Post-Game Talk: Oilers lose Duck Hunt

[Juxta Position]

But they didn't win. I realize how unfair that sounds but they failed to win the big prize. "Cup or bust" was the manta. McDavid and Draisatl are world class talents capable of carrying a team very far, but we already know that simply isn't enough. Ken Holland has also left this team bereft of up and coming prospects, and the only ones we did have are gone for a pittance.

Katz sucks because he never bothered to hire competent hockey minds in important positions and the only reason this team is even relevant today is because they won a draft lottery a decade ago. They've hitched their wagon now to Jackson and Bowman who have done an admirable job of tanking a Stanley Cup contender into a middling team. Sure, there's a chance this team has another amazing run in them but their body of work this year hasn't inspired that sort of confidence. They really don't look like the team they were last year, even when they were healthy. There's regression across the board, both on and off the ice. The team has had a weakness in net all year that management just flat out refused to address, and if the plan is just "Let's run with Pickard", I'm sorry... That's not going to end with a Stanley Cup.

I do agree with a lot of what you said there, but there are a few problems with it as well.

First, you say didn't hire competent hockey minds, wel that can't be the case because this is hockey and not basketball, where one player cannot win you a championship. Yes, having McDavid was huge, but there does have to be a support system around him to win, and over the last 3 years, the Oilers have won more playoff rounds than any team in the western conference. Yes, I get they didn't win the cup, but they were so close that it came down to a literal coin flip more so than actual skill.

The Oilers, when fully healthy, whether you or others want to admit it, are still Stanley Cup contenders. The fact that minus Draisaitl, every single player has had a down year, including McDavid, is not something that can be predicted or forecasted. But even with down years across the board, the Oilers are a formidable team when healthy. If even a couple of players pull it together in the playoffs, the Oilers are a scary team.

The goaltending I completely agree with you on and I think that needed to be addressed earlier and absolutely MUST be addressed in the offseason, regardless of how the playoffs go.

 

[MessierThanThou]

The Oilers, when fully healthy, whether you or others want to admit it, are still Stanley Cup contenders. The fact that minus Draisaitl, every single player has had a down year, including McDavid, is not something that can be predicted or forecasted. But even with down years across the board, the Oilers are a formidable team when healthy. If even a couple of players pull it together in the playoffs, the Oilers are a scary team.

As much as I want this to be true, their record against top teams, when healthy, makes me cast serious doubt on this claim. Although adding Walman and Kane to the equation and sticking with a steady Pickard could swing that pendulum...

 

[Juxta Position]

There's always someone on here who has to complain about all of the people complaining. As if venting about strangers venting about sports on the internet is somehow more productive.

It's the fact that the groupthink kicks in because negativity is contagious. once a handful of people start getting ridiculously negative, others follow along because they don't want to be called out for being "naive" or "having their head in the sand".

Somewhere along the line, negativity has been equated with realism, and being positive is somehow not realistic. That is obviously a falsehood that is perpetuated by the more negative posters.

I have no issues calling it out and will continue to do so. I've been on this board for almost 20 years, and it hasn't changed in that time and probably never will, and I'm fine with that. I'm just not naturally a negative person, and I will push back against it.

Why else come to a message board if not to debate?

 

[K1984]

I do agree with a lot of what you said there, but there are a few problems with it as well.

First, you say didn't hire competent hockey minds, wel that can't be the case because this is hockey and not basketball, where one player cannot win you a championship. Yes, having McDavid was huge, but there does have to be a support system around him to win, and over the last 3 years, the Oilers have won more playoff rounds than any team in the western conference. Yes, I get they didn't win the cup, but they were so close that it came down to a literal coin flip more so than actual skill.

The Oilers, when fully healthy, whether you or others want to admit it, are still Stanley Cup contenders. The fact that minus Draisaitl, every single player has had a down year, including McDavid, is not something that can be predicted or forecasted. But even with down years across the board, the Oilers are a formidable team when healthy. If even a couple of players pull it together in the playoffs, the Oilers are a scary team.

The goaltending I completely agree with you on and I think that needed to be addressed earlier and absolutely MUST be addressed in the offseason, regardless of how the playoffs go.

