Confirmed Signing with Link: [NYR] NY Rangers re-sign Kevin Hayes (2 years, $2.6M AAV)

[Thordic]

Sounds to me like Hayes is pretty much useless as a forward in general. At least based on the comments here and other things I've heard Ranger fans say about KH.

Not at all. He's had games where he looks like Joe Thornton out there. The size and skill is there for him to be a #2 center in a year or two, he just needs to work harder.

 

[aufheben]

Even at max retention I don't see any of those players returning a big ticket player. Unless said player has a big ticket cap hit on top of that.

Sounds to me like Hayes is pretty much useless as a forward in general. At least based on the comments here and other things I've heard Ranger fans say about KH.

He was great his rookie year. Sophomore slump. Very skilled player.

 

[darko]

He was great his rookie year. Sophomore slump. Very skilled player.

Yup.

 

[TGWL]

Not at all. He's had games where he looks like Joe Thornton out there. The size and skill is there for him to be a #2 center in a year or two, he just needs to work harder.

He has never had a game where he looked like Joe Thornton. But, I agree that if he shows up to camp in shape and can be consistent, his upside should be a #2. Not sure he gets there.

 

[pld459666]

Good deal for player and team.

 

[bernmeister]

As expected, Gorts has earned the bernmeister seal of approval!

 

[One Winged Angel]

Huh? I think he is doing worse at center.

His skating is ill suited for center and his faceoff percentage is fighting for worst in the league among qualified centers

You definitely don't watch him either. This proves it.

 

[WesMcCauley]

Not at all. He's had games where he looks like Joe Thornton out there. The size and skill is there for him to be a #2 center in a year or two, he just needs to work harder.

He has never looked like Jumbo.

He has extremely good hands, huge guy and is skilled but he is extremely slow and holds on to the puck for way to long. Not to mention his backchecking is horrible because he cant catch them because he is so slow. He doesnt really backcheck hard anyway so that gives him no chance of catching them. He was lazy as hell this season and didnt work hard enough at all. Needs to step it up and not only get better defensivly(just try to backcheck and cover your guy in the defensive sone) but plz pass the puck instead of stickhandling the hell out of it. Ive never seen a player be so off in terms of not being able to give up the puck at the right time. Everything he did this season was just so slow i have no words for it. Wasnt really that big of a problem in his rookie year but this season he was awful at times and rarely did anything impressive. Did more harm than good during long stretches which is why he was scratched and got limited minutes after that. I always get really annoyed when big guys like him doesnt use it to his advantage. Not only with protecting the puck etc but atleast hit someone or let them know you are on the ice. He is the definition of a SOFT player.

 

[WesMcCauley]

You definitely don't watch him either. This proves it.

agree. He is not a winger and faceoffs is the most overrated stat in hockey. Its not an important stat at all. Sure some times winning a faceoff is importantl(like in the defensive sone with 15 seconds left) but Hayes isnt on the ice when the critical faceoffs are taken(if he is, its not because anyone wants him on the ice for it).

 

[Calad]

2 years 2.6mill per

 

[Savant]

No sticky?

 

[Vitto79]

Now Hayes can recruit vessey . Do it !

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

I was thinking 2.25 x 2, so meh. Not a big deal, he'll be a good asset

 

[SenzZen]

Good bridge deal.

Wow that's interesting. Should just pull the trigger on Girardi and be done with it.

 

[Skobel24]

Just checked, NYR about $3.4 mil in cap space now?

Not a huge amount but if they could retain on someone like Staal, Nash, or Girardi, there would be enough room to bring back another big ticket player

Except nobody is taking Girardi or Staal with their contracts/NMC.

 

[mouser]

Not quite correct, the buyout window opens on the 3rd day following the settlement of the last arbitration case. So it will open Monday through Wednesday (48 hours).

 

[Mad Brills*]

Is he a UFA in 2 years?

 

[YngwieJ86]

agree. He is not a winger and faceoffs is the most overrated stat in hockey. Its not an important stat at all. Sure some times winning a faceoff is importantl(like in the defensive sone with 15 seconds left) but Hayes isnt on the ice when the critical faceoffs are taken(if he is, its not because anyone wants him on the ice for it).

