NHL and Rogers in agreement on new 12 year, $11 billion CAD Canadian TV deal

[Golden_Jet]

Apparently the deal also gives Sportsnet 10 more national games a year for the Sens and Jets.

Damn, I liked having 62 TSN games a year.

 

[Golden_Jet]

It will be interesting to see how Rogers deals with Bell. Shutting them out of Ontario (minus the Ottawa Valley) with both the Raptors and Leafs in their control is a significant hit for the network.

Not sure what you’re saying here, regional wise east of Belleville is Senators territory, in Ontario.
They’ve always had the leafs and Raptors, so no difference.

Bell is still a shareholder in the Canadiens, but is Quebec/Ottawa/Maritimes a large enough market to sustain cable sports?

Yes, lol, TSN is still available all across Canada. Did the Jets somehow go poof.

The earlier rumours of Bell getting out of cable sports and investing in fiber optics seem to be more real than ever.

What rumour lol it’s reality, it’s been being installed now for several years. Lots of people have it, it doesn’t change anything.

Especially if they get shut out of French hockey rights on a national basis.

That’s currently being negotiated.
What a poorly thought out post in summary. Seems like you have no idea on the business.
If anything Roger’s is hurting themselves. They couldn’t afford the last deal, now they’ve doubled the money.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Exclusively owning the Leafs now, I expect them to show the Leafs nationally more than ever. Eventually it will be the Leafs with Mc David.

They can sell some of that investment to Amazon or whoever they want. To divest.

Sportsnet was absolutely nothing before the NHL. I don't see how TSN survives. CFL is small potatoes, NFL/golf is that enough? World Juniors is 2 weeks. NHL playoffs were bringing in up to 4 million viewers.

Rogers/SportsNet is trying to suffocate TSN to oblivion. NHL national rights, all 162 Blue Jay games -- that alone covers an entire year of broadcasting coverage.

I'm actually impressed that TSN has held on for so long. NFL/CFL, tennis, curling, lacrosse, gold, World Juniors. All respectable fillers, but still nowhere near what SportsNet offers.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Rogers/SportsNet is trying to suffocate TSN to oblivion. NHL national rights, all 162 Blue Jay games -- that alone covers an entire year of broadcasting coverage.

I'm actually impressed that TSN has held on for so long. NFL/CFL, tennis, curling, lacrosse, gold, World Juniors. All respectable fillers, but still nowhere near what SportsNet offers.

F1 averages 1.4 million viewers a race, TSN has all forms of car and motorcycle racing.

Also left out NFL games.

 

[MeHateHe]

Also left out NFL games.

TSN has bet big on football, especially the NFL. They air so much of ESPN's pre-packaged NFL coverage. Sportsnet's banking on hockey. It's too bad that ten years in, they still come off as offering a flat product.

 

[voyageur]

TSN has bet big on football, especially the NFL. They air so much of ESPN's pre-packaged NFL coverage. Sportsnet's banking on hockey. It's too bad that ten years in, they still come off as offering a flat product.

The NFL is a nice package for 4 months of the year, 3 days a week. Formula 1 is one day a week 20 times a year. TSN has Sunday Night baseball. World Juniors is 2 weeks.

PGA you get 4 days a week almost year round.

CFL is usually 3 days a week for 5 months.

Is the NCAA sports a big draw?

Then you have regional NHL rights.

Is that enough to sustain a sports cable channel?

Being able to broadcast the Canadiens in French nationally would go a long way to their success.

Where hockey, basketball and baseball can basically fill the prime time air year round for Rogers.

 

[Golden_Jet]

The NFL is a nice package for 4 months of the year, 3 days a week. Formula 1 is one day a week 20 times a year. World Juniors is 2 weeks

PGA you get 4 days a week almost year round.

CFL is usually 3 days a week for 5 months.

Is the NCAA sports a big draw?

Then you have regional NHL rights.

Is that enough to sustain a sports cable channel?

Being able to broadcast the Canadiens in French nationally would go a long way to their success.

Where hockey, basketball and baseball can basically fill the prime time air year round for Rogers.

Yes, that is enough to sustain a sports cable channel. They’ve done it that last 12 years obviously, no idea where you’re going with this, Sportsnet has always been an inferior product, nothing has changed.

 

[voyageur]

Yes, that is enough to sustain a sports cable channel. They’ve done it that last 12 years obviously, no idea where you’re going with this, Sportsnet has always been an inferior product, nothing has changed.

It's about having actual programming. Cable in general is seeing a decrease in numbers. We subscribed to TSN+ through Amazon for Jets, NFL, PGA. Rogers you have to subscribe to if you want to watch hockey. And that's still the #1 sport in Canada. The fact more Canadians were watching the final 2 rounds of the NHL playoffs in real numbers than Americans probably justifies the high value Rogers paid for the NHL.

I don't disagree about their inferiority but it shouldn't be hard for them to broadcast their bread and butter teams nationally. More Leafs. More Oilers, more Canucks, who are always blacked out in our region. The NHL scheduling department really doesn't help, especially building any kind of rivalries anymore. Oilers-Flames played 3 times this year for example.

Leafs-Canadiens should play all their games Saturday nights if you want maximum viewership.

