Niagara Icedogs 2024-25 Season, Part II

[dirty12]

Yeah I just think, to Sam’s point if Niagara goes in with virtually the same D as this year for it’s all in year, comparing to what London and Barrie has this year they both arguably have 4 D men better than Niagara’s best.

What a team looks like going into the second half of this season with and comes out of the next trade deadline with can be two very different things.

 

[dirty12]

...and yet they traded away significant assets to acquire Cam Allen. Mark Hunter understand the talent level required on the backend to win a championship. If he didn't think he needed Allen, he wouldn't have traded for him.

If in a good position, get what is needed for sure.

Though I think the Niagara roster is in fine shape to start next season with 2-OAs and 3-19 yr olds on D as its’ ’weakness’, It is too early to know one way or another for sure. There may or may not be better OAs to be had pre-season.

Unless it is the team’s only chance for a few seasons (Kingston); see if the team is in contention at the deadline, consider the cost of what is actually needed that year, then decide if going ‘all-in’
At least have an honest look at your own roster and how it might compare to a loaded up competitor before buying pre-maturely like Brampton.

 

[Sam14]

Those two teams have exceptional defense corps actually, quite a bit better than Oshawa or NB a season ago and way better than the Petes the year before. The Petes won with a great top 9, solid goaltending, and a fourth best in conference at best defence.

If you’re comparing championship D cores, you need to compare to London and Saginaw last year as those were the OHL and Mem-Cup championship teams. As for the Petes (2023), the IceDogs current D core again is not even close to this…
White, Gavin NHL - DAL
Zanetti, Brian NHL - PHI
Smith, Konnor NHL - ANA
Mayer, Samuel
McCoy, Donovan
Gauvreau, Cam
Spearing, Shawn

 

[Sam14]

If in a good position, get what is needed for sure.

Though I think the Niagara roster is in fine shape to start next season with 2-OAs and 3-19 yr olds on D as its’ ’weakness’, It is too early to know one way or another for sure. There may or may not be better OAs to be had pre-season.

Unless it is the team’s only chance for a few seasons (Kingston); see if the team is in contention at the deadline, consider the cost of what is actually needed that year, then decide if going ‘all-in’
At least have an honest look at your own roster and how it might compare to a loaded up competitor before buying pre-maturely like Brampton.

However, you are missing the nature of this discussion that started many posts ago. The entire discussion revolves around, what do the the IceDogs have to do to go all in, and not whether they should or should not go all in.

This whole discussion was triggered by the fact that next year will be Kevin He's final OHL year and very possibly Ryan Roobroeck's final year (as an organization they can't just dismiss that as a possibility).

So, IceDog fans are trying to figure out what is needed, how to acquire it and is it even possible to do. If they are not going "all in" to win an OHL championship next year, then there really is no discussion here. It's quite simple, they will have to trade Kevin He at the deadline and seriously consider doing the same with Ryan Roobroeck (as they did with Phil Tomasino, a year early, concerned that he may not return to the OHL the following year). A team can't survive if they let valuable assets just skate away without any return or at least take a legit run at an OHL championship with those players.

 

[dirty12]

If you’re comparing championship D cores, you need to compare to London and Saginaw last year as those were the OHL and Mem-Cup championship teams. As for the Petes (2023), the IceDogs current D core again is not even close to this…
White, Gavin NHL - DAL
Zanetti, Brian NHL - PHI
Smith, Konnor NHL - ANA
Mayer, Samuel
McCoy, Donovan
Gauvreau, Cam
Spearing, Shawn

K.Smith was not yet drafted. G.White was obviously NHL drafted for playing on a championship team. That Petes D was a distant 4th in conference to Barrie, NB, Ottawa that season.

 

[Sam14]

K.Smith was not yet drafted. G.White was obviously NHL drafted for playing on a championship team. That Petes D was a distant 4th in conference to Barrie, NB, Ottawa that season.

Irrelevant point. That D core is so much stronger than Niagara's current D and returning D! That’s the point being made

 

[IceDogs452]

It’s a Christmas miracle I am agreeing with all of Sam14’s points I do feel like next year has gotta be the year with the Roobs and He situation. Build playoff experience by winning a series and then look at the areas the team needs to get better in the off season.

 

[dirty12]

However, you are missing the nature of this discussion that started many posts ago. The entire discussion revolves around, what do the the IceDogs have to do to go all in, and not whether they should or should not go all in.

This whole discussion was triggered by the fact that next year will be Kevin He's final OHL year and very possibly Ryan Roobroeck's final year (as an organization they can't just dismiss that as a possibility).

