GDT: Oil Spills vs. the Storm

[A Star is Burns]

Fleury is the one Dman willing to slap some people around and cross check them in front of the net.

More of that please because it will never be called. Forget trying to gap up and skate with them just keep knocking them down.

I wish he had more of a mean streak really

 

[Svechhammer]

I think Fleury has looked good, but I'm going to pump the breaks on expecting more goals. He suffers from some of the same issues as a lot of the guys seem to right now in that he is looking for the perfect shot too much and waits an extra second or so which is allowing defenders to get in the lanes. He (and a lot of the guys right now) need to get the puck off the stick more quickly.

I'm talking about next year and beyond. Whatever is ailing them this year is probably here to stay until things can be tweaked over the summer.

With that said, I think Fleury has showed enough this year to have solidly played himself into our future plans. Assuming Dougie comes back healthy, I do like the following pairings going forward:

Dougie - Slavin
Pesce - Gardiner
Fleury - Bean

7th - Priskie

I think we could make that work for a few years while we tinker with the rest of the roster.

 

[Svechhammer]

Fleury is the one Dman willing to slap some people around and cross check them in front of the net.

More of that please because it will never be called. Forget trying to gap up and skate with them just keep knocking them down.

He and Svech threw some heavy hits yesterday and you could see it light a fire in the rest of the team. We look like a completely different team when the guys are willing to throw bodies, and it definitely took Edmonton out of their game, at least until the boneheaded mistakes that made the score go from 2-1 to 3-2 in the blink of an eye.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Man, we've got possibly our 2nd best team in our history, and it's so difficult to tell sometimes.

As for Fleury, he still lacks consistency. If it's like normal and he has an off game or two, it won't matter. He needs to figure out how to build on it. His top end still isn't that inspiring.

Rod touched a bit on the first part in one of the recent Athletic articles:

You can see it in our play. Some nights we look pretty good and then other nights you’re like, what are we watching?” Brind’Amour said. “Last year we didn’t see that. Last year we might not have won but I always felt like we should have won. Always. And I had maybe honestly two or three games last year where I was like ‘wow, we were bad.’ Other than that we should have or could have won every game because of the way we played. Now there’s games where I’m like ‘this is brutal.’ And that’s where I’m struggling with is because we have different personalities, different talent, different abilities and so I’ve got to probably do a better job of figuring that out. But I don’t want to lose track of what I know what will make us successful. So that’s where we’re at right now. Just trying to figure it out.”

 

[My Special Purpose]

Complaining about officiating is like complaining about traffic. Yes, it's awful and it's absolutely unacceptable for so many people to be so bad at such a simple thing...but it's been that way for so long that if you're still complaining about it, it's your fault for not lowering your expectations...or leaving earlier so you don't get caught in a jam.

I think I lost the metaphor somewhere in there.

I think the bigger problem in complaining about officiating is correlating it to some sort of bias. I've worked for an NHL team. I've done a 1-on-1 interview with Gary Bettman. Actually, I've done two. One formal, and one where we just met in a tunnel and talked for a few minutes on the record. I *know* 100 percent factually that there is *no* bias toward any team in the league. In Bettman's perfect world, the refs would *never* be an issue. When he goes to games, he's pulling for the refs. He likes the refs. He wants them to do well. Dealing with officials is just like dealing with players. He *wants* everyone to succeed.

The other problem is correlating it to bad officials. Also not true. The refs are the best available. To make this point clear, there is no ref who doesn't take crap from fans around the league. According to fans, there are *no* good refs, and that's simply not possible.

The problem is the rulebook, and penalty descriptions that were written in the 1940s. Nothing in the NHL rulebook is written clearly, and as a result, the refs have too much discretion. When they can literally call or not call anything they want, anytime they want, that's a bad thing, and it's not their fault. As a result, the calls end up looking random, because that's exactly what they are. As a fan, once you realize this, you can just accept the power plays when you team gets them and hope your team kills the penalty when they get one. The players do this, because it's literally *all* you can do.

Even the Panarin shootout goal the other night. The "continuous motion forward" thing is poorly written. Nobody knows what's legal or illegal in a shootout and the calls, again, end up looking random.

Being a ref in the NHL is thankless, but not because people are going to complain no matter what you do. It's thankless because it's impossible. Refs are basically set up to fail by the NHL. They're asked to call a game where virtually every interaction between players could be called a penalty if slowed down and viewed frame-by-frame, keep it fair, don't let it get out of hand, and don't affect the outcome of the game.

