Post-Game Talk: November 4th: Canucks @ Avs

[Cousin Eddie]

Since you know the future, would you mind giving me the winning lottery numbers?

I know you love ROR and all but it seems very likely that he will be testing the UFA market.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

With 6 EJs it would not matter which system we play.
Each of our opponents will field half of an AHL team come playoff time because of the ridiculous and totally unexpected increase of broken shins around the league...

Could you imagine 6 EJ's though?? We would be unstoppable. Either that or there would be endless slapshots into shinpads turned into breakaways

 

[henchman21]

Man to man seems like it requires too much ability for an average dman
Like in order to play that way effectively you have to be a good skater, physical and smart. So we just need 5 more EJs and it could work.

This I disagree with. You need physical tools, but man-to-man systems are easier mentally than zone systems. IMO a large reason that EJ is playing better is that he is thinking less. His biggest issue prior to Roy is that he wasn't able to process the game quickly and would make bonehead mistakes and then become tentative. Now a lot of the thinking has been taken out and he can just play a simple, more aggressive game.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

With 6 EJs it would not matter which system we play.
Each of our opponents will field half of an AHL team come playoff time because of the ridiculous and totally unexpected increase of broken shins around the league...

Can you imagine how many colossally magnificent hits that would be just missed?

 

[Cousin Eddie]

Can you imagine how many colossally magnificent hits that would be just missed?

They would collide wth one another. Friendly fire everywhere!! At least we wouldn't have Guenin shooting the puck at our own players heads.

 

[The Shermanator]

Could you imagine 6 EJ's though?? We would be unstoppable. Either that or there would be endless slapshots into shinpads turned into breakaways

I've always thought about what it would be like if sextuplets or something ridiculous all played on the same sport team. Imagine all 5 players on the ice looking identical and being perfectly in sync with each other.

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

This I disagree with. You need physical tools, but man-to-man systems are easier mentally than zone systems. IMO a large reason that EJ is playing better is that he is thinking less. His biggest issue prior to Roy is that he wasn't able to process the game quickly and would make bonehead mistakes and then become tentative. Now a lot of the thinking has been taken out and he can just play a simple, more aggressive game.

I disagree with this somewhat. While a man to man system does reduce the amount of thinking overall, you still need to have the awareness to notice if the opposition is breaking free from the coverage. EJ is the only one that consistently recognizes when this happens. Guenin is likely the worst, he never breaks off from his man to man coverage even when it is blatantly obvious that the coverage has been broken.

 

[RockLobster]

Common RL, you can't deny that ROR is likely gone as soon as he's a FA.

I know you love ROR and all but it seems very likely that he will be testing the UFA market.

The problem I had with the_fan's comment was that he was speaking as if it's 100% certain, that it's undeniable fact.

He's here for 2 years, that's a long time for things to change.

The two statements you guys made includes one word that wasn't in his comment: "likely"

Now, I believe he's likely to be traded because they won't be able to come to terms on a contract extension, but I don't know that for sure--and I sure as hell won't act as if I did know with 100% certainty.

 

[hockeyfish]

Man to man seems like it requires too much ability for an average dman
Like in order to play that way effectively you have to be a good skater, physical and smart. So we just need 5 more EJs and it could work.

And we would still complain that we needed a lefty.

 

[henchman21]

I disagree with this somewhat. While a man to man system does reduce the amount of thinking overall, you still need to have the awareness to notice if the opposition is breaking free from the coverage. EJ is the only one that consistently recognizes when this happens. Guenin is likely the worst, he never breaks off from his man to man coverage even when it is blatantly obvious that the coverage has been broken.

I'm not saying it takes thinking/awareness/hockey IQ out completely, but compared to other systems, it is much less taxing mentally... but much more taxing physically.

 

[Freudian]

I'm not saying it takes thinking/awareness/hockey IQ out completely, but compared to other systems, it is much less taxing mentally... but much more taxing physically.

A zonal system has a failsafe when things break down. Collapse down low. A man on man system doesn't have that. Once you are beat, you are beat.

 

[InjuredChoker]

A zonal system has a failsafe when things break down. Collapse down low. A man on man system doesn't have that. Once you are beat, you are beat.

having some sort of overload/layer would help with that.

pure man on man is stupid for the reason you said. one you are beat, everything breaks down. and even if they can't beat you, they can cycle you to dead. they have to implement some sort of overload scenario where they overpower/number the opposition. and/or being more aggressive on the puck carriers. now they are just content on shadowing them, keeping them on the outside. but this D isn't good enough to do that for extended periods of time (if there even is D who could do that).