Bingo.

As we wail about the depth players, I have a pretty good feeling that we're leading the division or would at least be in striking distance of it if all of McDavid, Ekholm, Bouchard were healthy and playing up to their standards. Even if every single other part of the team was the same, those three healthy and playing up to their capabilities is worth at least 8 points north of where we are now. Might have been worth 8 points in just the last 2 weeks.

As you say, management can't forecast this, and it certainly isn't the depth players fault that McDavid and Ekholm have been injured/playing poorly, and Bouchard's game has cratered completely.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I think there is a sober way to look at this team without being needlessly pessimistic or relentlessly optimistic. At this point, I think it's hard to argue that the team is as good as they were in the regular season last year. But what matters is how they perform in the playoffs.

I feel pretty good about Arvidsson and Skinner continuing their upward trajectory into the playoffs, though Knoblauch's handling of Skinner has been absurd and I'm not sure he's going to give Skinner the opportunity to be this year's Sergei Samsonov (a potentially fatal mistake, even?).

But last year, everything lined up to put the Oilers in the Stanley Cup finals despite their .900 sv%. My biggest concern is that it seems unlikely that enough things will break the Oilers away to overcome a .900sv% again. Last playoffs, their PK was historically good; their PP was elite; they were scoring a ton; other teams had key injuries (e.g., Demko, Boeser); McDavid played so well that he won the Conn Smythe on the losing team; and they were stil inches away from being bounced by an inferior Canucks squad in the second round.

I think we have to assume Skinner is a 900 goalie at this point. Maybe he flips a switch and gets into that 910-915 territory, but there is nothing that suggests he's going to do that in the payoffs--it would be a surprise. So the Oilers need to overcome that. I haven't seen any indication that their PK is going to be historically good again; they aren't scoring as much; their PP isn't as good; and now there are questions about the health of McDavid, Draisaitl, and Ekholm going into the playoffs. We need them at their peaks.

To me, it all starts and ends with Skinner. I think it is virtually impossible that the Oilers win the cup with a 900 sv%. I was hoping he would take a step forward and the Oilers wouldn't need as many things to break their way these playoffs, but he has gotten worse, so I am very concerned about their chances. They also just haven't looked like the same team as last year, but I am hopefuly that Arvidsson and Skinner can move the needle with their offence in the playoffs. Hopefully Kane can be a contributor. Who knows what is going to happen with Frederic. But there are just too many questions right now about the things the team will need to do extremely well to overcome a 900 sv % to be very optimistic about their cup chances. And I think that's a reasonable, not pessimistic, view.

This team can win a Stanley Cup, but to win it all in this league a lot has to go right. From overall team health to key contributors to avoiding certain matchups. There's an overall feeling of "Well as soon as the playoffs start the team will turn it up" or "When this team is healthy they'll be unstoppable" which I think are dangerous ways of thinking. Kane hasn't played any hockey over the past year and will need to get up to speed before he's the player we want him to be. There's too many players on this roster that have regressed since last year (and unfortunately McDavid is one of them), and then yeah there's the goalie thing.

To win the Cup this year is team is likely going to have to go through LA, Vegas, and one of Colorado, Dallas, or Winnipeg, and that's just to get to the Finals. That's a very tough road, and definitely tougher than last year. They can do it but they need everyone on board and right now I'm just not seeing that from this club.

 

[Mr Positive]

I agree that we might be seeing players saving fuel for the playoffs. I've posted on here before that I think that might be happening, and it wouldn't totally shock me if McDavid, Draisaitl, etc., flip a switch and blow the doors off LA in 4 games.

Another thing I keep thinking about: I keep thinking about the 2012 LA Kings. They were actually just okay in the regular season, finishing 3rd in the Pacific with "only" 95 points. They then proceeded to kick the living hell out of everyone in the playoffs, losing only 4 games (what?) all playoffs. They were one of the best playoff teams in the modern era. I still think goaltending is a significant concern (Quick was lights out for the Kings), but I also don't think finishing 3rd in the division is a death knell.

My biggest concern is in net. I see goaltending as the only glaring flaw. I also don't see much chance that goaltending will improve in the playoffs. It's not like the goalies need to save something for the playoffs, and even so it's not like either of our goalies are overworked. They are stat machines imo.

