OT: Non-Hockey Sports Thread XI - Defense? Who Needs Defense?! (Wade Wilson Memorial Edition)

[Wild11MN]

Mahomes is an all-time great. This KC team was far from their best in the Mahomes era. Reid deserves a ton of credit as well. I enjoy seeing new teams win, but hats off to the Chiefs.

 

[TaLoN]

Also has the ability to evade the rush.

While calmly looking down field in the process.

 

[57special]

Mahomes is an all-time great. This KC team was far from their best in the Mahomes era. Reid deserves a ton of credit as well. I enjoy seeing new teams win, but hats off to the Chiefs.

Their cornerbacks were good. Weird seeing teams that can actually cover receivers. Wonder what that’s like.

 

[Sad People]

Not a huge loss, but they might not have Chase Young come back either.

Reid's win is a huge middle finger to the Eagles, which is awesome.

I remember when everyone thought the Chiefs were taking a massive gamble on Mahomes (they traded up). He was graded pretty low from what I recall. I have my old draft magazines around here and I'll go check, but most saw him as a boom or bust with a lot leaning toward Bust.

Oh yeah I forgot about Young. Sounds like he hardly showed up when they had him during the regular season and only showed up for a play or two during the NFC championship game and a bit during the SB.

Agreed. Reid is an outstanding HC. he had a ton of success with McNabb who’s no world beater.

Mahomes had a losing record during college iirc along with coming from an air raid offense it turned some people off. I think Mahomes was on Veachs radar for aa long while before they drafted him too.

Their cornerbacks were good. Weird seeing teams that can actually cover receivers. Wonder what that’s like.

KC is notoriously good at developing CBs it’s ridiculous. Why I would pay CJ95 instead of Sneed This off season. But wouldn’t think it’s egregious if they let CJ95 walk and pay Sneed dude deserves it.

 

[Sad People]

Purdy wasn’t good enough, but he was vg. His future is bright. Seems to have the ability to stay calm under pressure.

Polar opposite of Lamar. The moment didn’t look too big for him at all. I do think he’s pretty limited as A QB But looks like he can hang.

 

[thestonedkoala]

Mahomes had a losing record during college iirc along with coming from an air raid offense it turned some people off. I think Mahomes was on Veachs radar for aa long while before they drafted him too.

Yeah, apparently Veach knew about Mahomes his freshman season, so he knew about Mahomes and him and Reid talked about him a lot.

 

[Sad People]

Yeah, apparently Veach knew about Mahomes his freshman season, so he knew about Mahomes and him and Reid talked about him a lot.

Yeah thats it.

I will add this is that i dont think Mahomes gets anywhere near where hes at today if it werent for Reid. Where you land as a QB and a player overall matters so much.

 

[Sad People]

2024 NFL Mock Draft: After Super Bowl LVIII, how could the first three rounds look?

Three rounds, no trades in our first post-Super Bowl mock draft. How many quarterbacks crack the top 12?

theathletic.com

This hooman has us taking Dallas Turner (Bama) in the 1st and Penix Jr in the 2nd.

Tbh i wouldnt be too upset with that at all.

 

[MuckOG]

2024 NFL Mock Draft: After Super Bowl LVIII, how could the first three rounds look?

Three rounds, no trades in our first post-Super Bowl mock draft. How many quarterbacks crack the top 12?

theathletic.com

This hooman has us taking Dallas Turner (Bama) in the 1st and Penix Jr in the 2nd.

Tbh i wouldnt be too upset with that at all.

If it works out that way sure. I just don't want to be caught on the outside looking in if all the decent QB prospects are selected before our 2nd round pick.

 

[Sad People]

If it works out that way sure. I just don't want to be caught on the outside looking in if all the decent QB prospects are selected before our 2nd round pick.

