Off Season Move(s) Thread

[MNRube]

We already tried that, and it wasn't good. Why mess with a great winger?

So, if the best offer we have for Rossi is BUF's 9 oa, do we do that? It would give us the extra 5M or so cap space, and another swing at a C through the draft. Even more important would give us something meaty to talk about between now and July.

I’d probably do the 9 OA and package it right back up for a win now piece.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

I know we're not really used to it (at least lately), but teams do oftentimes like to put their better offensive players together at 5v5 if they can. The Islanders appear to have opted to utilize that opportunity, since Barzal's game seemed to be fine on the wing too. Maybe Nelson's wouldn't be?

Did they prefer Nelson at center over Barzal, or did they prefer Barzal and Horvat playing together? We'll probably never know.

I’m genuinely curious, what seasons do you think Barzal played the center position?

 

[MNRube]

He didn’t figure it out in college

Watched him a ton that year, he was still good but largely snakebitten. Give him an offseason to study the position with the confidence he has now and maybe he figures it out. If not, just move him back to wing.

 

[57special]

I'd take it, if they are set on moving on from Rossi, and that is the best offer.

I think I'd rather raid BUF's prospect pool and get something like Rosen + Ostlund for Rossi instead of 9oa. I also haven't paid any attention to the draft class this year, so I don't know what I'd be passing up there, so there is that grain of salt.

It depends on who is still there at 9, but in general, this doesn't seem to be the strongest draft. One great Dman, Misa, who is a cut below, then about 3 C's that have top 6 upside in Frondell, Hagens, Desnoyers. There are a couple few others, but the talent gets thin, or has issues around 7-8oa, especially if you are limiting yourself to just picking forwards.

I'd go after Kulich/Helenius + from BUF is Peterka isn't available. Ostlund is a tad taller than Rossi, but slight in frame- no FU to his game. Also a better skater than Rossi, but has never put up points like Marco. Rosen... a slight winger. I can't see Guerin going for either. Helenius and Kulich aren't giants, but are thicker, stronger players.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I’m genuinely curious, what seasons do you think Barzal played the center position?

2017-18
2018-19
2019-20
2020-21
2021-22

 

[DigitalBoldy]

2017-18
2018-19
2019-20
2020-21
2021-22

And how did you come to that conclusion?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

And how did you come to that conclusion?

I deduced this via the fact that his top 5-6 most common forward line mates during all of these seasons were all wingers (Lee, Bailey, Eberle, Beauvillier, Ladd, Parise), plus the fact that he spent almost no 5v5 time with the other centers on his roster (Tavares for his rookie season, Nelson, Pageau).

 

[DigitalBoldy]

I deduced this via the fact that his top 5-6 most common forward line mates during all of these seasons were all wingers (Lee, Bailey, Eberle, Beauvillier, Ladd, Parise), plus the fact that he spent almost no 5v5 time with the other centers on his roster (Tavares for his rookie season, Nelson, Pageau).

And you would say that they played Barzal at center for roughly the first half of 22-23, yes?

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

And you would say that they played Barzal at center for roughly the first half of 22-23, yes?

Indubitably. Extremely similar line mates to the years before, until he went out with injury in February, not to return.

 

[AKL]

I'm really excited to find out what the point is here tbh

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I'm really excited to find out what the point is here tbh

Me too. Am I standing on a trap door? We'll find out soon!

 

[AKL]

Me too. Am I standing on a trap door? We'll find out soon!

It seems to me that you both agree he played center until the first game post January 30th, 2023. I wonder what happened on that day to cause the shift to wing.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

Indubitably. Extremely similar line mates to the years before, until he went out with injury in February, not to return.

Would you say the islanders were relatively happy with Nelson's play as a center in 22-23?

 

[DigitalBoldy]

I'm really excited to find out what the point is here tbh

The point is that the Islanders went out of their way to add a center because Barzal wasn't that guy.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Would you say the islanders were relatively happy with Nelson's play as a center in 22-23?

