Boston Bruins Off Season Roster/ Cap Discussion II

[CDJ]

Are we really shitting on Sweeney for 2019?

Of all the things to criticize him for, we're going with "he didn't do enough in 2019". Really?

That team had the 2nd best record in the NHL and went to the Final.

I’ve said it every possible chance since then but they lost that series because their 1st line disappeared 5 on 5. Perfection line completely neutralized. That’s not on Sweeney

Plenty of things to criticize him for but the 2019 and 2023 front office efforts aren’t those things. Those failures fall on coaching and players

 

[Mr. Make-Believe]

Are we really shitting on Sweeney for 2019?

Of all the things to criticize him for, we're going with "he didn't do enough in 2019". Really?

That team had the 2nd best record in the NHL and went to the Final.

Are you really going to bitch about this without actually engaging in the conversation at all? Without addressing a single point made?

Outrage! Blasphemy! Horsepiss!!

The statement was made that Sweeney did “everything he could” in 2019. I disagreed with that statement. “Everything he could” wouldn’t have had two otherwise healthy scratches as a rotating “best” option on the second line. Or rookie Clifton having to suit up for almost the entire postseason with a dozen NHL games on his resume.

You want to disagree with those statements, have at ‘er. I’m open to that conversation. I have civil debates with people who disagree with me ALL THE TIME. You want to ride in here on your high horse and your false outrage? I’ll leave it to your imagination where you believe I think you can shove it.

 

[DKH]

They were regular season champion, not cup champions. Like the late Lou Gorman once said we have spent more days in first place than anyone else.

Well after they expand to Arizona, Houston, Red Deer, and Bangor they will be getting close to an original 50 where statistically teams should win 1 Cup every 50 years ~ sounds awesome

 

[Number8]

Watching Freddy much around in the bottom 6 in Edmonton and not do much, you really have to love Sweeney's deadline. More every day.

I watched him closely last night.

In some ways he’s changed a lot. His uniform has more blue and orange in it, for example. Other than that though, pretty much same old Freddy.

 

[LJReborn]

I’ve said it every possible chance since then but they lost that series because their 1st line disappeared 5 on 5. Perfection line completely neutralized. That’s not on Sweeney

Plenty of things to criticize him for but the 2019 and 2023 front office efforts aren’t those things. Those failures fall on coaching and players

He had a guy he signed for 5 years 30million has a healthy scratch game 7 half way through his deal. That's just inexcusable.

He had a good deadline but remember again, they played the 6th, 7th and 8th seeds to get there. I appreciate the team beat who was in front of them, but Karson Kuhlman getting 14 and a half minutes of ice time game 7 was a major mistake.

Hakuna Matada though people are very in the right to have issues with construction of that team, but I tend to think the players still choked,

 

[sarge88]

It’s not difficult for me to quantify.

What was the better roster? 2019 or 2023? In which year did Sweeney do more to give his roster the best chance to win? What were the circumstances that help lead to the Bruins making the Finals in 2019? And what led to their downfall in 2023?

You’re right when you say that once you’re in the playoffs, the GM has little influence from that point in on how far they go. So it’s GM’s job to put them in the best position they can before that point. From there, it’s on the coaches and players.

I get it, but every season has different opportunities and hindrances, so to speak. What is available and what you have as currency to acquire can swing wildly from one year to the next.

I’d say what Sweeney did to develop the roster, and then bolster it in 2023 was historic and possibly unprecedented.

I can’t think of a situation where such quality was added to a team that was already in the realm of greatness in NHL history.

I think it’s tough to use that as the measuring stick, especially to a team that got to game 7 of the SCF.

 

[Patdud]

I watched him closely last night.

In some ways he’s changed a lot. His uniform has more blue and orange in it, for example. Other than that though, pretty much same old Freddy.

He has the tools, doesn’t have the heart. Just don’t understand the mentality of some players who make it to the NHL.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

He has the tools, doesn’t have the heart. Just don’t understand the mentality of some players who make it to the NHL.

Everyone is different. Even professional athletes.

 

[incidental otter]

I’ve said it every possible chance since then but they lost that series because their 1st line disappeared 5 on 5. Perfection line completely neutralized. That’s not on Sweeney

Plenty of things to criticize him for but the 2019 and 2023 front office efforts aren’t those things. Those failures fall on coaching and players

Agreed that the Perfection Line's issues weren't Sweeney's fault, but building a one-line team sure was. After watching the '11 team win (in no small part) by rollling 4 lines, his decision to make the team top-heavy has always been his greatest failing in my eyes.

 

[bearcountry17]

Agreed that the Perfection Line's issues weren't Sweeney's fault, but building a one-line team sure was. After watching the '11 team win (in no small part) by rollling 4 lines, his decision to make the team top-heavy has always been his greatest failing in my eyes.

Sweeney acquired two players who were hands down upgrades on what they were rolling with Krejci and Debrusk in Coyle and MoJo. Cassidy thought it was better to stack the 1st and 3rd lines.

