Obscure hockey facts/stats (Part 2)

[Yozhik v tumane]

IIHF WHC started today, and in Finland - Austria game two of Tolvanen brothers were playing (Eeli and his big brother Atte).

Nothing special about that, but they were playing for different teams, Eeli for Finland and Atte was Austria’s goalie.

Cant remember brothers playing each other before at national team level. Only thing even remotely close I can think is some czech footballer whose brother played hockey for Germany, and of course they didnt play against each other.

Statsny brothers?

I think one of the most famous examples in football would be brothers Jerome and Kevin-Prince Boateng representing Germany and Ghana respectively. They faced each other at the 2010 World Cup.

 

[Kahvi]

Robert and Martin Reichel did it: Robert for Czech Republic, Martin for Germany.

And a more obscure example: in 1960 Zdenek Tikal played for Australia (their only Olympic appearance ever) while his brother Frantisek was with Czechoslovakia.

Thanks, I think I was thinking Reichel's when I said Czech footballer and German hockey player brothers, dont know why I thought the other was football player. Unless there's another pair of brothers that fit that description.

 

[Summer Rose]

I think one of the most famous examples in football would be brothers Jerome and Kevin-Prince Boateng representing Germany and Ghana respectively. They faced each other at the 2010 World Cup.

Came here to post this one. Germany and Ghana were also drawn into the same group at the 2014 World Cup. Both of them were in the starting eleven for their respective countries, and were substituted (Jerome at half time and Kevin-Prince in the 51st minute). The match finished in a 2-2 draw.

Also of note, the two Boatengs were actually half-brothers (same father, different mothers).

 

[Sanf]

IIHF WHC started today, and in Finland - Austria game two of Tolvanen brothers were playing (Eeli and his big brother Atte).

Nothing special about that, but they were playing for different teams, Eeli for Finland and Atte was Austria’s goalie.

Cant remember brothers playing each other before at national team level. Only thing even remotely close I can think is some czech footballer whose brother played hockey for Germany, and of course they didnt play against each other.

Statsny brothers?

I think Larry Rucchin rerpresenting Italy and Steve representing Canada met in 1998 world championships.

 

[Yozhik v tumane]

Came here to post this one. Germany and Ghana were also drawn into the same group at the 2014 World Cup. Both of them were in the starting eleven for their respective countries, and were substituted (Jerome at half time and Kevin-Prince in the 51st minute). The match finished in a 2-2 draw.

Haha, I knew they’d played each other at the World Cup, but them being drawn in the same group twice seemed too unlikely to even look at 2014 having found the 2010 instance.

One obscure football fact I enjoy as a Swede was that — if you include the World Cup qualifiers — Sweden scored as many goals on (eventual world champions) Germany in just two games as they would allow in all 15 other World Cup games. The German team allowed four goals in seven games of the tournament, and three goals in eight qualifying games against teams other than Sweden.

One of the most awesome sports moments I’ve watched was Sweden coming back to tie a 4-0 deficit against Germany in Berlin. Saw it in a sports bar, where half the place was emptied and the remainder had turned their interest towards each other. Zlatan opens Sweden’s scoring, immediately picks up the ball and runs it to the centre as if there’s a chance in hell they’ll get another three in just half an hour or so. In stoppage time, an absolutely drained Rasmus Elm scores the 4-4-goal. Such a memorable game for a Swedish fan.

The next game isn’t widely remembered (Germany had won the group, Sweden the playoff spot), but with Zlatan out, Sweden parked the bus and incredibly were up 2-0 in halftime, and from memory it felt Sweden scored the both times they even touched the ball outside their own goal box. Germany said “enough” and the game ended 5-3. But Sweden had Manuel Neuer beat 7 times in the qualifiers. After that second leg, Neuer said something salty to the effect of Sweden being a great hockey nation and that they should stick to that

 

[Summer Rose]

Haha, I knew they’d played each other at the World Cup, but them being drawn in the same group twice seemed too unlikely to even look at 2014 having found the 2010 instance.

One obscure football fact I enjoy as a Swede was that — if you include the World Cup qualifiers — Sweden scored as many goals on (eventual world champions) Germany in just two games as they would allow in all 15 other World Cup games. The German team allowed four goals in seven games of the tournament, and three goals in eight qualifying games against teams other than Sweden.