Say what??

That is absolutely one of the key things a good center should most definitely have!
I am already thinking about every power play Hayes (just using him as an example here) plays at center where most and every possession starts with a PK-unit having the puck first.

So face-offs in the offensive zone don't matter that much either?

Oh man, a team would have tough time winning if they most of the time have to backcheck the puck back before having an opportunity to attack.

But this is why also why i like reading HFBoards, the stuff some post really crack me up . Cheers for that

Just wow.

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

You definitely don't watch him either. This proves it.

Oh?

He is an average skater at BEST and his faceoff % is in the 30s for crying out loud.

If he wanders around out there lost on the wing then thats on the coaching staff to correct. He doesnt have the strengths to cut it as an NHL center long term, notably faceoffs and skating which are vitally important.

The only other guys that are poor skaters that still can solidly contribute as top 6 centers are guys like Getzlaf and Thornton who obviously have elite vision and skill and Hayes is clearly no where near that.

But back to the regular scheduled programming in telling other people they dont watch the rangers

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

Say what??

That is absolutely one of the key things a good center should most definitely have!
I am already thinking about every power play Hayes (just using him as an example here) plays at center where most and every possession starts with a PK-unit having the puck first.

So face-offs in the offensive zone don't matter that much either?

Oh man, a team would have tough time winning if they most of the time have to backcheck the puck back before having an opportunity to attack.

But this is why also why i like reading HFBoards, the stuff some post really crack me up . Cheers for that

Just wow.

At least someone thinks about the center position reasonably

How many top 9 centers in the NHL are sub 40% on draws and/or have other guys take their draws for them?

Outside of Hayes, I am not sure there are any. And why is that? Because coaches usually move those guys off center. Especially with mediocre skating like Hayes possesses

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

Kevin Hayes faceoff percentages:

2015-16: 35.9%
2014-15: 36.3%

No coach in the NHL is going to keep plugging him there all year long

Better off trying to coach him up to play wing than hoping he increases his faceoff percentage 15 points and always giving up possession on draws

 

[One Winged Angel]

Oh?

He is an average skater at BEST and his faceoff % is in the 30s for crying out loud.

If he wanders around out there lost on the wing then thats on the coaching staff to correct. He doesnt have the strengths to cut it as an NHL center long term, notably faceoffs and skating which are vitally important.

The only other guys that are poor skaters that still can solidly contribute as top 6 centers are guys like Getzlaf and Thornton who obviously have elite vision and skill and Hayes is clearly no where near that.

But back to the regular scheduled programming in telling other people they dont watch the rangers

All of this means absolutely nothing.

Your original statement was...

Huh? I think he is doing worse at center.

His skating is ill suited for center and his faceoff percentage is fighting for worst in the league among qualified centers

You said (again these are your words, I'm quoting your genius mind) that Hayes IS DOING WORSE at center, meaning that he's playing worse at center than he is at the wing.

Meanwhile multiple posters who watch the Rangers on a nightly basis have said the exact opposite.

Face off percentages aren't the be-all, end-all statistic to determining how effective a center is. Hayes scored at a near point per game clip in 2015 from the all-star break on, leading the Rangers in 2nd half points scored. Oh and he did it while playing center.

So, as part of our scheduled programming, you're once again misinformed and parading around your pompous opinion as fact because you think you're some guru on here, meanwhile, you couldn't be further from that and further from being right about the Rangers, once again.

Time to go back to the drawing board.

 

[HawkeyTalkMan]

All of this means absolutely nothing.

Your original statement was...



You said (again these are your words, I'm quoting your genius mind) that Hayes IS DOING WORSE at center, meaning that he's playing worse at center than he is at the wing.

Meanwhile multiple posters who watch the Rangers on a nightly basis have said the exact opposite.

Face off percentages aren't the be-all, end-all statistic to determining how effective a center is. Hayes scored at a near point per game clip in 2015 from the all-star break on, leading the Rangers in 2nd half points scored. Oh and he did it while playing center.