Quite simply, that's not possible. The refs need help. They *love* the no-brainer call of delay of game for puck over the glass because there is *no* gray area. We absolutely need to rewrite the rulebook to reflect the current game. Determine the difference between a stick check and slashing and *codify* it. Make it clear *in the rulebook* that you can do this up to this line, then you will get called. Write penalties how you want them enforced instead of in nebulous terms. I mean seriously, look at this:

59.1 Cross-checking - The action of using the shaft of the stick between the two hands to forcefully check an opponent.

Really? Next game, drink every time somebody does the above and let me know how you feel about the way the rule is written. As a ref, how do you call that? It's impossible. They need help.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Really?

Yes.

I’m the opposite:

I can see that.

you’ll lose me in a single post if you multi-quote 3-4-more others posts...unless your response to each is short, of course.

Yeah, I get that. It makes sense to keep responses short in a situation like that. Too many times, poster get long winded and I think like to see what they type more than just making a point. I know I can get caught up in that from time to time. Not anywhere near posts like Guerzy used to do and Vagrant used to and still does. I think it depends on the poster though as some have a literary background and can break things down even with a longer winded post. I like Vagrant's long posts when he is analyzing a player and giving examples to back up his analysis. There are a few posters who also post video or still pictures to corroborate their assessments, although that seems like a lot more work. Still, I get your point and wish more posters would be succinct when doing multiple quotes in a response, so I'm right with you there.

If you break those longish responses into separate posts, for some reason I’m more likely to read them.

Yep, like I said above, I agree with that.

My attention has suffered such deficit as time has gone on...

Same here

not sure whether to blame 21st century media or simple old age.

I lean toward media because my kids attention spans suffer also. Even the mainstream news has things like "around the world in 60 seconds" to kick off their newscasts. We are bombarded with short blips. Twitter is another example.

Or hockey.

I don't see that.

Seriously, the pace and constant action and ability to fast-forward through commercials and intermissions...it’s possible my attention doesn’t get enough exercise.

For me, Hockey is so fast that it forces me to pay attention or I'll miss something. Baseball (yawn) and Football are so slow comparatively that you could take a nap and not miss much.

Is anyone still reading this...?

No.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

2020: I couldn’t disagree more with these 3 opinions.

And "Then: At least our bottom lines weren't crap." Really? We had more guys that weren't NHL players in our bottom six than I care to count. Maybe they aren't performing right now, but we at least have legit NHLrs on our bottom 6 vs. the Bowmans, Malhotra (post injuries), Dvorak (washed up version), Terry, Westgarth, Brent, Nodl, A. Stewart, Dalpe, Joslin (D and F), Conboy, etc....

 

[MinJaBen]

With that said, I think Fleury has showed enough this year to have solidly played himself into our future plans. Assuming Dougie comes back healthy, I do like the following pairings going forward:

Dougie - Slavin
Pesce - Gardiner
Fleury - Bean

You are reeeeealllly messing with my OCD when you put the right shots in the left column and the left shots in the right column. @#$$%

 

[To Be Determined]

And "Then: At least our bottom lines weren't crap." Really? We had more guys that weren't NHL players in our bottom six than I care to count. Maybe they aren't performing right now, but we at least have legit NHLrs on our bottom 6 vs. the Bowmans, Malhotra (post injuries), Dvorak (washed up version), Terry, Westgarth, Brent, Nodl, A. Stewart, Dalpe, Joslin (D and F), Conboy, etc....

i don't know, it was relatively easy to think our bottom 6 wasn't totally horrible when you consider they were still nearly as good as our top 6. ugh.

 

[Joe McGrath]

I think the bigger problem in complaining about officiating is correlating it to some sort of bias. I've worked for an NHL team. I've done a 1-on-1 interview with Gary Bettman. Actually, I've done two. One formal, and one where we just met in a tunnel and talked for a few minutes on the record. I *know* 100 percent factually that there is *no* bias toward any team in the league. In Bettman's perfect world, the refs would *never* be an issue. When he goes to games, he's pulling for the refs. He likes the refs. He wants them to do well. Dealing with officials is just like dealing with players. He *wants* everyone to succeed.

The other problem is correlating it to bad officials. Also not true. The refs are the best available. To make this point clear, there is no ref who doesn't take crap from fans around the league. According to fans, there are *no* good refs, and that's simply not possible.

The problem is the rulebook, and penalty descriptions that were written in the 1940s. Nothing in the NHL rulebook is written clearly, and as a result, the refs have too much discretion. When they can literally call or not call anything they want, anytime they want, that's a bad thing, and it's not their fault. As a result, the calls end up looking random, because that's exactly what they are. As a fan, once you realize this, you can just accept the power plays when you team gets them and hope your team kills the penalty when they get one. The players do this, because it's literally *all* you can do.

