Proposal: NYI - CBJ blockbuster

[ViD]

As I’m hearing more and more from the NYI fans these two might become available and the team is heading into a rebuild, while Columbus seems to have been going in circles collecting picks and prospects, I think it’s time to make a splash and acquire star talent what will rejuvenate the franchise and finish the rebuild.

Columbus trades its best defensive prospect in Jiricek as there’s reports of his rep team and CBJ management having some disagreement regarding his ice time.

Jackets also add a mid 6 center / winger Cole Sillinger who fits really well into the Isles gritty style and the biggest addition of all, no pun intended - the young 6’5 power forward Dmitry Voronkov who possesses both grit and skill. It’s extremely hard to give up on him but the emergence of Olivier should help healing the hole in our bottom 6.

Finally, Columbus adds a 3rd round pick as a sweetener.

Jackets get a dream first pairing of Dobson and Werenski and a great center for KJ and Fantilli making the top 6 of

Marchenko - Monahan - Chinakhov
KJ - Barzal - Fantilli


David Jiricek RHD
Cole Sillinger C/W
Dmitry Voronkov RW
CBJ 3rd round pick


Matt Barzal C
Noah Dobson RHD

Click to read more...

 

[Empoleon8771]

Can't imagine that the Islanders even remotely consider this. Trading Barzal and Dobson for what looks like 2 struggling former high picks, a 3rd liner and a 3rd just doesn't seem close to what the Islanders would want.

Feel free to argue that I'm misrepresenting Sillinger and Jiricek by calling them "2 struggling former high picks", but I still think it's more accurate than not.

 

[Viqsi]

Can't imagine that the Islanders even remotely consider this. Trading Barzal and Dobson for what looks like 2 struggling former high picks, a 3rd liner and a 3rd just doesn't seem close to what the Islanders would want.

Feel free to argue that I'm misrepresenting Sillinger and Jiricek by calling them "2 struggling former high picks", but I still think it's more accurate than not.

There's a lot of wiggle room in that characterization, and lots of folks like to presume that folks are at the bottom of that wiggle room while Sillinger and Jiricek are closer to the top, but otherwise, yeah, that's technically a fair statement. Just one that's easily abused in motivated reasoning.

 

[SteelCityCannon]

I both feel that the Islanders wouldn't take it and that's the best package they'd get simultaneously.

 

[miscs75]

The vocal extreme minority isn’t most Islanders fans. Most wouldn’t touch that with a 10 foot pole. Going to have to upgrade the pieces substantially to make something happen because middle six guys with a future consideration draft pick doesn’t get it done.

 

[Juxtaposer]

I feel like this would be closer if you took out Voronkov and Barzal...

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

Thats nowhere near enough for Dobson + Barzal

Dobson on his own is at least worth Jiricek + Sillinger + 3rd

 

[Petes2424]

As I’m hearing more and more from the NYI fans these two might become available and the team is heading into a rebuild, while Columbus seems to have been going in circles collecting picks and prospects, I think it’s time to make a splash and acquire star talent what will rejuvenate the franchise and finish the rebuild.

Columbus trades its best defensive prospect in Jiricek as there’s reports of his rep team and CBJ management having some disagreement regarding his ice time.

Jackets also add a mid 6 center / winger Cole Sillinger who fits really well into the Isles gritty style and the biggest addition of all, no pun intended - the young 6’5 power forward Dmitry Voronkov who possesses both grit and skill. It’s extremely hard to give up on him but the emergence of Olivier should help healing the hole in our bottom 6.

Finally, Columbus adds a 3rd round pick as a sweetener.

Jackets get a dream first pairing of Dobson and Werenski and a great center for KJ and Fantilli making the top 6 of

Marchenko - Monahan - Chinakhov
KJ - Barzal - Fantilli


David Jiricek RHD
Cole Sillinger C/W
Dmitry Voronkov RW
CBJ 3rd round pick


Matt Barzal C
Noah Dobson RHD

You usually lose a trade when you’re giving up the best player in the trade. Especially when he’s not an older, declining player. To include the second best player in the trade, no matter any struggles he may currently have, is just asking for the trade to blow up in your face…. no matter how much unproven talent you’re getting in return.

So why would you do it, when you’re not forced to move players? It’s the type of trade that gets GMs fired. It would be one thing if Dobson and Barzal were forcing their way out of NY. That’s not the case here. You’re also including two prospects who’ve had their ups and downs. Increasing the chances, it blows up in your face.

Can’t see Lou ever agreeing to this deal. Just too many things to overcome, just to “maybe” end up, right where they already are competitively.

 

[ViD]

You usually lose a trade when you’re giving up the best player in the trade. Especially when he’s not an older, declining player. To include the second best player in the trade, no matter any struggles he may currently have, is just asking for the trade to blow up in your face…. no matter how much unproven talent you’re getting in return.