Agreed. I havent watched much of him but Daniels would be interesting if he fell to #8. In that scenario depending upon if KAM and KOC like him i wouldnt mind jumping ATL. I dont think KAM or KOC are afraid of that type of QB considering we were heavily pursuing Anthony Richardson last year just couldnt get a deal done for the pick. Only difference is Richardson ceiling is outta this world and Daniels isnt the same physically. Just both dual threats.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Yeah thats it.

I will add this is that i dont think Mahomes gets anywhere near where hes at today if it werent for Reid. Where you land as a QB and a player overall maters so much.

Like Tow-Maters!

 

[Sad People]

Like Tow-Maters!

Like Tuh Maters but without the tuh.

 

[Sad People]

Another Athletic mock draft had us taking Byron Murphy II at 11 and trading up to 30th OA to select Bo Nix. Id rather have Penix Jr in the 2nd then Nix. Dunno why i just dont see it with Nix.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Another Athletic mock draft had us taking Byron Murphy II at 11 and trading up to 30th OA to select Bo Nix. Id rather have Penix Jr in the 2nd then Nix. Dunno why i just dont see it with Nix.

Purple Daily talked about that today. My reaction was "OOOF!" I think Bo Nix is a QB the Vikings take in the 3rd round if everyone else (Maye, Williams, Daniels, McCarthy, Penix Jr) is taken. My fear is the vikings get McCarthy and he explodes.

 

[Sad People]

Purple Daily talked about that today. My reaction was "OOOF!" I think Bo Nix is a QB the Vikings take in the 3rd round if everyone else (Maye, Williams, Daniels, McCarthy, Penix Jr) is taken. My fear is the vikings get McCarthy and he explodes.

JJ started catching my eye last year as a potential QB but more of a mid round dude and not anything near a 1st rounder, way too rich for my blood. JJ, and Nix i just dont see first round talent i guess and see them more as mid rounders and would have both of them behind Penix Jr personally.

QB 1 Caleb
QB 2/3 Maye, Daniels. Havent watched any of them so i cant really say where id have them
QB 4 Penix Jr
QB 5 JJ
QB 6 Nix

I cant get out how bad Nix looked when he was at Auburn and really only started doing well when he got to Oregon and had that stacked roster. I just dont see anything "special" with JJ or Nix.

 

[Digitalbooya]

JJ started catching my eye last year as a potential QB but more of a mid round dude and not anything near a 1st rounder, way too rich for my blood. JJ, and Nix i just dont see first round talent i guess and see them more as mid rounders and would have both of them behind Penix Jr personally.

QB 1 Caleb
QB 2/3 Maye, Daniels. Havent watched any of them so i cant really say where id have them
QB 4 Penix Jr
QB 5 JJ
QB 6 Nix

I cant get out how bad Nix looked when he was at Auburn and really only started doing well when he got to Oregon and had that stacked roster. I just dont see anything "special" with JJ or Nix.

I have seen a lot of mocks putting Maye above Williams.

I have Penix Jr and McCarthy in the same tier. Penix Jr more of an arm talent. McCarthy more of an effective leader and a "do whatever needs to be done to win" type. I'm looking forward to watching him in the NFL. Could be a steal if he drops and it would be easier to root for him if he wasn't a viking.

Tier 1: Williams/Maye
Tier 2: Daniels
Tier 3: Penix Jr/McCarthy
Tier 4: Nix

 

[Sad People]

I have seen a lot of mocks putting Maye above Williams.

I have Penix Jr and McCarthy in the same tier. Penix Jr more of an arm talent. McCarthy more of an effective leader and a "do whatever needs to be done to win" type. I'm looking forward to watching him in the NFL. Could be a steal if he drops and it would be easier to root for him if he wasn't a viking.

Tier 1: Williams/Maye
Tier 2: Daniels
Tier 3: Penix Jr/McCarthy
Tier 4: Nix

I think there is some prospect fatigue when it comes to Williams, but yeah ive seen it too. Was listening to The Athletic podcast yesterday where they had their top 100 and top 40 players in the draft and i think they both had Maye ahead of Williams as well but said they think Williams will go before Maye.