So, IceDog fans are trying to figure out what is needed, how to acquire it and is it even possible to do. If they are not going "all in" to win an OHL championship next year, then there really is no discussion here. It's quite simple, they will have to trade Kevin He at the deadline and seriously consider doing the same with Ryan Roobroeck (as they did with Phil Tomasino, a year early, concerned that he may not return to the OHL the following year). A team can't survive if they let valuable assets just skate away without any return or at least take a legit run at an OHL championship!

Roobroek and Waasilyn are clearly better at LW than RW, so imo a BIG 2006-07 RW and ‘06 goalie now, or import draft or next pre-season. If Scott does not prove capable an OA D can be had near end of pre-season or deadline. If the team is definitely in contention, consider ‘09-1st for stud D at the next trade deadline.
The roster is in fine shape, you are really over thinking it imo.

 

[Sam14]

Roobroek and Waasilyn are clearly better at LW than RW, so imo a BIG 2006-07 RW and ‘06 goalie now, or import draft or next pre-season. If Scott does not prove capable an OA D can be had near end of pre-season or deadline. If the team is definitely in contention, consider ‘09-1st for stud D at the next trade deadline.
The roster is in fine shape, you are really over thinking it imo.

If DD is serious about a winning team, he would FIRST have to : (a) spend money to purchase two elite NHL drafted Import players; (b) accumulate some surplus draft capital at this deadline. After three years, we have not seen any evidence DD is financially capable or possess the ability to plan long-term.

For the 25-26 season, the D is sub-par (comparative to OHL championship standards); they need a number one goalie, two 1st pairing D and 1st line C minimum. Anything less than that, this returning roster will be no where near strong enough to win the Eastern Conference alone.

So, the IceDogs would need to:

(1) Add 2 Imports e.g. F - Ilya Protas; K. Halttunen; D - G.Eliasson, A.Jiricek, T.Hamara, E.Pieniniemi – type

(2) Trade for multiple players to fill these positions not filled by the Import players: 1 G; 2 D; 1 F the calibre of the OHL current elite players e.g., D - T.Bertucci, K.Aitcheson, B.Akey; L.Marrelli, B.Danford; M.Schaefer, C.Allen, M.Andonovski; K.Smith; Z.Parekh; A.Gibson; S.Dickinson, O.Bonk; F - J.Luchanko

With DD, the concern is he’s had no success or interest in spending money on the Import Draft. So, IceDog fans will not need to wait for next season trade deadline to know what DD’s intentions are for 25-26, we’ll know by who they draft and sign after the 2025 Import Draft. That draft will tell fans everything we need to know for 25-26!

IceDogs are limited by finincial restraints and a lack of surplus draft capital, regardless, that is DD's problem, if he's incapable of adding a minimum 4 high-end NHL drafted calibre players for next year, then trading Kevin He and possibly RR is the best alternative. Either you’re all in or you’re selling.

It’s a Christmas miracle I am agreeing with all of Sam14’s points I do feel like next year has gotta be the year with the Roobs and He situation. Build playoff experience by winning a series and then look at the areas the team needs to get better in the off season.

It's probably more of a festive miracle! 100% agree, the work need to be done in the off-season. Starting with the Import Draft in July. So many answers (or questions) will come after that day!

 

[dogs777]

If DD is serious about a winning team, he would FIRST have to : (a) spend money to purchase two elite NHL drafted Import players; (b) accumulate some surplus draft capital at this deadline. After three years, we have not seen any evidence DD is financially capable or possess the ability to plan long-term.

For the 25-26 season, the D is sub-par (comparative to OHL championship standards); they need a number one goalie, two 1st pairing D and 1st line C minimum. Anything less than that, this returning roster will be no where near strong enough to win the Eastern Conference alone.

So, the IceDogs would need to:

(1) Add 2 Imports e.g. F - Ilya Protas; K. Halttunen; D - G.Eliasson, A.Jiricek, T.Hamara, E.Pieniniemi – type

(2) Trade for multiple players to fill these positions not filled by the Import players: 1 G; 2 D; 1 F the calibre of the OHL current elite players e.g., D - T.Bertucci, K.Aitcheson, B.Akey; L.Marrelli, B.Danford; M.Schaefer, C.Allen, M.Andonovski; K.Smith; Z.Parekh; A.Gibson; S.Dickinson, O.Bonk; F - J.Luchanko

With DD, the concern is he’s had no success or interest in spending money on the Import Draft. So, IceDog fans will not need to wait for next season trade deadline to know what DD’s intentions are for 25-26, we’ll know by who they draft and sign after the 2025 Import Draft. That draft will tell fans everything we need to know for 25-26!