So why would you do it, when you’re not forced to move players? It’s the type of trade that gets GMs fired. It would be one thing if Dobson and Barzal were forcing their way out of NY. That’s not the case here. You’re also including two prospects who’ve had their ups and downs. Increasing the chances, it blows up in your face.

Can’t see Lou ever agreeing to this deal. Just too many things to overcome, just to “maybe” end up, right where they already are competitively.

Well, I’m following the threads some NYI fans created where they’re claiming both Barzal and Dobson are possibly available and they’re starting a rebuild. Typically you acquire blue chip prospects and picks when rebuilding

 

[Empoleon8771]

There's a lot of wiggle room in that characterization, and lots of folks like to presume that folks are at the bottom of that wiggle room while Sillinger and Jiricek are closer to the top, but otherwise, yeah, that's technically a fair statement. Just one that's easily abused in motivated reasoning.

Yeah I don't mean that as in they're nothing pieces, but struggling young guys don't bring back 2 well established good players.

I agree with the other posts in here that Sillinger, Jirecek and a 3rd for Dobson or Barzal seems a lot more reasonable.

 

[Bizz]

Islanders add

 

[HockeyVirus]

This proposal is so biased I am anointing you an honorary Leafs fan

 

[biturbo19]

I don't think this is even all that close on value for one of Barzal/Dobson, much less both.

 

[ViD]

I don't think this is even all that close on value for one of Barzal/Dobson, much less both.

This is mostly because of the fact that Jackets players are relatively unknown for outsiders. Voronkov was 7th in rookie scoring last season (on par with Knies) along with his unique size and skill. Sillinger is young but already an NHL regular with many games and Jiricek is still one of the best defensive prospects in the game

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Feel free to argue that I'm misrepresenting Sillinger and Jiricek by calling them "2 struggling former high picks", but I still think it's more accurate than not.

the perception of sillinger is skewed by his sophomore season (as a 19-year-old) where he had an impossibly low shooting percentage and really struggled. he bounced back well enough last year and looks a lot better this year.

based on my viewings this year, he looks like a long-term 2C who is maybe more of a plus 3C on a really deep team. but he's shown this year that he can take tough matchups, play PK + PP, and even play wing when asked.

jiricek is still just 20, and was the AHL rookie of the year at 18. he's coming up in rumors for a reason, but I don't think it has anything to do with his long-term projection. seems to me like waddell still wants to make some big changes, and jiricek is the best tool to utilize for that.

Well, I’m following the threads some NYI fans created where they’re claiming both Barzal and Dobson are possibly available and they’re starting a rebuild. Typically you acquire blue chip prospects and picks when rebuilding

generally speaking, when a team decides to do a tear-down, they get much better overall returns by dealing their stars separately.

if both guys became available, I'd be very keen on trying to push for both of them. but I think it would have to be something like:

• CBJ gets
  • Barzal
  • Dobson (extended)
• NYI gets
  • Jiricek
  • one of Sillinger / Voronkov
  • one of Dumais / Del Bel Belluz
  • 2025 CBJ 1st round pick (with protections)
  • whatever 1st round pick they end up getting for provorov

so, two young roster players with high draft pedigrees at premium positions, a good complimentary prospect, a potential top-10 pick and another late 1st. that's what I assume it would take to make a full tear-down appealing for NYI.

on the flip side, though, maybe I'm overvaluing those pieces because if Dobson gets something like $9m x 8 years that'd be about $126m in future commitments off the NYI books. cap space is a valuable commodity.

I don't think this is even all that close on value for one of Barzal/Dobson, much less both.

to OP's point, Voronkov is probably a much more valuable piece in NHL front offices than he is with the general public. he's 6'5, 240 pounds, mean, can play center, has good scoring touch and shockingly good hands/playmaking instincts. and he's still young + cheap on top of that.

 

[ViD]

the perception of sillinger is skewed by his sophomore season (as a 19-year-old) where he had an impossibly low shooting percentage and really struggled. he bounced back well enough last year and looks a lot better this year.

based on my viewings this year, he looks like a long-term 2C who is maybe more of a plus 3C on a really deep team. but he's shown this year that he can take tough matchups, play PK + PP, and even play wing when asked.

jiricek is still just 20, and was the AHL rookie of the year at 18. he's coming up in rumors for a reason, but I don't think it has anything to do with his long-term projection. seems to me like waddell still wants to make some big changes, and jiricek is the best tool to utilize for that.

generally speaking, when a team decides to do a tear-down, they get much better overall returns by dealing their stars separately.

if both guys became available, I'd be very keen on trying to push for both of them. but I think it would have to be something like:

• CBJ gets
  • Barzal
  • Dobson (extended)
• NYI gets
  • Jiricek
  • one of Sillinger / Voronkov
  • one of Dumais / Del Bel Belluz
  • 2025 CBJ 1st round pick (with protections)
  • whatever 1st round pick they end up getting for provorov

so, two young roster players with high draft pedigrees at premium positions, a good complimentary prospect, a potential top-10 pick and another late 1st. that's what I assume it would take to make a full tear-down appealing for NYI.

on the flip side, though, maybe I'm overvaluing those pieces because if Dobson gets something like $9m x 8 years that'd be about $126m in future commitments off the NYI books. cap space is a valuable commodity.


to OP's point, Voronkov is probably a much more valuable piece in NHL front offices than he is with the general public. he's 6'5, 240 pounds, mean, can play center, has good scoring touch and shockingly good hands/playmaking instincts. and he's still young + cheap on top of that.