But that's our team's character. We could still be like the 2012 Kings but just the offense-first version of that team. And really, if we went deep in the playoffs it would hardly be a surprise. By June everyone might be talking about how of course we were held back by injuries and just needed a little luck in net.

 

[Zerotonine]

It's a painfully small sample size, but combined with his mediocre season and apparent step back, and being in the org for 6 seasons, I don't think we need to see more. Time to move on from another goalie graveyard, and give the next group a chance.

Pretty much what I meant. Your bang on for the explanation

I mean i guess you could make into account or new system she new defense that mouthy take a few games to adapt to. But we know he had regressed this year significant amount. Just think how much worse it would get once Schwartz gets his hands on him

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I do agree with a lot of what you said there, but there are a few problems with it as well.

First, you say didn't hire competent hockey minds, wel that can't be the case because this is hockey and not basketball, where one player cannot win you a championship. Yes, having McDavid was huge, but there does have to be a support system around him to win, and over the last 3 years, the Oilers have won more playoff rounds than any team in the western conference. Yes, I get they didn't win the cup, but they were so close that it came down to a literal coin flip more so than actual skill.

The Oilers, when fully healthy, whether you or others want to admit it, are still Stanley Cup contenders. The fact that minus Draisaitl, every single player has had a down year, including McDavid, is not something that can be predicted or forecasted. But even with down years across the board, the Oilers are a formidable team when healthy. If even a couple of players pull it together in the playoffs, the Oilers are a scary team.

The goaltending I completely agree with you on and I think that needed to be addressed earlier and absolutely MUST be addressed in the offseason, regardless of how the playoffs go.

McDavid covers a lot of warts for this team. No one player can singlehandedly win a team a championship but without him this team is... well, you've seen it pretty clearly the last few games, there just isn't enough behind him to beat some of the deeper teams in the league. With the team healthy sure maybe they can make a run but injuries are a part of the game. I think there's a lot of people here who believe Kane will instantly step into the lineup and be a force despite not playing hockey for about a year. Lingering injuries might also hamper those currently on the shelf. And they've played a lot of hockey over the past few years, so there's always the fatigue factor to consider. The conference as a whole is also tougher than it was last year. If they get through LA and one of Vegas/STL, there's going to be a heavyweight standing in their way in the WCF. Other than Minnesota, I think virtually every Western playoff team can stake a claim to be a contender. We can only hope those teams beat each other a pulp.

There's also just the bass-ackwards way this org thinks. Whenever Stu Skinner returns, you can practically guarantee they'll re-anoint him the starter. I'm not as high on Pickard as some around here but I do think you have to go with him for the time being. The constant lineup changes are also quite frustrating. Something happened to the coach between last year and this year and it's hurt the team.

Obviously the injuries to McDavid and Draisatl are devastating but I think of a quote I once heard. "Adversity doesn't build character, it reveals it." I want to see someone, anyone, just step up and either take a pound of flesh out of the opposition or pot a few goals or something. The Ducks were more than happy to take their shots at us and we opted to chase Gudas around who has no reason to fight. It was quite frustrating to witness. Shout out to Max Jones who was specifically acquired to address team toughness and just proved to be an absolute black hole. Awesome acquisition.

 

[MessierThanThou]

It's the fact that the groupthink kicks in because negativity is contagious. once a handful of people start getting ridiculously negative, others follow along because they don't want to be called out for being "naive" or "having their head in the sand".

Somewhere along the line, negativity has been equated with realism, and being positive is somehow not realistic. That is obviously a falsehood that is perpetuated by the more negative posters.

I have no issues calling it out and will continue to do so. I've been on this board for almost 20 years, and it hasn't changed in that time and probably never will, and I'm fine with that. I'm just not naturally a negative person, and I will push back against it.

Why else come to a message board if not to debate?

Yes, negativity is contagious, but is shitting on a group of people for being negative not in itself negative, and even moreso than shitting on players because the targets of that negative energy will actually read the comments? Do you not see the hypocrisy here?

 

[foshizzle]

I think I saw so many players go down the wing (while having a step around the Dman) and then suddenly just button hooking and passing back to the point.