IceDogs are limited by finincial restraints and a lack of surplus draft capital, regardless, that is DD's problem, if he's incapable of adding a minimum 4 high-end NHL drafted calibre players for next year, then trading Kevin He and possibly RR is the best alternative. Either you’re all in or you’re selling.


It's probably more of a festive miracle! 100% agree, the work need to be done in the off-season. Starting with the Import Draft in July. So many answers (or questions) will come after that day!

If he’s even got the money to spend that is. I agree with your deadline comment even if they aren’t going for it next year I’d be moving certain pieces

 

[dirty12]

All-in or selling, it will be a lot more clear this time next season.

 

[Sam14]

If he’s even got the money to spend that is

I can definitely confirm, he does not have the money!

 

[Dogs Enthusiast]

The second half of the season starts tonight.

2 games in Michigan and then the NYE game.

I predict we get 5 out of 6 points.

 

[dirty12]

The second half of the season starts tonight.

2 games in Michigan and then the NYE game.

I predict we get 5 out of 6 points.

Could be a great game tonight between two teams on winning streaks

 

[Dogs Enthusiast]

Didn't even notice they are on a 4 game win streak.

 

[bigsportsfan]

I think most of you are over-estimating how good the IceDogs are this year. The last few weeks the IceDogs have deserved their wins. Previous to that, I would say at least half of the wins they got were not deserving. They were often outplayed and usually badly outshot. They won because of Floris. Without Floris, the IceDogs are a 6-8 place team.

As well, most of you are extremely big on Wassilyn. The young forward puts in goal after goal after goal, right? Well, not really. Despite playing on the top two lines all season, he has just 5 goals, which is tied with Doherty and Galiyanov. Crete, (8 goals) and Arrowsmith, (6 goals) both have more goals than Wassilyn. Yes, Wassilyn has a lot of assists, but who wouldn't playing with either He and Loshko or Roobroeck and Czata. Now I am not saying Wassilyn isn't doing well in his rookie year because he is and I think he will likely get drafted to the NHL. But where they have him in the lineup helps a lot and he is not going to put up Roobroeck numbers next year like some of you think he will.

 

[bigsportsfan]

In addition to NHL drafted players, championship teams are usually full of exceptional 19 year olds. Next season, this will be their 19 year olds:

Forwards
He
Doherty

Defence
Brauti
Virgilio
Cheynowski

Do you honestly think the IceDogs can win with these 19 years olds? If the IceDogs go for it next year, they will need to bring in a lot of exceptional players to even have a chance of competing for the championship. The problem is the team is not set up for a championship run in any one season and we don't have the extra draft picks required to bring in that many players. This is the result of not having an experienced GM.

 

[dirty12]

I think most of you are over-estimating how good the IceDogs are this year. The last few weeks the IceDogs have deserved their wins. Previous to that, I would say at least half of the wins they got were not deserving. They were often outplayed and usually badly outshot. They won because of Floris. Without Floris, the IceDogs are a 6-8 place team.

As well, most of you are extremely big on Wassilyn. The young forward puts in goal after goal after goal, right? Well, not really. Despite playing on the top two lines all season, he has just 5 goals, which is tied with Doherty and Galiyanov. Crete, (8 goals) and Arrowsmith, (6 goals) both have more goals than Wassilyn. Yes, Wassilyn has a lot of assists, but who wouldn't playing with either He and Loshko or Roobroeck and Czata. Now I am not saying Wassilyn isn't doing well in his rookie year because he is and I think he will likely get drafted to the NHL. But where they have him in the lineup helps a lot and he is not going to put up Roobroeck numbers next year like some of you think he will.

To be fair, Wassilyn and Roobroek were and are much more productive playing LW with Czata than RW with He-Loshko. I think Wassilyn and the team would be better LW with Assadourian and leaving L2 alone.
Also, I don’t think the IceDogs have a regulation loss when Assadourian and Paris are in the line up when the buzzer sounded.

 

[dirty12]

In addition to NHL drafted players, championship teams are usually full of exceptional 19 year olds. Next season, this will be their 19 year olds:

Forwards
He
Doherty

Defence
Brauti
Virgilio
Cheynowski

Do you honestly think the IceDogs can win with these 19 years olds? If the IceDogs go for it next year, they will need to bring in a lot of exceptional players to even have a chance of competing for the championship. The problem is the team is not set up for a championship run in any one season and we don't have the extra draft picks required to bring in that many players. This is the result of not having an experienced GM.

An ‘06 goalie and big RW now, import draft, or off-season would change that outlook a lot, I think. From there the team might just be trading their ‘09-1st for one of the top D available at the deadline away from a top contender.