Im okay with your proposal expect I would not give up CBJ 1st. I would be fine giving up the first we get for Provorov and still deal CBJ 3rd

 

[SI90]

Yeah that’s not enough.

Dobson is a 24 year old 70pt defensman on a team that struggles offensively. Those don’t grow on trees.

 

[57special]

Can't imagine that the Islanders even remotely consider this. Trading Barzal and Dobson for what looks like 2 struggling former high picks, a 3rd liner and a 3rd just doesn't seem close to what the Islanders would want.

Feel free to argue that I'm misrepresenting Sillinger and Jiricek by calling them "2 struggling former high picks", but I still think it's more accurate than not.

As un unbiased observer, I'd agree with this. Seems like a terrible deal for NYI.

 

[Cowumbus]

As a CBJ fan, I’d say we don’t have the pieces to give up and not destroy our roster to get Dobson. I don’t see the need for Barzal.

If I were an Isles fan, I’d be looking down the Sabres roster.

 

[miscs75]

As a CBJ fan, I’d say we don’t have the pieces to give up and not destroy our roster to get Dobson. I don’t see the need for Barzal.

If I were an Isles fan, I’d be looking down the Sabres roster.

The Sabres aren’t moving the pieces it would take to acquire those two either. They’d offer up a 2nd liner, cap dump, mediocre prospect and a couple picks thinking it’s enough. Anything short of a proven top line player (which they’re not moving), blue chip prospect and atleast 2 firsts and the Islanders don’t touch this. It would be like Columbus offering Fantilli, Lindstrom, 2025 1st and 2026 1st for these two and we know that isn’t happening.

 

[3074326]

I don’t think Sillinger + Jiricek is a bad base for Dobson, don’t think the third makes up the difference in value with Barzal in the deal though

 

[ViD]

I don’t think Sillinger + Jiricek is a bad base for Dobson, don’t think the third makes up the difference in value with Barzal in the deal though

You’re forgetting Voronkov who’s better than both Sillinger and Jiricek

 

[SJinNewJersey]

Lou doesn't do rebuilding.

 

[thebus88]

I feel like this would be closer if you took out Voronkov and Barzal...

Voronkov is quite underrated at this point. He’s a VERY impactful player and still getting used to the NHL and North America. Extremely unique and surprisingly skilled player. That said, yes, him and Barzal should be removed to make it more realistic. Barzal is a better/more valuable player, but, as a CBJ fan, I’d rather have Voronkov, with how the rest of the forwards/team is built. Fantilli/Chinakhov/Johnson/Marchenko/Brindley are all players that can fill a “scoring” role similar to Barzal
moving forward, without the team needing to spend the assets for a big name point producer.

Thats nowhere near enough for Dobson + Barzal

Dobson on his own is at least worth Jiricek + Sillinger + 3rd

Change the 3rd to a top 5-10 protected 1st and call it a day. I’m not sure Dobson is really the type of defenseman or player the CBJ should target for a package like this, but, I would accept it, and would so for a good number of other players, as I’m not a fan of either Sillinger or Jiricek at this point. Dumb players, IMO. Among other issues.

 

[Dr Quincy]

As I’m hearing more and more from the NYI fans these two might become available and the team is heading into a rebuild, while Columbus seems to have been going in circles collecting picks and prospects, I think it’s time to make a splash and acquire star talent what will rejuvenate the franchise and finish the rebuild.

Columbus trades its best defensive prospect in Jiricek as there’s reports of his rep team and CBJ management having some disagreement regarding his ice time.

Jackets also add a mid 6 center / winger Cole Sillinger who fits really well into the Isles gritty style and the biggest addition of all, no pun intended - the young 6’5 power forward Dmitry Voronkov who possesses both grit and skill. It’s extremely hard to give up on him but the emergence of Olivier should help healing the hole in our bottom 6.

Finally, Columbus adds a 3rd round pick as a sweetener.

Jackets get a dream first pairing of Dobson and Werenski and a great center for KJ and Fantilli making the top 6 of

Marchenko - Monahan - Chinakhov
KJ - Barzal - Fantilli


David Jiricek RHD
Cole Sillinger C/W
Dmitry Voronkov RW
CBJ 3rd round pick


Matt Barzal C
Noah Dobson RHD

NYI pass quite easily.