OHL Attendance

[Otto]

Spirit attendance tends to increase after the new year and once football season is over. I don't know why they had so many home games in October when they have to compete against high school football.

Saginaw is actually up when compared to the same point in 2019/2020

 

[twinsdad]

Spirit attendance tends to increase after the new year and once football season is over. I don't know why they had so many home games in October when they have to compete against high school football.

Saginaw has done better at not scheduling Friday night games in the Fall to avoid competing against high school football. In fact, zero Friday night games until January this season.

 

[stealth1]

I struggle to understand why Mississauga has such issues drawing people to the game. You look at Niagara who has 9 wins this season yet still is drawing close to 4000 a game. Mississauga can't get even half that.

 

[Otto]

I struggle to understand why Mississauga has such issues drawing people to the game. You look at Niagara who has 9 wins this season yet still is drawing close to 4000 a game. Mississauga can't get even half that.

Marketing
Arena location
Marketing
Demographics
Marketing
Pricing
Marketing

 

[stealth1]

Marketing
Arena location
Marketing
Demographics
Marketing
Pricing
Marketing

I understand the demographics part. Why such lack of marketing? I don't buy the arena location as being such an issue. For Niagara most fans come from outside St. Catharines.

 

[Otto]

I understand the demographics part. Why such lack of marketing? I don't buy the arena location as being such an issue. For Niagara most fans come from outside St. Catharines.

Have you ever gone home from work in the GTA, and then wanted to go back out? It's not nearly the same as the Niagara region.

Why the lack of marketing? I'd say the team is unwilling to spend.

 

[stealth1]

Have you ever gone home from work in the GTA, and then wanted to go back out? It's not nearly the same as the Niagara region.

Why the lack of marketing? I'd say the team is unwilling to spend.

Again I don't buy it. Oshawa does well and I'm sure they have the same issues with getting home from work in the GTA.

IMO the Toronto area doesn't work for OHL.

 

[Otto]

Again I don't buy it. Oshawa does well and I'm sure they have the same issues with getting home from work in the GTA.

IMO the Toronto area doesn't work for OHL.

Oshawa isn't Mississauga either.

And Oshawa has decades of tradition.

If you're lumping in Oshawa with the GTA then the OHL does work in the Toronto area. It doesn't work in Mississauga for the reasons I suggested.

The worst thing the league did was try to create a natural rivalry by bringing in Mississauga and Brampton at the same time. They instantly bastardized the market and it will never get to where it needs to be.

 

[rangersblues]

Niagara had almost 5000 attendance for the Rangers Saturday night. Kudos for the support during a trying season.

 

[the dog]

Oshawa isn't Mississauga either.

And Oshawa has decades of tradition.

If you're lumping in Oshawa with the GTA then the OHL does work in the Toronto area. It doesn't work in Mississauga for the reasons I suggested.

The worst thing the league did was try to create a natural rivalry by bringing in Mississauga and Brampton at the same time. They instantly bastardized the market and it will never get to where it needs to be.

Cornwall city council trying to

Oshawa isn't Mississauga either.

And Oshawa has decades of tradition.

If you're lumping in Oshawa with the GTA then the OHL does work in the Toronto area. It doesn't work in Mississauga for the reasons I suggested.

The worst thing the league did was try to create a natural rivalry by bringing in Mississauga and Brampton at the same time. They instantly bastardized the market and it will never get to where it needs to be.

City of Cornwall trying to lure a ohl franchise maybe ask missassuaga to move there. Their lease is up this year

 

[Otto]

Niagara had almost 5000 attendance for the Rangers Saturday night. Kudos for the support during a trying season.

I wonder how much of that has to do with the Memorial Cup bid? Season ticket holders would get first shot at tickets, so despite a poor season they could easily have sold a number of season tickets to people wanting in.

 

[ColtsNLeafs]

I wonder how much of that has to do with the Memorial Cup bid? Season ticket holders would get first shot at tickets, so despite a poor season they could easily have sold a number of season tickets to people wanting in.

Niagara has always had a great fanbase despite their success, or lack there of. They also draw from a large region. Also heard Jeff Marek say Owen Sound has the best attendance in the CHL when you factor in their population to attendance . That caught me by surprise but I knew they have always had a very loyal fanbase

 

[Otto]

Niagara has always had a great fanbase despite their success, or lack there of. They also draw from a large region. Also heard Jeff Marek say Owen Sound has the best attendance in the CHL when you factor in their population to attendance . That caught me by surprise but I knew they have always had a very loyal fanbase

I'm not disputing Niagaras attendance record in previous years. This year is different though. With the front office turmoil, the numerous trades, and the dismal performance fans will only take so much. Not to mention the pandemic which has seen a lot of businesses consider their expenses.

All things being equal you'd expect a dip in attendance, but the prospect of hosting the Memorial Cup next season has to have increased season ticket subscribers.

Owen Sound doesn't shock me at all. Great support up there and the population is very sparse.