One of the most awesome sports moments I’ve watched was Sweden coming back to tie a 4-0 deficit against Germany in Berlin. Saw it in a sports bar, where half the place was emptied and the remainder had turned their interest towards each other. Zlatan opens Sweden’s scoring, immediately picks up the ball and runs it to the centre as if there’s a chance in hell they’ll get another three in just half an hour or so. In stoppage time, an absolutely drained Rasmus Elm scores the 4-4-goal. Such a memorable game for a Swedish fan.

The next game isn’t widely remembered (Germany had won the group, Sweden the playoff spot), but with Zlatan out, Sweden parked the bus and incredibly were up 2-0 in halftime, and from memory it felt Sweden scored the both times they even touched the ball outside their own goal box. Germany said “enough” and the game ended 5-3. But Sweden had Manuel Neuer beat 7 times in the qualifiers. After that second leg, Neuer said something salty to the effect of Sweden being a great hockey nation and that they should stick to that

The way they did the draw to determine the groups at the 32-team World Cup editions actually does make it slightly more likely than one might think. I won't get into the finer details of it, since it varied slightly from tournament to tournament, but the long story short is that it was a basic combination of seeding and region (i.e. continental confederation a country belonged to). The top-ranked countries are almost inevitably European or South American, and they let a lot of European countries qualify, so they essentially set it up to where the "pots" teams were drawn from were the top 8 ranked qualified teams, and the other three were determined by region. That was done in order to eliminate the possibility of countries from the same continental confederation being drawn into the same group (except for very occasionally South America, but I don't think it ever happened that two South American countries were drawn into the same group - could be wrong on that one though), except for Europe, but they made it impossible (or close to it) for more than two European countries to be drawn into the same group (but I think there was one year where hypothetically there could have been a single group with three of them). If I'm doing the math on it correctly, that means that in both 2010 and 2014, there was a 1 in 8 chance that Germany and Ghana would be draw into the same group each time.

Also of note, the host country (when it's a single host country) is assigned "A1" in that they're put into the draw pot of "seeded teams" and automatically drawn into group A. Not sure how they handle it when there's more than one host country.

 

[The Panther]

I've mentioned this somewhere before, but I find it amazing so here I go again. It concerns the 1983-84 Washington Capitals:

The Caps in 1984 had a fine season -- 101 points, fifth overall, just three points behind the defending champ Islanders -- but what's amazing is their defensive game. They were 1st in the NHL on defence, with 226 goals allowed. That was nearly 30 goals fewer (!) than 2nd best Buffalo, and 164 goals fewer (!!) than pathetic Pittsburgh (hello, Mario).

But what's most amazing is the Caps in the second half of 1983-84. So, the season started with them going an utterly disastrous 0-7-0. After game six, they pulled off the trade that landed them Larry Murphy. Once Murphy joined, they won 7 out of 8 games (getting stomped by Edmonton once for the only loss) and were back in the hunt.

Even so, up to game 42, the Caps were only 19-20-3.

Amazingly, they then went 29-7-2 the rest of the way, the League's #1 record over that time. (The Caps were actually the NHL's best team over the final 45 games of the regular season.)

Anyway, the Caps' team defence in the second half was out-of-this-world good. Remember, this was a season when Edmonton scored 446 goals and four different clubs allowed around 375 to nearly 400 (Pittsburgh). In the final 40 games, the Caps allowed only 84 goals against (and in one of those games they lost in just-revived overtime, so really it's 83 goals against per all comparables for decades prior). This is a great stat for any team in any (non-DPE) era, but it's staggering for 1983-84. The second-best defensive club over this period (Buffalo) allowed 113 goals against, nearly 30 more in only 40 games (!).

Over this latter 40 games, the Caps' PK was at nearly 90%, which must have been a big part of their success (their "net" PK was almost 92%). On average, they were allowing only 23 shots against, per game (for comparison, Pittsburgh allowed over 37 per game).

Over this super-40-games-of-defence, every Cap skater who played 5 or more games was a "plus" at evens, with Dave Christian topping them all with a +28 in just forty games.