Brown does this so much its beyond annoying. You have a step on the f***ing Dman. ATTACK THE NET AND CREATE HAVOC

Do you just parrot what you hear on all the podcasts you listen to and text into?

Folks on here have been saying this for months.

 

[foshizzle]

For sure. Like I've said all year watch him against clubs actually that are decent and bringing even a modicum of checking and coverage. When a good opponent is in to the game J Skinner is shutdown, and theres nothing else about the player. The only reason you even have him is some scoring.

J Skinner is kind of a throwback, in a bad, way, from different eras where a guy could be just a goal scorer and little else. But in the NHL of 2025 you're expected to be able to play. He doesn't survive board battles well, had trouble n the WC working through traffic (another thing I wondered)

I'm hardpressed to think this guy is going to be much help in playoffs. Of course theres no precedent for it.

I completely disagree and his track record also disagrees. Skinner is sneakily very greasy and isn’t afraid to challenge the net, or go to the net. He has also done fine in his board battles. He’s got 16 goals in very limited minutes- and according to Jonathon Willis and his stats- Skinner has been one of our more defensive minded forwards since Jan 1.

This team can’t score. When Drai is not in the lineup- the shooting percentage drops like a stone. Skinner loves going to the high slot- the danger area- no one else on the team does. Problem is the team loves taking point shots and moving along the outside. Skinner is most dangerous in the mid slot. Oilers are allergic to that area

 

[CornKicker]

I was merely pointing out how a large contingent of posters on this board want nothing more than to bitch and complain and it seems like they are almost happy when the team is struggling so they can revel in their own misery, and try to pass that misery off to others. Because the second the team is rolling along, those same people disappear. It's exhausting, and they need to be called out on it.

everytime i get angry at the same thing you are i remind my self that there were posters here who wanted to trade jordan eberle for kyle clifford cause we needed more grit lol

 

[foshizzle]

He's a KHL player if I ever saw one

Janmark and Brown rock xGF% in the 30s. They bring absolutely nothing. Even if they had excellent PK’ing- it doesn’t offset how under water they are 5v5. Draisaitl and McDavid are not only having to carry Skinner’s shitty goaltending- but a third line of Janmark and Brown who cannot keep their heads above water. What an impossible ask of McDrai.

 

[OfCorsiDid]

I wish Spector would get a tapeworm.

 

[Oilhawks]

I wish Spector would get a tapeworm.

I don’t think tapeworms can get tapeworms

 

[CornKicker]

Don't think Oliver could of had a worst first start tbh. Only 21 shots against lets in 3 while the Oilers dominate and put shoot the ducks 2-1 and still loose with Oliver
.857 save percentage. Had high hopes but I guess that ship has sailed......

well the first one was a perfect 1T that most goalies wouldnt get and the 3rd was a breakaway from the other teams blueline. dont really fault him on those. not saying he was great but maybe just maybe its not the goalies that are the real problem

 

[K1984]

I wish Spector would get a tapeworm.

He's such a little, excuse my French, but I don't know if there's another word to accurately describe him - *word that got removed by mods because apparently some of the swear words are meaner than others that are allowed*.

He loves, LOVES anointing himself as the wise one, there to lecture the silly fans whenever they get too emotional. Every single god damn time the fans get fired up at another team's player because of something ratty or dirty, you can set a clock to Spec farting out "iD tAKe hIm On mY tEaM."

Ya, we know. We get that the player might have value. That isn't relevant to the point that people are pissed at him because of something he did.

 

[soothsayer]

He's such a little, excuse my French, but I don't know if there's another word to accurately describe him - c*nt.

He loves, LOVES anointing himself as the wise one, there to lecture the silly fans whenever they get too emotional. Every single god damn time the fans get fired up at another team's player because of something ratty or dirty, you can set a clock to Spec farting out "iD tAKe hIm On mY tEaM."

Ya, we know. We get that the player might have value. That isn't relevant to the point that people are pissed at him because of something he did.

Remember when he suggested Draisaitl had no right to be pissy with Jim Matheson because Matheson was a HoF writer . . . and the way he said it. Oof.