 

[ColtsNLeafs]

I'm not disputing Niagaras attendance record in previous years. This year is different though. With the front office turmoil, the numerous trades, and the dismal performance fans will only take so much. All things being equal you'd expect a dip in attendance, but the prospect of hosting the Memorial Cup next season has to have increased season ticket subscribers.

Owen Sound doesn't shock me at all. Great support up there and the population is very sparse.

True, but I think the Memorial Cup bid has little to nothing to do with the attendance. It wasn't even known until just recently and any fan who follows the team or league knows the chances of them actually hosting is little to nail. I'd give the bid maybe a few hundred at best i the attendance bump

 

[Otto]

True, but I think the Memorial Cup bid has little to nothing to do with the attendance. It wasn't even known until just recently and any fan who follows the team or league knows the chances of them actually hosting is little to nail. I'd give the bid maybe a few hundred at best i the attendance bump

Looking at hockeydb Niagara is averaging 3900/game. 1000 less than 19/20. Just in the last few weeks the Ice Dogs have shown larger attendance. I suspect the bid has a lot more to do with it than you think.

 

[rangersblues]

I wonder how much of that has to do with the Memorial Cup bid? Season ticket holders would get first shot at tickets, so despite a poor season they could easily have sold a number of season tickets to people wanting in.

It's possible some of it is related to Memorial Cup bid. But most of the people I talked with didn't think they really had a chance.

IMO the Memorial Cup has become overpriced. I wouldn't even want to host it if my team didn't have a chance to win. The price of the package is as much or more than season tickets. It is nice to have it within driving distance to take in a couple of games.

 

[ColtsNLeafs]

Looking at hockeydb Niagara is averaging 3900/game. 1000 less than 19/20. Just in the last few weeks the Ice Dogs have shown larger attendance. I suspect the bid has a lot more to do with it than you think.

Barrie is the exact same and I think most teams are. Post Christmas break attendance spikes with the weather and families looking for things to do. Barrie has always had poor attendance in the first half of the year and come the new year, they usually get 85-100% capacity. There is no way (IMO) a Memorial Cup bid would spike the IceDogs attendance by close to 1000/game. If they would have already been awarded it, then we can agree.

 

[Otto]

It's possible some of it is related to Memorial Cup bid. But most of the people I talked with didn't think they really had a chance.

IMO the Memorial Cup has become overpriced. I wouldn't even want to host it if my team didn't have a chance to win. The price of the package is as much or more than season tickets. It is nice to have it within driving distance to take in a couple of games.

This goes back to my comment about businesses watching their expenses. Businesses were the first ones to cancel and they would be the first ones crawling back if they thought there was even a slight chance to schmooze and hob-nob.

Barrie is the exact same and I think most teams are. Post Christmas break attendance spikes with the weather and families looking for things to do. Barrie has always had poor attendance in the first half of the year and come the new year, they usually get 85-100% capacity. There is no way (IMO) a Memorial Cup bid would spike the IceDogs attendance by close to 1000/game. If they would have already been awarded it, then we can agree.

Doesn't matter what the past fan support has been. I know they league is more successful at the gate after Christmas, but there's no way you'll convince me that the worst team in the league, which doesn't even have 10 wins yet, is packing them in al of a sudden because the fans WANT to be there.

 

[Otto]

As of the end of January. Compared to the same number of home games by each team in the 2018/19 season. As of January 21st Niagara was averaging 3,818

Team	18/19 Total	22/23 total	Diff	18/19 Avg	22/23 Avg	Diff
Ottawa	76362	89355	12993	3471	4062	591
Flint	52455	61573	9118	2384	2799	414
Windsor	88884	97582	8698	4040	4436	395
Guelph	92102	99842	7740	4004	4341	337
Saginaw	65466	71854	6388	2976	3266	290
Peterborough	64875	71162	6287	2821	3094	273
Sudbury	69393	74736	5343	3017	3249	232
Erie	72911	78414	5503	3038	3267	229
Oshawa	93355	95448	2093	4668	4772	105
North Bay	49790	51631	1841	2371	2459	88
Sarnia	66286	67846	1560	3013	3084	71
Kingston	64207	65191	984	3057	3104	47
London	216303	215919	-384	9013	8997	-16
Owen Sound	67802	62159	-5643	2948	2703	-245
Hamilton	90844	84298	-6546	3950	3665	-285
Barrie	73141	67103	-6038	3483	3195	-288
Sault Ste. Marie	83362	73966	-9396	3970	3522	-447
Mississauga	56600	39820	-16780	2358	1659	-699
Kitchener	157126	139557	-17569	6832	6068	-764
Niagara	102280	80912	-21368	4870	3853	-1018

 

[Otto]

Here's your reason for the spike in attendance for the Kitchener @ Niagara game

Niagara IceDogs

niagaraicedogs.net

 

[Otto]

