Proposal: NYI/Columbus and NYI/Arizona

[WingsMJN2965]

The jackets do that everyday and twice on Sunday. NYI does not trade a proven #1 center for a scoring winger

Depends on if they want to compete now or in the future.

Realistically, pending the lottery, Columbus has picks 6 and 12 in a draft that’s top heavy with centers, plus Johnson and Sillinger.

 

[MoeBartoli]

It’s an easy no for me as a Jackets fan. The production of the Columbus duo exceeds the NY pair and both Laine and Boone want to be here. I love watching Barzel and would love to have him, but in my mind Barzel’s production falls slightly less than what’s I‘d expect of someone with his skills. Part of that might be playing under Trotz’s defensive demands. And I like Beauvillier, but he’s not as valuable to Columbus as the guys they'd be trading.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Columbus says YES, Arizona says NO.

 

[The Real JT]

In a bubble that offer is good for Columbus. In real life, the Jackets are trying to get a center to play with Laine not trade him for a center. The FO has expressed interest in signing Laine long term and Laine has publicly expressed that the feeling is mutual and that he wants to stay in Columbus.

After the perception of players not wanting to be here, it would be foolish to trade a big time all star who wants to be here.


Not only all that, NYI NEVER even thinks about this unless Barzal expresses his intent to leave.

I’ll add this. Barzal is a Pacific Northwest kid. If he’s not re-signing with the Isles, I suspect there are more than a few options out west (rather than Colombus) that would appeal to him.

 

[ThreeLeftSkates]

A really bored male.

 

[VT]

To the first proposal: CLB enthusiastically says yes, and the Isles say no.

To the second proposal: this is so bad for ARI that it makes me non-Coyotes fans want to cry. I’m not even sure the 13th overall + Wahlstrom is enough to get Crouse straight up. If I’m AZ, I’d rather extend him long term and maybe put a C on his jersey.

So the 13th + Wahlstrom is most definitely not enough for Chychrun. If you want Chychrun but (understandably) don’t want to give up Barzal or Dobson in return, ARI just isn’t interested.

Where is written CLB say yes? Laine could score and take points even with non-playmaker Jenner and Nyquist in the line, he wasn't depend on his partners. One is more better in his play in all zones, has very good forchecking.

 

[jmelm]

Where is written CLB say yes? Laine could score and take points even with non-playmaker Jenner and Nyquist in the line, he wasn't depend on his partners. One is more better in his play in all zones, has very good forchecking.

Where is it written that CLB says yes? Well it’s not #11 on the tablets that Moses brought down the top of the mountain from God….but it is written in my post, which is the next closest thing.

Laine is an excellent player who I (and hopefully all of the hockey world) should be pleased had a very good year for CLB. But he’s been inconsistent and temperamental at times and not always a reliable 200ft player. And of course he’s a W.

Barzal is simply a more valuable and player given that he’s a C, and impacts the game more from the point of view of being a far, far better playmaker, as well as being a better 200 ft player. His offensive numbers will pop back up again now that Trotz won’t be the coach.

There’s just more risk building long term with Laine vs building long term with Barzal, and especially for a team that desperately needs a #1 C (Columbus), they take Barzal 10 times out of 10.

Re. Jenner/Beauvillier. If they were the same age, I would lean towards Jenner because he brings a bit more jam and character. But the difference isn’t big enough that especially for a team like Columbus, who is building to the future and should be about 2-3 years from truly making the jump into a legit contender mode, Beauvillier being 4 years younger makes him the player I would take to go forward on that timeline.

But even if you put age aside and pretend they were the same age, the amount that I’d prefer Jenner over Beauvillier is more than made up for by the amount I’d prefer Barzal over Laine.

 

[VT]

Where is it written that CLB says yes? Well it’s not #11 on the tablets that Moses brought down the top of the mountain from God….but it is written in my post, which is the next closest thing.