 

[StreetHawk]

I think there is some prospect fatigue when it comes to Williams, but yeah ive seen it too. Was listening to The Athletic podcast yesterday where they had their top 100 and top 40 players in the draft and i think they both had Maye ahead of Williams as well but said they think Williams will go before Maye.

Williams, similar to Russ in that his best plays were off script. So, can he operate within the confines of a system or not? Great to have the off script when needed, but you should operate mostly from the system. Plus, for Caleb is he a leader? Can he handle his own emotions to lead the other 10 players on the field? Maye, looks the part with all of the tools. Most of the weaknesses appear to be fixable for him.

Penix, he seems like he needs to be protected well like Goff/Ryan to operate at a high level. Not as good if he needs to reset his feet to make an accurate throw. Is there any mobility left in his game after 2 ACLs? McCarthy, just didn't see a lot put on his shoulders. So, can he do it when he's needed to throw more?

For the Vikings, they still have $28.5 mill left from Cousins to eat dead cap wise. So, sooner or later they need to eat that amount.

 

[TaLoN]

Williams, similar to Russ in that his best plays were off script. So, can he operate within the confines of a system or not? Great to have the off script when needed, but you should operate mostly from the system. Plus, for Caleb is he a leader? Can he handle his own emotions to lead the other 10 players on the field? Maye, looks the part with all of the tools. Most of the weaknesses appear to be fixable for him.

Penix, he seems like he needs to be protected well like Goff/Ryan to operate at a high level. Not as good if he needs to reset his feet to make an accurate throw. Is there any mobility left in his game after 2 ACLs? McCarthy, just didn't see a lot put on his shoulders. So, can he do it when he's needed to throw more?

For the Vikings, they still have $28.5 mill left from Cousins to eat dead cap wise. So, sooner or later they need to eat that amount.

Mahomes was the same way entering the league

 

[Sad People]

Williams, similar to Russ in that his best plays were off script. So, can he operate within the confines of a system or not? Great to have the off script when needed, but you should operate mostly from the system. Plus, for Caleb is he a leader? Can he handle his own emotions to lead the other 10 players on the field? Maye, looks the part with all of the tools. Most of the weaknesses appear to be fixable for him.

Penix, he seems like he needs to be protected well like Goff/Ryan to operate at a high level. Not as good if he needs to reset his feet to make an accurate throw. Is there any mobility left in his game after 2 ACLs? McCarthy, just didn't see a lot put on his shoulders. So, can he do it when he's needed to throw more?

For the Vikings, they still have $28.5 mill left from Cousins to eat dead cap wise. So, sooner or later they need to eat that amount.

I think he can operate within the system and do it well, hes just at his best/ elite when he goes off script.

All that hoopla doesnt bother me at all. Dudes like 20 years old realizing hes out of the Natty race and Heisman race. Id rather have Calebs end of the spectrum than someone like Jay Cutler or a nonchalant stoic QB who appears that they dont care.

I read a stat somewhere that Penix Jr was one of the least sacked QBs over the past 2 years while having over 1k passing attempts. Now is that the good to great OL he had or Penix getting rid of the ball quickly? Im not entirely sure but would guess its a mixture of both.

 

[StreetHawk]

I think he can operate within the system and do it well, hes just at his best/ elite when he goes off script.

All that hoopla doesnt bother me at all. Dudes like 20 years old realizing hes out of the Natty race and Heisman race. Id rather have Calebs end of the spectrum than someone like Jay Cutler or a nonchalant stoic QB who appears that they dont care.

I read a stat somewhere that Penix Jr was one of the least sacked QBs over the past 2 years while having over 1k passing attempts. Now is that the good to great OL he had or Penix getting rid of the ball quickly? Im not entirely sure but would guess its a mixture of both.

Caleb's success/failure will be impacted a lot by his coach. Stick him with a Reid/McVay, he's going to be fine. Not sure how he's going to be with Defensive Eberflus and Waldron.