Up to and including last nights games. Same parameters as previous

Team	18/19 Total	22/23 total	Diff	18/19 Avg	22/23 Avg	Diff
Ottawa	76362	89355	12993	3471	4062	591
Windsor	97641	108643	11002	4068	4527	458
Flint	57242	68010	10768	2385	2834	449
Erie	80654	89515	8861	3102	3443	341
Guelph	92102	99842	7740	4004	4341	337
Peterborough	70563	78115	7552	2823	3125	302
Sudbury	75193	81808	6615	3008	3272	265
Saginaw	72515	78583	6068	3021	3274	253
Oshawa	98553	101073	2520	4693	4813	120
Kingston	66661	68803	2142	3030	3127	97
North Bay	52210	53940	1730	2373	2452	79
Sarnia	70556	71460	904	3068	3107	39
London	225295	224955	-340	9012	8998	-14
Barrie	76205	71075	-5130	3464	3231	-233
Hamilton	93533	87671	-5862	3897	3653	-244
Owen Sound	67802	62159	-5643	2948	2703	-245
Sault Ste. Marie	83362	73966	-9396	3970	3522	-447
Mississauga	56600	39820	-16780	2358	1659	-699
Kitchener	164196	146723	-17473	6842	6113	-728
Niagara	107324	85825	-21499	4878	3901	-977

 

[dirty12]

This goes back to my comment about businesses watching their expenses. Businesses were the first ones to cancel and they would be the first ones crawling back if they thought there was even a slight chance to schmooze and hob-nob.


Doesn't matter what the past fan support has been. I know they league is more successful at the gate after Christmas, but there's no way you'll convince me that the worst team in the league, which doesn't even have 10 wins yet, is packing them in al of a sudden because the fans WANT to be there.

Check attendance for the Icedogs late last season for a last place team.

 

[Otto]

Check attendance for the Icedogs late last season for a last place team.

Last season wasn't a full season and can't be used as any type of comparison. Regardless, they have nothing to be proud of at the box office.

 

[stealth1]

Here's your reason for the spike in attendance for the Kitchener @ Niagara game

Niagara IceDogs

niagaraicedogs.net

Last season wasn't a full season and can't be used as any type of comparison. Regardless, they have nothing to be proud of at the box office.

The attendance was close to 4000 the last few home games. Regardless they are still doing decent for a 9 win team.

As much as you crap on Niagara for low attendance. There are other teams that should be doing much better then they are. North Bay, Owen Sound, Barrie and London should be doing much better considering the talent and record they have.

 

[Otto]

The attendance was close to 4000 the last few home games. Regardless they are still doing decent for a 9 win team.

As much as you crap on Niagara for low attendance. There are other teams that should be doing much better then they are. North Bay, Owen Sound, Barrie and London should be doing much better considering the talent and record they have.

You can't be serious. I posted the numbers. Niagara is showing the largest decrease over any team in the league. That's bad. There is no way to sugar coat it. 977 fans per game... that's minimum $20,000 per game lost just on tickets alone. Probably closer to $50k / game total. Half a million gone.

London is playing to 98.9% capacity. North Bay is seeing an increase in attendance, and all of the teams you mentioned will get at least two playoff games.

Team	18/19 Total	22/23 total	Diff	18/19 Avg	22/23 Avg	Diff	18/19 Total Season Avg	Diff From 22/23 To Date	Capacity	%
London	225295	224955	-340	9012	8998	-14	8997	1	9100	98.9%
Guelph	92102	99842	7740	4004	4341	337	4137	203	4666	93.0%
Oshawa	98553	101073	2520	4693	4813	120	5043	-230	5500	87.5%
Kitchener	164196	146723	-17473	6842	6113	-728	6859	-746	7700	79.4%
Owen Sound	67802	62159	-5643	2948	2703	-245	2994	-292	3500	77.2%
Barrie	76205	71075	-5130	3464	3231	-233	3463	-232	4195	77.0%
Peterborough	70563	78115	7552	2823	3125	302	2929	195	4069	76.8%
Niagara	107324	85825	-21499	4878	3901	-977	5035	-1134	5300	73.6%
Sault Ste. Marie	83362	73966	-9396	3970	3522	-447	4059	-537	5000	70.4%
Windsor	97641	108643	11002	4068	4527	458	4146	381	6500	69.6%
Flint	57242	68010	10768	2385	2834	449	2443	390	4400	64.4%
Sudbury	75193	81808	6615	3008	3272	265	3109	164	5100	64.2%
Erie	80654	89515	8861	3102	3443	341	3193	250	5500	62.6%
Sarnia	70556	71460	904	3068	3107	39	3236	-129	5200	59.7%
Saginaw	72515	78583	6068	3021	3274	253	3413	-139	5497	59.6%
Kingston	66661	68803	2142	3030	3127	97	3128	-1	5380	58.1%
North Bay	52210	53940	1730	2373	2452	79	2350	102	4246	57.7%
Ottawa	76362	89355	12993	3471	4062	591	3742	319	9862	41.2%
Mississauga	56600	39820	-16780	2358	1659	-699	2517	-858	6000	27.7%
Hamilton	93533	87671	-5862	3897	3653	-244	4090	-437	17500	20.9%