Laine is an excellent player who I (and hopefully all of the hockey world) should be pleased had a very good year for CLB. But he’s been inconsistent and temperamental at times and not always a reliable 200ft player. And of course he’s a W.

Barzal is simply a more valuable and player given that he’s a C, and impacts the game more from the point of view of being a far, far better playmaker, as well as being a better 200 ft player. His offensive numbers will pop back up again now that Trotz won’t be the coach.

There’s just more risk building long term with Laine vs building long term with Barzal, and especially for a team that desperately needs a #1 C (Columbus), they take Barzal 10 times out of 10.

Re. Jenner/Beauvillier. If they were the same age, I would lean towards Jenner because he brings a bit more jam and character. But the difference isn’t big enough that especially for a team like Columbus, who is building to the future and should be about 2-3 years from truly making the jump into a legit contender mode, Beauvillier being 4 years younger makes him the player I would take to go forward on that timeline.

But even if you put age aside and pretend they were the same age, the amount that I’d prefer Jenner over Beauvillier is more than made up for by the amount I’d prefer Barzal over Laine.

We have Sillinger, maybe Johnson (he should play center), can draft a center. If not count Roslovic who has progressed. Also Laine had excelent chemistry with Jenner what is important because it means the 1th center for him isn't such important.
Btw, Marchenko can play center too.
So tell me, why Barzal?
To Jenner. He's the soul of the team, a real leader. I think an untouchable player.

 

[Viqsi]

Where is it written that CLB says yes? Well it’s not #11 on the tablets that Moses brought down the top of the mountain from God….but it is written in my post, which is the next closest thing.

Then your post is wrong. We're not giving up Jenner period, and Laine legitimately wants to be here, which we can't guarantee with Barzal. He'd be welcome, but after getting screwed over and/or left at the altar so many times we want the sure thing. Especially given the number of very high quality center prospects we have.

The Islanders shouldn't touch it with a ten-foot cattle prod, for sure, but that doesn't mean Columbus would like it. Trades can be lose-lose.

 

[AZviaNJ]

For the Coyotes to say yes, Crouse out and Bolduc in.

Chychrun for 13oa, Wahlstrom and Bolduc.

 

[Isles72]

no thanks , but how about a smaller deal ?

isles could use someone like Slava Gavrikov (lhd , 2 years left 2.8 aav)

name your price

 

[Taswell]

Yikes Bored...just yikes.

 

[jmelm]

We have Sillinger, maybe Johnson (he should play center), can draft a center. If not count Roslovic who has progressed. Also Laine had excelent chemistry with Jenner what is important because it means the 1th center for him isn't such important.
Btw, Marchenko can play center too.
So tell me, why Barzal?
To Jenner. He's the soul of the team, a real leader. I think an untouchable player.

If you want to know why Barzal, just start a thread on the NHL talk or have a poll of who people would rather have -- Barzal or Laine.

I would expect Barzal will win that survey with 80-90% of the votes.

And as for CLB, sure: Johnson MIGHT be a C, but he might not. Sillinger is a C, but he may realistically top out as a really good 2C and not a legit high end 1C.

Barzal is a legit 1C. That is simply more valuable than a legit top line winger, unless that winger is at an Ovechkin/Kane/Kaprizov/Huberdea/etc level. Laine is not that.

Then your post is wrong. We're not giving up Jenner period, and Laine legitimately wants to be here, which we can't guarantee with Barzal. He'd be welcome, but after getting screwed over and/or left at the altar so many times we want the sure thing. Especially given the number of very high quality center prospects we have.

The Islanders shouldn't touch it with a ten-foot cattle prod, for sure, but that doesn't mean Columbus would like it. Trades can be lose-lose.

Hey, newsflash: I didn't make this trade proposal, and I'm neither a NYI or CLB fan. I'm responding to the question posed and I do not believe there is a single GM in the NHL out of the 32 that would take Laine over Barzal.

And while I absolutely love Jenner and woulnd't trade him straight up for Beauvillier, Jenner > Beauvillier does not bridge the gap of Barzal over Laine.