Penix Jr., didn't look good in the Natty vs an excellent Michigan front. Didn't take many sacks, but a lot of his passes were off target. Young QBs today, need to have some level of mobility to buy time or at least get out of a sack or lose fewer yards. As a passer, he's better than Nix. Later in the draft (Past pick say 20), if you like him, then I'd say you are fine to roll the dice and take him.

 

[Sad People]

Caleb's success/failure will be impacted a lot by his coach. Stick him with a Reid/McVay, he's going to be fine. Not sure how he's going to be with Defensive Eberflus and Waldron.

Penix Jr., didn't look good in the Natty vs an excellent Michigan front. Didn't take many sacks, but a lot of his passes were off target. Young QBs today, need to have some level of mobility to buy time or at least get out of a sack or lose fewer yards. As a passer, he's better than Nix. Later in the draft (Past pick say 20), if you like him, then I'd say you are fine to roll the dice and take him.

Completely agreed on the first part. The Bears i dont think have ever developed any sort of QB in their 100+ year existence. Good for Vikings fans and people in the North (hopefully) but it does scare me that theyre getting a prospect like him. (hopefully theyre stupid enough to keep Fields and trade the pick i know Bears players were advocating for Fields) I have said and other people have said in the past Patrick Mahomes wouldnt be who he is today without Reid. Thats why having an offensive minded HC is so important in todays NFL.

He did not look good i will agree with that it is a bit worrisome but maybe he caught the yips and the whole big stage bothered him, dunno. Hard to explain that one. Michigan is also just a different breed and have like 18 or 19 NFL players on that squad. They may have just been unprepared and such.

I dont necessarily agree that QBs need to have some mobility to be great in this league does it help? Absolutely. It can be a great asset for a young QB to keep drives alive, move the chains and gain some confidence. Joe Burrow doesnt have great maneuverability and escapability but he gets the job done. Obviously one is one of the best in the league and the other hasnt played a down in the NFL, but it can be done. Is it ideal? Na but it doesnt scare me too much. Amazes me how Tua was considered a 1st rounder but Penix isnt.

Im not high on Nix, i dont see it at all. I was told to watch his ASU tape and while he made some good throws in it i didnt see anything too great with him, dude was struggeling to make accuarte throws at or aorund the LOS. Nix is QB #6 for me.

 

[TaLoN]

Completely agreed on the first part. The Bears i dont think have ever developed any sort of QB in their 100+ year existence. Good for Vikings fans and people in the North (hopefully) but it does scare me that theyre getting a prospect like him. (hopefully theyre stupid enough to keep Fields and trade the pick i know Bears players were advocating for Fields) I have said and other people have said in the past Patrick Mahomes wouldnt be who he is today without Reid. Thats why having an offensive minded HC is so important in todays NFL.

He did not look good i will agree with that it is a bit worrisome but maybe he caught the yips and the whole big stage bothered him, dunno. Hard to explain that one. Michigan is also just a different breed and have like 18 or 19 NFL players on that squad. They may have just been unprepared and such.

I dont necessarily agree that QBs need to have some mobility to be great in this league does it help? Absolutely. It can be a great asset for a young QB to keep drives alive, move the chains and gain some confidence. Joe Burrow doesnt have great maneuverability and escapability but he gets the job done. Obviously one is one of the best in the league and the other hasnt played a down in the NFL, but it can be done. Is it ideal? Na but it doesnt scare me too much. Amazes me how Tua was considered a 1st rounder but Penix isnt.

Im not high on Nix, i dont see it at all. I was told to watch his ASU tape and while he made some good throws in it i didnt see anything too great with him, dude was struggeling to make accuarte throws at or aorund the LOS. Nix is QB #6 for me.

Bears had Jim McMahon looking pretty great before his arm injury limited his throwing strength. Was never the same after.

 

[Digitalbooya]

I see the vikings taking McCarthy at 11 if they can’t move up to get Daniels.

 

[MuckOG]

I see the vikings taking McCarthy at 11 if they can’t move up to get Daniels.

I would be ok with this.