 

[henchman21]

A zonal system has a failsafe when things break down. Collapse down low. A man on man system doesn't have that. Once you are beat, you are beat.

It does... which is why many teams use it. Zone systems are much safer when breakdowns happen. Man on man simply requires a team to win the majority of the battles in the defensive zone. If you don't do that, the system will fail time and time again.

 

[JoemAvs]

It does... which is why many teams use it. Zone systems are much safer when breakdowns happen. Man on man simply requires a team to win the majority of the battles in the defensive zone. If you don't do that, the system will fail time and time again.

So basically you are saying that the Avs are probably the last team that should employ a man on man system given their lack of defensive talent?

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

No Stuart at practice.

Sounds like Roy is emphasizing the forwards need to support the defense better, which has been an issue. Just reading this from tweets.

https://twitter.com/BaconCrush

Roy emphasizing on whiteboard forward support. Some guys asking questions. Roy repeats. "You support".

"Support the guys playing below the goal"

"Do not release until the D have full control"

"We're not playing slower, we're supporting better"

Roy making it very clear the forwards are going to be much more involved in transitioning from defense to offense. "Must support better"

Going on 8 minutes of conversation now. Roy fielding questions from players and really making it clear what he wants.

 

[Wintersun]

So forwards will get even more tired at running even deeper in the d zone?

 

[SoundwaveIsCharisma]

So forwards will get even more tired at running even deeper in the d zone?

At this point, the Avs should just have 5 defenders lie down forming a semi-circle around the net.

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

So forwards will get even more tired at running even deeper in the d zone?

Is this a surprise? The Avs forwards supported the D a lot last year, and this year the forwards haven't been helping a whole lot.

 

[Freudian]

It's possible Roy is making changes to the system and that's the reason for the theory session.

At least I hope so.

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

How about some more tweets?

https://twitter.com/BaconCrush

Roy stops practice 45 seconds after play resumes. Barrie long outlet pass ans Roy just shouts NOOOOOOO.

Roy telling MacKinnon "your brain is not in colorado"

Way too much going on between Mac and Roy right now to keep up with. Needless to say Roy is very agitated.

Roy stops to chew on everyone at same time. Very frustrated.

92 29 12 *

45 18 40*

 

[InjuredChoker]

No Stuart at practice.

Sounds like Roy is emphasizing the forwards need to support the defense better, which has been an issue. Just reading this from tweets.

https://twitter.com/BaconCrush

AJ Haefele @BaconCrush · 7m 7 minutes ago
Roy stops practice 45 seconds after play resumes. Barrie long outlet pass ans Roy just shouts NOOOOOOO.

AJ Haefele @BaconCrush · 7m 7 minutes ago
Roy telling MacKinnon "your brain is not in colorado"

AJ Haefele @BaconCrush · 5m 5 minutes ago
Way too much going on between Mac and Roy right now to keep up with. Needless to say Roy is very agitated.

AJ Haefele @BaconCrush · 4m 4 minutes ago
Roy stops to chew on everyone at same time. Very frustrated.

ok...

 

[Pokecheque]

Very interesting. Thank you for posting.

 

[The Mars Volchenkov]

I hope that's the end of the long stretch passes that lead to a tip into the zone and the other team exiting immediately.

 

[henchman21]

So basically you are saying that the Avs are probably the last team that should employ a man on man system given their lack of defensive talent?

Kinda... but not totally... they need to adjust to help the players that are weak in 1 on 1 battles. Basically scrap the pure man on man concept and bring the wings down in the zone to stop the cycle and/or help the defensmen win the battles against their man. So you would see more zone being played up top in the defensive zone, while man on man is kept down low. The opposing team will counter with more point shots and more one timers coming off passes from the points.

I think you will see this adjustment start to happen here soon.

 

[Pokecheque]

Kinda... but not totally... they need to adjust to help the players that are weak in 1 on 1 battles. Basically scrap the pure man on man concept and bring the wings down in the zone to stop the cycle and/or help the defensmen win the battles against their man. So you would see more zone being played up top in the defensive zone, while man on man is kept down low. The opposing team will counter with more point shots and more one timers coming off passes from the points.

I think you will see this adjustment start to happen here soon.

Yup...I was screaming for this last season. If Roy wants to do M2M fine, but tweak it please. Try a hybrid system at the very least.