirty12]

Gibson and Andonovski will likely require Smith in return because Oshawa doesn’t have the draft picks and lessor prospects to make an equatable deal. I think those two guys will end up going to a team with more trade flexibility but Oshawa can move Brady Smith so that may tip the scales in their favour. The issue is it will deplete a lot of assets and make it super hard to fill the other holes.

Konnor Smith is the most likely target but it will be like I have said… at least a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th, probably more.

Ride? I am not sure what motivates North Bay but I think he is like Mayich, a player I don’t see being made available and if he is available, it probably won’t be at a price worth it. If I were Oshawa, I wouldn’t be ponying up for the price both Ottawa and North Bay will want for those two players. They won’t be worth it becuase their role on OShawa will not be as important, thus the value gap.

I can't imagine the return NB would want for Ride; Ride and Kennedy stay where they are, I think.

I read Smith will not be traded as well, multiple times courtesy of GU.

 

[Generalsupdates]

I read Smith will not be traded as well, multiple times courtesy of GU.

That was the rumour. But Smith's agent is also the agent for Barlow, Danford, and Sennecke. So could see him talking the Smith family into a move if it's to a team who's traditionally run well and giving those players the best run possible this year. Will be interesting to see what happens.

He's also the agent for Luchanko (and Rasmus Kumpulainen, which is why he went to the Gens last year)

 

[OMG67]

I can see K.Smith being for D'amato plus 2 or 3 picks. Circa Moore/Serpa.

Brady Smith would be used to get the impactful forward.

The remainder would be packaged for another depth Dman. This is how I see it going.

Again, I don’t think you have the picks unless your definition of impactful forward is different than mine. I define the impactful forwards at this year’s deadline to be Pinelli, Musty, Luchanko, Romani etc…. I don’t think you can get any of those players using Brady Smith without also adding at least a 2nd and 3rd, probably more. Those extra draft picks added to Brady Smith are what sort of kill the Generals IMO. Last year Beck went for two 2nds, a 3rd, and Taylor. Taylor and Brady Smith would be comparable in value year over year. If the Gens make a deal like that, they wouldn’t get Konnor Smith. They’d have to hope to fall into another Sandhu type player and another Punnett type deal. That is a lot to ask.

If the Generals had a lot of draft picks then they could maybe do a draft pick trade or if they had the two players they already used in the Barlow deal, they could soften the blow a bit like they did in the Barlow deal but they don’t. I don’t see any other young players on the gens roster worth anything as meaningful components.

If you suggest a player like Cooper Foster is an impact forward then yes, I could see that. But, I consider players like Foster as being Tier II forwards.

If Oshawa were to wait until the last minute and both Pinelli and Romani were still on the board, they may be able to get a good deal for one of them. I’ve sort of said that about this deadline. There may be a good deal to be had for the team that is most patient. I;m not sure there are enough of those guys out there this year, especially forwards. There are almost as many impact defence as there are forwards. A few of the teams I thought would be clear sellers are not that at all.

The Petes have no impact players to sell. There are some indications that North Bay expects Romani to be returned as an OA so he may not end up being available. Ottawa has Pinelli likely to move as well as potentially Mews. I thought Saginaw may decide to sell this year to hedge against losing both Misa and Parekh to the NHL early but it doesn’t look like that will happen. Even the Sault is doing well right now and may not be motivated to move Gibson. Guelph has Luchanko but they may wait for next deadline to move him.

I’m just not sure where all these potential trade targets are going to come from right now. This is one of the reasons why I am suggesting we need to wait until closer to the deadline to get a sense of what the market will look like.

That was the rumour. But Smith's agent is also the agent for Barlow, Danford, and Sennecke. So could see him talking the Smith family into a move if it's to a team who's traditionally run well and giving those players the best run possible this year. Will be interesting to see what happens

I can see that for sure. It does make sense.

The one thing we do know is Danford and Senneke will both net some solid assets next year.

 

[HUSH10]

I can see that for sure. It does make sense.

The one thing we do know is Danford and Senneke will both net some solid assets next year.

As will Marrelli

 

[dirty12]

As will Marrelli

not sure an OA season is in store for Marrelli with the stat line he is accumulating

 

[Generalsupdates]

not sure an OA season is in store for Marrelli with the stat line he is accumulating

No Marrelli is definitely gone after this season, he's been arguably the best D in the league up until this point

 

[Fischhaber]

With respect to OA’s in general, the Contenders (with the exception of Brampton) all have three capable OA’s. Any contender that is looking for an upgrade will have to pay a true upgrade price. For example, it would not make sense for Oshawa to try to justify trading for a player like Mayich for a 4th round pick. The 3rd best OA on Oshawa is worth that or more already.

Any contender making an OA acquisition will likely pay a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th. Why? Because the contender is trying to acquire a specific player. That alone makes the player valuable. If I am a team holding a player that a contender wants, I am not trading that player for a discount. Why? Why take a 3rd or 4th round pick from a contender for an OA? The contender wanting to add my player proves my player is a contender capable OA. That makes the player worth more.

If I am Owen Sound holding Konnor Smith and the offers I am getting from a contender are in line with a 3rd and 5th round pick, then the contender really doesn’t value the player so why would I engage? I would wait until the contender comes with a real offer even if it means there is no trade. Odds are pretty good that the contender is only trying to use that offer as leverage with another team.

Odds are pretty good that OS could trade Konnor Smith to a middling team for a 3rd and 5th so what are they losing for holding ground witht he Contender?

I expect Brampton to aim higher than an OA worth a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th. That's what second tier guys like Jax Dubois and Roberto Mancini went for last year. They have the picks to get a top flight player.

 

[dirty12]

I expect Brampton to aim higher than an OA worth a 2nd, 3rd, and 5th. That's what second tier guys like Jax Dubois and Roberto Mancini went for last year. They have the picks to get a top flight player.

Who’s buying the remaining top OAs? How high could prices get in a bidding war between Brampton and Kingston for Allard, Misajelic, and Swick?