 

[McAsuno]

I'm pretty much been more checked out watching the games ever since the 4nations break ended. Getting real tired of seeing our players get injured that I'd think there's some sort of curse placed on the team. No McDrai or Ekholm on D to be the main stabilizer makes the team look even more boring to watch especially offensively. Getting real f***ing sick of Knoblauch's treatment when it comes to certain players like Jeff Skinner also.

I liked Max Jones for his first game, but he's been putrid ever since. So many of our guys were getting targetted in a dirty way from the likes of Gudas, and Jones did absolutely nothing about it. He just stood there while Kulak, Bouchard, and Kapanen were in a scrum and didn't even bother to at least give a stinkglove to any other ducks player. Absolutely disgraceful, send him down to the AHL where he belongs.

Anyways, GL to them against a red hot blues tomorrow, but I don't think I'm gonna watch. Watching them play lately is like watching trap game snoozefest Minnesota wild back in the day.

 

[soothsayer]

I'm pretty much been more checked out watching the games ever since the 4nations break ended. Getting real tired of seeing our players get injured that I'd think there's some sort of curse placed on the team. No McDrai or Ekholm on D to be the main stabilizer makes the team look even more boring to watch especially offensively. Getting real f***ing sick of Knoblauch's treatment when it comes to certain players like Jeff Skinner also.

I liked Max Jones for his first game, but he's been putrid ever since. So many of our guys were getting targetted in a dirty way from the likes of Gudas, and Jones did absolutely nothing about it. He just stood there while Kulak, Bouchard, and Kapanen were in a scrum and didn't even bother to at least give a stinkglove to any other ducks player. Absolutely disgraceful, send him down to the AHL where he belongs.

Anyways, GL to them against a red hot blues tomorrow, but I don't think I'm gonna watch. Watching them play lately is like watching trap game snoozefest Minnesota wild back in the day.

Jones is a big guy with skill who can make big hits, but he doesn't really fight. He's like Ben Eager without the fighting ability. He also doesn't penalty kill, so it's really hard to see him in a meaningful role on this team.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I completely disagree and his track record also disagrees. Skinner is sneakily very greasy and isn’t afraid to challenge the net, or go to the net. He has also done fine in his board battles. He’s got 16 goals in very limited minutes- and according to Jonathon Willis and his stats- Skinner has been one of our more defensive minded forwards since Jan 1.

This team can’t score. When Drai is not in the lineup- the shooting percentage drops like a stone. Skinner loves going to the high slot- the danger area- no one else on the team does. Problem is the team loves taking point shots and moving along the outside. Skinner is most dangerous in the mid slot. Oilers are allergic to that area

Just to counter though is Skinner isn't getting much on those slot plays. His last 2-3 goals have been on deflections and across around last 10GP where he's getting major opportunity in lineup.

Last night the most dangerous thing we had going all night were shots from the point. Getting in there for deflections or rebounds or the shots going in directly. Really since Drai and McD are out it seems to be how we're getting our offense and chances. Of course Booch, Walman, Nurse, get no credit for that even though they should. They are being our best players currently. Theres no forward thats coming close. Of course Booch has the miscues and last night was poor but he's still involved in our goals, hit a post, sifted other shots that could go and his shot on the goal was sublime. Skinner gets on that because he's good at deflections but its also perfectly paced and slotted.

Skinner did score, so credit for that, but its not slot shot its him timing a run into that path. Trouble with deflections is sometimes they go, sometimes you get the gravy, then you can have 20 mroe than don't go. Right now Skinner is on a deflection heater. They all count, just deflections goals are less dependable.

 

[Juxta Position]

Yes, negativity is contagious, but is shitting on a group of people for being negative not in itself negative, and even moreso than shitting on players because the targets of that negative energy will actually read the comments? Do you not see the hypocrisy here?

It is not hypocritical to call people out for specific behavior. What would be hypocritical would be to call out posters for being overly negative about the team, then be overly negative myself about the team.

Also, you're saying it's ok to call out players and be critical of them because they will never read this, but it is not ok to be critical of other posters because they WILL read this? Kind of cowardly, don't you think?