M-B-Coyle/Mojo
Debrusk-Krejci-Pastrnak
Heinen-Coyle/MoJo-Backes
4th line

Would have been the way to go but why not put 3 of your best shooters on the same line.

 

[pucksindeep92]

Idk guys, after watching Skinner last night I don’t think Edmonton would mind Korpi for future considerations

 

[Hookslide]

Agreed that the Perfection Line's issues weren't Sweeney's fault, but building a one-line team sure was. After watching the '11 team win (in no small part) by rollling 4 lines, his decision to make the team top-heavy has always been his greatest failing in my eyes.

I think 2019 Cassidy made the mistake of not playing Backes in Game 7. 2023 Monty made the mistake of playing injured players, like Bergey, Krecji, and Ullmark, those mistakes fall on the coaches, I do agree fault should be distributed in 2023 to the players that insisted on playing when hurt and then running to the media minutes after the game that he had disc in his back, kind of a wash my hands moment to me. In going back 2019 that team had one line, Sweeney failure came in not getting a wing mainly a RW for Krecji, he was addressing that problem for years and failed. In 2023, Sweeney gets praised for " going all in " nice but not only did he not maintain any of the player he obtained at the deadline, but he also lost Taylor Hall, because he could not pay him, and to add to that he had to pay bonuses, to two players that retired. Sorry but Sweeney can get praised for going for it that is fine, but he should also be blamed for the state of this team today. I watch these playoffs and wonder how some of these teams pickup player like Pertangelo, Rantannan, Hanifan, Chycrun, and others and stay relevant, good job by the GMs I guess.

 

[LJReborn]

I get it, but every season has different opportunities and hindrances, so to speak. What is available and what you have as currency to acquire can swing wildly from one year to the next.

I’d say what Sweeney did to develop the roster, and then bolster it in 2023 was historic and possibly unprecedented.

I can’t think of a situation where such quality was added to a team that was already in the realm of greatness in NHL history.

I think it’s tough to use that as the measuring stick, especially to a team that got to game 7 of the SCF.

How many teams had their first and second line centers count for 3 mil vs the cap in the modern cap era?

Great job at the deadline but that luxury was afforded by the deep discount 37 and 46 took. Once in a lifetime thing for a GM.

They still choked when they basically had a lay up to at least make the ECF with that group,

 

[LJReborn]

I think 2019 Cassidy made the mistake of not playing Backes in Game 7. 2023 Monty made the mistake of playing injured players, like Bergey, Krecji, and Ullmark, those mistakes fall on the coaches, I do agree fault should be distributed in 2023 to the players that insisted on playing when hurt and then running to the media minutes after the game that he had disc in his back, kind of a wash my hands moment to me. In going back 2019 that team had one line, Sweeney failure came in not getting a wing mainly a RW for Krecji, he was addressing that problem for years and failed. In 2023, Sweeney gets praised for " going all in " nice but not only did he not maintain any of the player he obtained at the deadline, but he also lost Taylor Hall, because he could not pay him, and to add to that he had to pay bonuses, to two players that retired. Sorry but Sweeney can get praised for going for it that is fine, but he should also be blamed for the state of this team today. I watch these playoffs and wonder how some of these teams pickup player like Pertangelo, Rantannan, Hanifan, Chycrun, and others and stay relevant, good job by the GMs I guess.

there is zero chance the coach made all these decisions by himself. No way Sweeney and Neely sat back and said, here you go guys, we have zero input.

 

[LJReborn]

Agreed that the Perfection Line's issues weren't Sweeney's fault, but building a one-line team sure was. After watching the '11 team win (in no small part) by rollling 4 lines, his decision to make the team top-heavy has always been his greatest failing in my eyes.

Yeah Krejci having Kuhlman on his line was not ideal.

 

[ON3M4N]

Oh that’s true.

That’s kind of a stupid thing to bring up, isn’t it? Not very realistic.

Trading a top 5 player? Yes, pretty unrealistic...then again Gretzky was traded, so crazy things have happened.

Lets be honest though your comment is a beat around the push way to say the idea that Necas could be traded is stupid and not very realistic.

Interestingly, Necas numbers the last 3 years are close (but slightly less) that Jordan Kyrou. Rumors are that Kyrou could be available via trade as his NTC is about to kick in and STL maybe looking to shake things up. Kyrou (unlike Necas) is locked up long-term.

So is it really that unrealistic that the Av's could move Necas? I don't think so, especially if they feel like he's not going to be a long term option for the team.

 

[BlackFrancis]

there is zero chance the coach made all these decisions by himself. No way Sweeney and Neely sat back and said, here you go guys, we have zero input.

Not sure it's zero. Neither Sweeney nor Neely has, to my knowledge, ever coached a game of hockey at any level. And between the local snark merchants and Canadian media who at times have had a hard on for the Bruins, there would be no small cajoling for Claude, Cassidy or Montgomery to feed a little fuel into the machine. Not one of the three of them has ever said, "Boo."