 

[Viqsi]

Hey, newsflash: I didn't make this trade proposal, and I'm neither a NYI or CLB fan. I'm responding to the question posed and I do not believe there is a single GM in the NHL out of the 32 that would take Laine over Barzal.

That's not the question that was posed, though. The question was whether or not the current holders of the four players in question would potentially agree to such a trade. And Columbus has no good reason to do so, considering the circumstances. Whether or not the Islanders have any good reason to do so (spoiler alert: LOL) is a different consideration.

 

[jmelm]

That's not the question that was posed, though. The question was whether or not the current holders of the four players in question would potentially agree to such a trade. And Columbus has no good reason to do so, considering the circumstances.

It depends on your perspective of the "circumstances".

I would rather simply to Laine straight up for Barzal and keep Jenner and Beauvillier out of this.

However, on balance and considering the circumstances as I perceive them, of CLB being a younger team who in 2-3 years away from legit playoff/round-winning contention, Beauvillier being 4 years younger is somewhat appealing.

But even that aside, I still think Barzal's value to a team is >> Laine's value to a team to warrant giving up Jenner for Beauvillier, as much as I'd prefer to keep Jenner.

 

[Jive Pawnbroker]

The Jackets are on the right track in the rebuild and have no need to pursue this proposal. With any luck they will draft their own Barzal (or better) when they are done and still have Laine and Jenner.

 

[Viqsi]

It depends on your perspective of the "circumstances".

I would rather simply to Laine straight up for Barzal and keep Jenner and Beauvillier out of this.

However, on balance and considering the circumstances as I perceive them, of CLB being a younger team who in 2-3 years away from legit playoff/round-winning contention, Beauvillier being 4 years younger is somewhat appealing.

But even that aside, I still think Barzal's value to a team is >> Laine's value to a team to warrant giving up Jenner for Beauvillier, as much as I'd prefer to keep Jenner.

That's a fair opinion; I just object to the implied notion in your earlier posts that it's a foregone conclusion.

 

[jmelm]

That's a fair opinion; I just object to the implied notion in your earlier posts that it's a foregone conclusion.

I hear what you're saying and respect it, but I do believe it would be a "no brainer" to accept an offer of Barzal + Beauvillier for Laine + Jenner, assuming CLB could get a long term extension agreed to in principle with Barzal as part of the trade.

 

[doublechili]

For the Coyotes to say yes, Crouse out and Bolduc in.

Chychrun for 13oa, Wahlstrom and Bolduc.

I proposed that exact deal on the Isles board and a fellow fan told me it wasn't enough. I thought it was pretty fair, so it's good to see you propose the same thing. There's always risk with prospects/picks, but the potential upside for AZ is really good.

 

[VT]

If you want to know why Barzal, just start a thread on the NHL talk or have a poll of who people would rather have -- Barzal or Laine.

I would expect Barzal will win that survey with 80-90% of the votes.

And as for CLB, sure: Johnson MIGHT be a C, but he might not. Sillinger is a C, but he may realistically top out as a really good 2C and not a legit high end 1C.

Barzal is a legit 1C. That is simply more valuable than a legit top line winger, unless that winger is at an Ovechkin/Kane/Kaprizov/Huberdea/etc level. Laine is not that.




Hey, newsflash: I didn't make this trade proposal, and I'm neither a NYI or CLB fan. I'm responding to the question posed and I do not believe there is a single GM in the NHL out of the 32 that would take Laine over Barzal.

And while I absolutely love Jenner and woulnd't trade him straight up for Beauvillier, Jenner > Beauvillier does not bridge the gap of Barzal over Laine.

How many from these people who would vote did see Laine in the season?

 

[jmelm]

How many from these people who would vote did see Laine in the season?

On this board of hockey geeks, I would expect it to be well north of 90%. But don't ask me -- ask them.