Even the Panarin shootout goal the other night. The "continuous motion forward" thing is poorly written. Nobody knows what's legal or illegal in a shootout and the calls, again, end up looking random.

Being a ref in the NHL is thankless, but not because people are going to complain no matter what you do. It's thankless because it's impossible. Refs are basically set up to fail by the NHL. They're asked to call a game where virtually every interaction between players could be called a penalty if slowed down and viewed frame-by-frame, keep it fair, don't let it get out of hand, and don't affect the outcome of the game.

Quite simply, that's not possible. The refs need help. They *love* the no-brainer call of delay of game for puck over the glass because there is *no* gray area. We absolutely need to rewrite the rulebook to reflect the current game. Determine the difference between a stick check and slashing and *codify* it. Make it clear *in the rulebook* that you can do this up to this line, then you will get called. Write penalties how you want them enforced instead of in nebulous terms. I mean seriously, look at this:



Really? Next game, drink every time somebody does the above and let me know how you feel about the way the rule is written. As a ref, how do you call that? It's impossible. They need help.

Slashing the stick drives me bananas. It’s perfectly legal to slash a guys stick to dislodge the puck, but if the stick has an imperfection and snaps it’s a penalty. And then it’s “automatic”, but sometimes (rarely) they don’t call it anyway.

 

[A Star is Burns]

Yes.



I can see that.



Yeah, I get that. It makes sense to keep responses short in a situation like that. Too many times, poster get long winded and I think like to see what they type more than just making a point. I know I can get caught up in that from time to time. Not anywhere near posts like Guerzy used to do and Vagrant used to and still does. I think it depends on the poster though as some have a literary background and can break things down even with a longer winded post. I like Vagrant's long posts when he is analyzing a player and giving examples to back up his analysis. There are a few posters who also post video or still pictures to corroborate their assessments, although that seems like a lot more work. Still, I get your point and wish more posters would be succinct when doing multiple quotes in a response, so I'm right with you there.



Yep, like I said above, I agree with that.


Same here


I lean toward media because my kids attention spans suffer also. Even the mainstream news has things like "around the world in 60 seconds" to kick off their newscasts. We are bombarded with short blips. Twitter is another example.


I don't see that.


For me, Hockey is so fast that it forces me to pay attention or I'll miss something. Baseball (yawn) and Football are so slow comparatively that you could take a nap and not miss much.



No.

Masterful

 

[A Star is Burns]

He and Svech threw some heavy hits yesterday and you could see it light a fire in the rest of the team. We look like a completely different team when the guys are willing to throw bodies, and it definitely took Edmonton out of their game, at least until the boneheaded mistakes that made the score go from 2-1 to 3-2 in the blink of an eye.

I feel like Brock used to hit like a truck and just doesn't really do that the same way anymore.

 

[Lempo]

I think Fleury has looked good, but I'm going to pump the breaks on expecting more goals. He suffers from some of the same issues as a lot of the guys seem to right now in that he is looking for the perfect shot too much and waits an extra second or so which is allowing defenders to get in the lanes. He (and a lot of the guys right now) need to get the puck off the stick more quickly.

Them's the brakes.

 

[MinJaBen]

Them's the brakes.

Potato, potatoe.

 

[CanesFanBudMan]

Fun fact: among defensemen Haydn Fleury is 2nd on the team in p/60 (Behind Dougie)

Fun fact: among defensemen Haydn Fleury is 2nd on the team in shooting percentage (Behind Dougie)

Fun fact: among defensemen Haydn Fleury is 2nd on the team in hits/60 (Behind Edmundson)

Fun fact (Especially considering the above): among defensemen Haydn Fleury is 2nd fewest on the team in PIM/60 (Behind Saint Jaccob)

Are these stars cherry picked and potentially misleading - yes
Are they interesting - also yes

 

[JordanGalhanth]

Hey Canes fans,

Oilers fan here in peace. Moved to NC from Edmonton back in October, and it was extra special to visit PNC to see my boys from back home yesterday. (Sorry not sorry for the final score...but you certainly put up a good fight! )

Just want to say that you guys have one of the loudest crowds and some of the best in-game entertainment out there. The Minute-to-Win-It, Face Mash-Up, Jumbotron Proposal, and the little-league hockey were a blast to enjoy. My only disappointment is that there was no human bowling this time around. (That was one of the highlights from my first Canes game against Chicago back in 2018.)

All the best, and looking forward to visiting PNC again soon! (This time to cheer for the home team... )