 

[Stoneman89]

I generally prefer players who win possession and get the chances, vs players who lose possession but make the most of their chances. Yes it is annoying af to see Brown miss a simple goal but I guess I just believe that when the chips are down, in the playoffs, players like that will find the back of the net more. Thats the easy part. The hard part is winning possession.

The problem is , we're winning the possession battle but losing the game. The Oilers of the 80'2 used to have Grant Fuhr hold the fort while they put up up 6 goals on 20 something shots. Must have driven the opposition nuts.

Anyway, we'll have to see if guys like Brown can replicate his "success" in the playoffs, or if it was just a hot streak for a few weeks.

 

[CupofOil]

Yeah, they were in a good position back in February and completely flubbed it. The best teams maintain their good standing. They have failed to do so. The only standings that matter at the end of the day are the ones when 82 games are played. I just checked the standings on the date in question. The Avalanche were 10th in the league. They're 6th now. LA was 13th. They're now 7th. Do you think they care about the standings back then? Maybe we can hang a banner for being third in the league at a point in the season.

I know what you're saying, but the standings as a whole are a good reflection of the team. They're good, but not great. And I realize what the poster said, there was obviously some hyperbole involved... But today, right now, do you think this team is good enough to win it all?

I don't think the Oilers are winning the Cup, I've been saying that all year, and I think they're underdogs against L.A. quite frankly but the standings don't mean a whole hell of a lot in hockey. The Oilers were 5th in the west last year and made it to the SCF's, the Panthers the year before were 8th in the east, the Habs made it to the SCF's during the bubble year as last team in. There's so much variance in hockey and such a razor thin difference between wins and losses in the playoffs that home ice and regular season standings don't really mean a ton. Look at the Panthers now, is anybody counting that team out? They've taken a tumble down the standings. Does anybody consider Washington and Winnipeg favorites? They've been the darlings of the regular season all year.

I'll reiterate that I'm not a big believer in this Oilers team, I liked the team the last 2 years quite a bit more, but regular season standings in the NHL don't really mean much once the playoffs start. Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if both Washington and Winnipeg lose in the 1st round this year.

There's also the fact that the Oilers 3 best players have been out a while or playing injured or sick even before that in the case of McDavid and Ekholm so that should be taken into consideration when assessing the current team.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I'm pretty much been more checked out watching the games ever since the 4nations break ended. Getting real tired of seeing our players get injured that I'd think there's some sort of curse placed on the team. No McDrai or Ekholm on D to be the main stabilizer makes the team look even more boring to watch especially offensively. Getting real f***ing sick of Knoblauch's treatment when it comes to certain players like Jeff Skinner also.

I liked Max Jones for his first game, but he's been putrid ever since. So many of our guys were getting targetted in a dirty way from the likes of Gudas, and Jones did absolutely nothing about it. He just stood there while Kulak, Bouchard, and Kapanen were in a scrum and didn't even bother to at least give a stinkglove to any other ducks player. Absolutely disgraceful, send him down to the AHL where he belongs.

Anyways, GL to them against a red hot blues tomorrow, but I don't think I'm gonna watch. Watching them play lately is like watching trap game snoozefest Minnesota wild back in the day.

Unfortunately I can sure understand. The Oilers are not an entertaining team right now, and thats fair because the best players in the world are out of lineup. Still we'd like to be seeing something and right now its really off. On Saturday I did a rare thing in turning the game off. Its end of first period and I just said to myself I'm done. I'm not spending time watching this. Knew where it was headed. This sort of thing rarely occurs for me. There was just no value to me in watching the Oilers in this game, even against LA which has been our NHL playoff rival more than any other team.

I suspect I feel differently once playoffs start but I'm less excited about that then I have been for years. My right of spring is outdoors now, and thats increased through the years. So that I'd rather be outside enjoying an evening then watching games that occupy almost all of June. Last playoffs as wonderful as it was, it also interfered with other things I like to do like camping. tbh I was kind of resenting at times the NHL dragging the season and playoffs on so long. The first cup the Oilers ever won was something like May 20th. PLayoffs over, cup won. Last year the playoffs going off the top of my head lasted until June 24th. Thats nuts and I won't repeat losing all that time. Although this year I don't think I even have to.