 

[saintunspecified]

As an Islander fan, trading for top-4 LHD is the #1 priority before the draft/at free agency. There's little doubt that NYI will target Chychrun, or others of that type - Cam Fowler (probably not available), Nate Schmidt, maybe? Maybe a return of Nick Leddy? Idk, but someone who can move to play with Noah Dobson or Ryan Pulock to make the breakout more dynamic. They also need a 3rd pairing LD. With Pelech, Dobson, and Pulock, NYI need to make their D unit the driving force of the team. They can imo.

The second priority before the draft is to move Josh Bailey.

Trying to add a dynamic winger should imo wait until the UFA period, as there will be a lot on the market, and a lot of parts that may move as a result. Trading Barzal for Laine is poor asset management. And there's not much reason to think that Laine would even fit the team!

Jenners leadership is redundant for NYI, or maybe it gets in the way (not a criticism of Jenner). NYI have Lee, JPG, Nelson, Pelech, etc. It's simply not what NYI are missing. I agree with those saying there's no point including him in a deal.

 

[VT]

On this board of hockey geeks, I would expect it to be well north of 90%. But don't ask me -- ask them.

Laine in Jets and Laine in Blue Jackets in this season are two different players. That's why it's important to see his play in this season.

 

[AZviaNJ]

I proposed that exact deal on the Isles board and a fellow fan told me it wasn't enough. I thought it was pretty fair, so it's good to see you propose the same thing. There's always risk with prospects/picks, but the potential upside for AZ is really good.

It's really what the Coyotes need out of a Chychrun deal. 13OA creates great flexibility in the upcoming draft.

They could go Nemec/Jiricik at 3, then come back and grab McGroaty, Geekie or one of the bigger forwards that drop at 13. Or could go Slaf/Cooley at 3 and one of Mateychuk/Korchinski/Mintyukov at 13. Or use the draft capital to move up and try to grab Slaf/Cooley and Nemec/Jiricik.

Wahlstrom will get the opportunity to play top 6 and 1PP minutes in Arizona. He'll be a 20-25 goal scorer. He could be a long-term solution.....or the Coyotes could look to move him after (hopefully) a big season.

Bolduc is a big LHD and would be redundant with the Islanders, fits the profile of the type of players GMBA is attempting to build around.

Chych obviously steps in and becomes Dobson's running mate and the Isles have maybe the best top 4 in the NHL.

And if the Islanders want to include Bailey in the deal, Arizona could accommodate, but Isles would need to add additional draft capital/prospects.

Finally, the Islanders are my 2nd favorite team, I watch most of their games.

 

[doublechili]

It's really what the Coyotes need out of a Chychrun deal. 13OA creates great flexibility in the upcoming draft.

They could go Nemec/Jiricik at 3, then come back and grab McGroaty, Geekie or one of the bigger forwards that drop at 13. Or could go Slaf/Cooley at 3 and one of Mateychuk/Korchinski/Mintyukov at 13. Or use the draft capital to move up and try to grab Slaf/Cooley and Nemec/Jiricik.

Wahlstrom will get the opportunity to play top 6 and 1PP minutes in Arizona. He'll be a 20-25 goal scorer. He could be a long-term solution.....or the Coyotes could look to move him after (hopefully) a big season.

Bolduc is a big LHD and would be redundant with the Islanders, fits the profile of the type of players GMBA is attempting to build around.

Chych obviously steps in and becomes Dobson's running mate and the Isles have maybe the best top 4 in the NHL.

And if the Islanders want to include Bailey in the deal, Arizona could accommodate, but Isles would need to add additional draft capital/prospects.

Finally, the Islanders are my 2nd favorite team, I watch most of their games.

Good stuff. Another plus for the Isles is that Chyrchrun would fill their biggest lineup hole perfectly, and with his salary there might be room to sign a top 6 winger (hence the Bailey idea may also come into play). And the 13OA should yield a good prospect, Wahlstrom will be a goal-scorer in the league, and Bolduc fits the classic big D/late bloomer profile. I wouldn't give that package up for almost anyone else - but Chychrun is such a good fit.