So, looking at other 1980s'-era clubs with strong defensive records, can any team beat the Caps' 84 goals against (or 83, by pre-1983-84 standards) over the first- or second-half of any season?

1980-81 Canadiens
First 40 games = 109 GA
Last 40 games = 119 GA

1981-82 Canadiens
First 40 games = 120 GA
Last 40 games = 103 GA

1982-83 Bruins
First 40 games = 117 GA
Last 40 games = 111 GA

1982-83 Islanders
First 40 games = 124 GA
Last 40 games = 102 GA

1986-87 Flyers
First 40 games = 107 GA
Last 40 games = 138 GA

1988-89 Canadiens
First 40 games = 122 GA
Last 40 games = 96 GA

1988-89 Flames
First 40 games = 114 GA
Last 40 games = 112 GA

Those are just some that I thought to check, but nobody even comes close to the Caps' back-half of 1983-84.

Of course, it's nice if you can throw out Langway, Stevens, and Murphy all night...

 

[Voight]

 

[Staniowski]

I've mentioned this somewhere before, but I find it amazing so here I go again. It concerns the 1983-84 Washington Capitals:

The Caps in 1984 had a fine season -- 101 points, fifth overall, just three points behind the defending champ Islanders -- but what's amazing is their defensive game. They were 1st in the NHL on defence, with 226 goals allowed. That was nearly 30 goals fewer (!) than 2nd best Buffalo, and 164 goals fewer (!!) than pathetic Pittsburgh (hello, Mario).

But what's most amazing is the Caps in the second half of 1983-84. So, the season started with them going an utterly disastrous 0-7-0. After game six, they pulled off the trade that landed them Larry Murphy. Once Murphy joined, they won 7 out of 8 games (getting stomped by Edmonton once for the only loss) and were back in the hunt.

Even so, up to game 42, the Caps were only 19-20-3.

Amazingly, they then went 29-7-2 the rest of the way, the League's #1 record over that time. (The Caps were actually the NHL's best team over the final 45 games of the regular season.)

Anyway, the Caps' team defence in the second half was out-of-this-world good. Remember, this was a season when Edmonton scored 446 goals and four different clubs allowed around 375 to nearly 400 (Pittsburgh). In the final 40 games, the Caps allowed only 84 goals against (and in one of those games they lost in just-revived overtime, so really it's 83 goals against per all comparables for decades prior). This is a great stat for any team in any (non-DPE) era, but it's staggering for 1983-84. The second-best defensive club over this period (Buffalo) allowed 113 goals against, nearly 30 more in only 40 games (!).

Over this latter 40 games, the Caps' PK was at nearly 90%, which must have been a big part of their success (their "net" PK was almost 92%). On average, they were allowing only 23 shots against, per game (for comparison, Pittsburgh allowed over 37 per game).

Over this super-40-games-of-defence, every Cap skater who played 5 or more games was a "plus" at evens, with Dave Christian topping them all with a +28 in just forty games.

So, looking at other 1980s'-era clubs with strong defensive records, can any team beat the Caps' 84 goals against (or 83, by pre-1983-84 standards) over the first- or second-half of any season?

1980-81 Canadiens
First 40 games = 109 GA
Last 40 games = 119 GA

1981-82 Canadiens
First 40 games = 120 GA
Last 40 games = 103 GA

1982-83 Bruins
First 40 games = 117 GA
Last 40 games = 111 GA

1982-83 Islanders
First 40 games = 124 GA
Last 40 games = 102 GA

1986-87 Flyers
First 40 games = 107 GA
Last 40 games = 138 GA

1988-89 Canadiens
First 40 games = 122 GA
Last 40 games = 96 GA

1988-89 Flames
First 40 games = 114 GA
Last 40 games = 112 GA

Those are just some that I thought to check, but nobody even comes close to the Caps' back-half of 1983-84.

Of course, it's nice if you can throw out Langway, Stevens, and Murphy all night...

That's Bryan Murray's 2nd full season, which has a lot to do with the focus on defense; Langway's 2nd season, same thing; Larry Murphy adds another dimension. They've got some other good players too.

The Capitals are really digging in on defense. Considering the little-defense era, such a team can really distinguish themselves.