It could have happened - one or both could have discussed the roster or strong armed changes. But it ain't a certainty.

 

[sarge88]

How many teams had their first and second line centers count for 3 mil vs the cap in the modern cap era?

Great job at the deadline but that luxury was afforded by the deep discount 37 and 46 took. Once in a lifetime thing for a GM.

They still choked when they basically had a lay up to at least make the ECF with that group,

So much in sports is good fortune and situational.

I mean, Pittsburgh has what 5/6 cups that can all be traced back to throwing games and/or a lucky ping pong ball bounce.

I get your point but every cup winner has benefited from luck, manipulation of the cap/rules or players doing something unexpected for them.

 

[UncleRico]

To get anything impactful in return for Middlestadt, it would (in my opinion) require attaching a prospect or asset. At least his contract is only thru 2026-2027 and not 2030.

Hopefully they can move him but that contract is awful. Maybe we can move him at the deadline with some retention

 

[bruins19]

I think 2019 Cassidy made the mistake of not playing Backes in Game 7. 2023 Monty made the mistake of playing injured players, like Bergey, Krecji, and Ullmark, those mistakes fall on the coaches, I do agree fault should be distributed in 2023 to the players that insisted on playing when hurt and then running to the media minutes after the game that he had disc in his back, kind of a wash my hands moment to me. In going back 2019 that team had one line, Sweeney failure came in not getting a wing mainly a RW for Krecji, he was addressing that problem for years and failed. In 2023, Sweeney gets praised for " going all in " nice but not only did he not maintain any of the player he obtained at the deadline, but he also lost Taylor Hall, because he could not pay him, and to add to that he had to pay bonuses, to two players that retired. Sorry but Sweeney can get praised for going for it that is fine, but he should also be blamed for the state of this team today. I watch these playoffs and wonder how some of these teams pickup player like Pertangelo, Rantannan, Hanifan, Chycrun, and others and stay relevant, good job by the GMs I guess.

Totally agree that the error of not playing Backes in game 7 was definitely consequential.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Totally agree that the error of not playing Backes in game 7 was definitely consequential.

I don't see it.

You're talking about a 4th line player making a difference in a game the Bruins were never in.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Are we really shitting on Sweeney for 2019?

Of all the things to criticize him for, we're going with "he didn't do enough in 2019". Really?

That team had the 2nd best record in the NHL and went to the Final.

His issue in 2019 is more of the same with Sweeney. More than comfortable wasting Krejci and Debrusk with a negative on their wing. A potential strength turned into a weakness. But Sweeney knows best... the Coyle trade was a masterpiece no debate.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

I don't see it.

You're talking about a 4th line player making a difference in a game the Bruins were never in.

The Bruins dominated the 1st period. Unfortunately Marchand misses an open net by shooting puck directly into Binnington's jersey logo and the rest is history.

Either team with the lead in that game was going to shut down the other team's offense, as the Blues did.

 

[pucksindeep92]

Just some thinking out loud/food for thought here…

I like Zacha and my sentiment the past couple months I that I would prefer to keep him, as his value and versatility here probably surpasses the cost of his replacement.

That said, Zacha looked more lost/floater not playing with Pasta, and it’s possible we have already seen his career highs in Boston barring an incoming very capable 2c alongside great 2RW (not likely). There are scenarios out there where he could even be pushed to 3c. I don’t have strong confidence in production from a Zacha-Mitts-Boeser line at the moment. You guys know I’d much rather move Mittelstadt but not sure Sweeney wants to sell low on him, and would rather improve his stock first.

If you were to sell high, how and where do you move him? What players realistically could we look for in return with a package centered around him and Torontos 2026 1st+ or a 2027 1st?

 

[KillerMillerTime]

I think 2019 Cassidy made the mistake of not playing Backes in Game 7. 2023 Monty made the mistake of playing injured players, like Bergey, Krecji, and Ullmark, those mistakes fall on the coaches, I do agree fault should be distributed in 2023 to the players that insisted on playing when hurt and then running to the media minutes after the game that he had disc in his back, kind of a wash my hands moment to me. In going back 2019 that team had one line, Sweeney failure came in not getting a wing mainly a RW for Krecji, he was addressing that problem for years and failed. In 2023, Sweeney gets praised for " going all in " nice but not only did he not maintain any of the player he obtained at the deadline, but he also lost Taylor Hall, because he could not pay him, and to add to that he had to pay bonuses, to two players that retired. Sorry but Sweeney can get praised for going for it that is fine, but he should also be blamed for the state of this team today. I watch these playoffs and wonder how some of these teams pickup player like Pertangelo, Rantannan, Hanifan, Chycrun, and others and stay relevant, good job by the GMs I guess.

Hookslide, come on man, can't you spell at least Hanifin right...lol. Think of Noah as a fish from now on, not an appliance...lol.