A quick look at the stats would lead me to believe that he had an exemplary season, minus the face-off % of course.

Career best in points, positive +/- and a shooting % that was not too far outside his normal.

A top notch season, to be sure.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

The point is that the Islanders went out of their way to add a center because Barzal wasn't that guy.

Aw damn. Not gonna lie, if this is really it, this is a pretty big letdown.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

Aw damn. Not gonna lie, if this is really it, this is a pretty big letdown.

Exactly what the Islanders organization said about Barzal playing center...

 

[DigitalBoldy]

It seems to me that you both agree he played center until the first game post January 30th, 2023. I wonder what happened on that day to cause the shift to wing.

I wonder why the Islanders felt the need to add a top 6 center when they supposedly already had two.

 

[AKL]

I wonder why the Islanders felt the need to add a top 6 center when they supposedly already had two.

I have a theory, but I'm not sure I want to share, as you've made up your mind already.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

I have a theory, but I'm not sure I want to share, as you've made up your mind already.

I'm listening.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Exactly what the Islanders organization said about Barzal playing center...

lol.

The 4th leading forward scorer on the Islanders the season they traded for Horvat was JG Pageau with 40 points. Lee, Bailey and Palmieri were all on the other side of 30 (Horvat was 27). Wahlstrom wasn't kicking the top 6's doors down. They needed top 6 help of any and all kinds. They felt or knew that Barzal's game wouldn't go to shit on the wing, so they added what they could add. His first year there he had a PPG season, so they obviously weren't wrong.

Pretty logical to me, anyway.

 

[AKL]

lol.

The 4th leading forward scorer on the Islanders the season they traded for Horvat was JG Pageau with 40 points. Lee, Bailey and Palmieri were all on the other side of 30 (Horvat was 27). Wahlstrom wasn't kicking the top 6's doors down. They needed top 6 help of any and all kinds. They felt or knew that Barzal's game wouldn't go to shit on the wing, so they added what they could add. His first year there he had a PPG season, so they obviously weren't wrong.

Pretty logical to me, anyway.

This was basically my theory.

Top 6 centers are valuable, top 6 centers can easily play on the wing, they were fighting for a playoff spot, a good player became available, they got him.

In any case, I think you can reasonably conclude that NYI thought Horvat and Nelson were better fits in the center position than Barzal because of what happaned, but I don't see any way to reasonably conclude that Barzal can't play center because of what happened.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

lol.

The 4th leading forward scorer on the Islanders the season they traded for Horvat was JG Pageau with 40 points. Lee, Bailey and Palmieri were all on the other side of 30 (Horvat was 27). Wahlstrom wasn't kicking the top 6's doors down. They needed top 6 help of any and all kinds. They felt or knew that Barzal's game wouldn't go to shit on the wing, so they added what they could add. His first year there he had a PPG season, so they obviously weren't wrong.

Pretty logical to me, anyway.

If a team feels really good about their centers, they will not go out of their way to trade for another with the sole purpose being to place one of those centers at wing. It's obvious that the Islanders were not enamored with Barzal's play at center.

I can see I'm not going to convince you though, so there's no point in continuing this. Agree to disagree.

 

[DigitalBoldy]

This was basically my theory.

Top 6 centers are valuable, top 6 centers can easily play on the wing, they were fighting for a playoff spot, a good player became available, they got him.

In any case, I think you can reasonably conclude that NYI thought Horvat and Nelson were better fits in the center position than Barzal because of what happaned, but I don't see any way to reasonably conclude that Barzal can't play center because of what happened.

What exactly is the proof that Barzal can play center well? That seems to be lost in this entire conversation.

 

[AKL]

What exactly is the proof that Barzal can play center well? That seems to be lost in this entire conversation.

It might have gotten lost because you were supposed to be proving he can't play center and you didn't.