So, as part of our scheduled programming, you're once again misinformed and parading around your pompous opinion as fact because you think you're some guru on here, meanwhile, you couldn't be further from that and further from being right about the Rangers, once again.

Time to go back to the drawing board.

Yes, I would consider a guy with average at best skating and a BRUTAL faceoff percentage to be doing worse at a position that requires you to cover more ice than anyone else along with getting killed at the key heads up matchup that begins every play to be doing worse

but you know, cant convince you to understand how being a slow footed center with the worst faceoff percentage in the league how guy is just not doing well at center. yet you want to use such a minute sample size of half of one season to reinforce your point whereas I will continue to use his whole two full seasons

continue on with warping the truth. must be some reason a successful NHL coach like AV moved him off center. But maybe you can write him a letter about how HF board posters know more about the game than him

 

[WesMcCauley]

Say what??

That is absolutely one of the key things a good center should most definitely have!
I am already thinking about every power play Hayes (just using him as an example here) plays at center where most and every possession starts with a PK-unit having the puck first.

So face-offs in the offensive zone don't matter that much either?

Oh man, a team would have tough time winning if they most of the time have to backcheck the puck back before having an opportunity to attack.

But this is why also why i like reading HFBoards, the stuff some post really crack me up . Cheers for that

Just wow.

Im not saying its a good thing having a 36% faceoff guy as center. Winning faceoffs is certainly a positive in certain situations. But saying faceoff is an important stats is stupid. Winning faceoffs=not much influence on winning or losing a game. Shouldnt it have a big impact of the outcome of the game for it to be considered an important stat?
Arizona and Carolina had the best faceoff % in the nhl this season. Didnt help much. Malkin had 42% and scored over ppg. Beeing good on faceoffs doesnt influence games enough for it to actually be an important stat. NYR has been a horrible faceoff team for many years now but has been one of the best teams in the league the last 4-5 years. Winning or losing a faceoff doesnt influence the game nearly enough for it to be considered an important stat imo. NYR for example often put out the 4th line at the end of the game to try to win the faceoff and grind it out. Problem is they cant keep the puck even if they win the faceoff so its right back in their sone 10 seconds later. Same goes for tons of veteran players that are good on faceoff but not much else.

 

[YngwieJ86]

Im not saying its a good thing having a 36% faceoff guy as center. Winning faceoffs is certainly a positive in certain situations. But saying faceoff is an important stats is stupid. Winning faceoffs=not much influence on winning or losing a game. Shouldnt it have a big impact of the outcome of the game for it to be considered an important stat?
Arizona and Carolina had the best faceoff % in the nhl this season. Didnt help much. Malkin had 42% and scored over ppg. Beeing good on faceoffs doesnt influence games enough for it to actually be an important stat. NYR has been a horrible faceoff team for many years now but has been one of the best teams in the league the last 4-5 years. Winning or losing a faceoff doesnt influence the game nearly enough for it to be considered an important stat imo. NYR for example often put out the 4th line at the end of the game to try to win the faceoff and grind it out. Problem is they cant keep the puck even if they win the faceoff so its right back in their sone 10 seconds later. Same goes for tons of veteran players that are good on faceoff but not much else.

Now you're just row-row rowing like a sailor, just to remind you what you wrote and i commented on:

"agree. He is not a winger and faceoffs is the most overrated stat in hockey. Its not an important stat at all. Sure some times winning a faceoff is importantl(like in the defensive sone with 15 seconds left) but Hayes isnt on the ice when the critical faceoffs are taken(if he is, its not because anyone wants him on the ice for it)."

I have no intention on arguing about this, i have watched hockey more or less since the early 90's and for 15 years been greatly into scouting, player development, analytics and tactics. Also in NFL, NBA and soccer.

You can argue how you want and maybe you should ask a modern puck control preaching coach how he likes it. To have the upper hand easier by winning the face-off or by chasing it from the other team most of the time.

With todays marginal differences in overall talent of a team, coaching and tighter team play the "small" things matter. Doesn't matter how you chew it.

Bringing special talent like Malkin into Hayes conversation? Alright. Let's put it this way, how many games would've Dave Steckel or Paul Gaustad played if they had 42% in face-offs?