 

[MeHateHe]

The NFL is a nice package for 4 months of the year,

ESPN (and therefore TSN) talks about the NFL 12 months of the year. The NFL remains a behenoth, a juggernaut. Sports news sites like the Athletic run stories about the NFL non stop and they are always the most widely read stories. On both sides of the border, the NFL is a money-making machine for whatever outlet holds the rights.

Look, I hate the NFL, I'm a hockey fan through and through, but the TSN's betting on the NFL is more than overcoming their loss of NHL national telecasts.

 

[varsaku]

I'm more worried about Rogers staying in the cable business at this point. There's no way they'll be coming anywhere close to breaking even on that deal. It's going to be a massive money loser, even if they somehow find a way to boost the ratings and sell more sponsorship than they already do. I don't get that business model at all.

Maybe to get content for streaming as cable disappears. That is probably their play.

12 years ago, PKP was betting that the Habs would have several long runs in the playoffs but they only got 1 (2021). Now, the future looks good for Montreal.

Sportsnet avoids negative coverage of the NHL, but TSN would stir the pot (concussions, for example)

I can see RDS getting the national French rights if Bell is willing to pay for exclusive Habs coverage. I expect CBC will continue to air Sportsnet produced games.

I think we are headed to a 36 team league and possibly 2 more teams in Canada ( Toronto II and Quebec ) along with Houston and Atlanta.

Expansion makes no sense now for Canada with the TV package already signed. Expansion will only happen if there is risk of the new deal being lower. NHL will use expansion to only drive up the price which wouldn't make sense now since only Rodgers would gain from it. If you wait till the next deal and do it then, NHL could also benefit with a much larger TV deal.

I don't think the Rogers deal with the NHL hurts TSN's long term viability though. Local NHL Rights, International hockey, the CFL, and Monday Night football are likely enough for people to want to buy TSN subscriptions. At the end of the day profitability is a important metric than revenue and it wouldn't surprise me if 10 years from now, TSN is more profitable.

Sports are the only thing keeping cable channels alive plus you need content if you are making a jump to streaming.

 

[Takuto Maruki]

On both sides of the border, the NFL is a money-making machine for whatever outlet holds the rights.

More then that, there is increasingly more *Canadian* players being impact players on NFL rosters. However few there are, you can still get a few more people watching a random Carolina Panthers game because they know that people know Chuba Hubbard is a high end RB from Sherwood Park.

 

[Greatzsky 99]

It's still nowhere near 11+B worth of revenue generating, unless they find a whole bunch of new ways to make money with hockey. Time will tell I guess, but I just don't see it.

why not? say 4 million gets Sportsnet+ for 20-25 bucks who wouldnt have it without NHL, thats 80-100 million a month
up to around 1.1 billion a year x 12, thats 13.2, then you have the rest of revenue.

 

[voyageur]

ESPN (and therefore TSN) talks about the NFL 12 months of the year. The NFL remains a behenoth, a juggernaut. Sports news sites like the Athletic run stories about the NFL non stop and they are always the most widely read stories. On both sides of the border, the NFL is a money-making machine for whatever outlet holds the rights.

Look, I hate the NFL, I'm a hockey fan through and through, but the TSN's betting on the NFL is more than overcoming their loss of NHL national telecasts.

9 months of programming nearly 7 days a week, still would trump 5 months of football 3 days a week in terms of revenues. Ratings for NFL are strong enough to get main network television exposure in Canada, one day a week (2 in the playoffs) so it's the only professional sport that competes that way. It's #2 for sure.

For Rogers I think the key is licensing with different broadcast partners, like APTN, Omni, to increase exposure. Maybe with the CBC too, since the Liberals already fund Rogers and Bell in different ways.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

The NFL is a nice package for 4 months of the year, 3 days a week. Formula 1 is one day a week 20 times a year. TSN has Sunday Night baseball. World Juniors is 2 weeks.

PGA you get 4 days a week almost year round.

CFL is usually 3 days a week for 5 months.

Is the NCAA sports a big draw?

Then you have regional NHL rights.

Is that enough to sustain a sports cable channel?

Being able to broadcast the Canadiens in French nationally would go a long way to their success.

Where hockey, basketball and baseball can basically fill the prime time air year round for Rogers.

Sustain a sports cable channel? Absolutely.

But they've certainly lost the battle. I wouldn't say they are trying to stay afloat, but they are certainly #2 now in sports broadcasting programming, with no chance of reclaiming the #1 spot at this point. The fact that SportsNet can have a NHL or MLB game on for practically all 365 days of the year is something that can't be competed with.

EDIT: And as I suggested earlier, the fact that it hasn't been the death knell for TSN a decade plus in now is quite impressive. I am not sure it has much to do with TSN as it does with the incompetency of SportsNet. Rogers should have been able to step on their throats by now.

 

[voyageur]

Sustain a sports cable channel? Absolutely.

But they've certainly lost the battle. I wouldn't say they are trying to stay afloat, but they are certainly #2 now in sports broadcasting programming, with no chance of reclaiming the #1 spot at this point. The fact that SportsNet can have a NHL or MLB game on for practically all 365 days of the year is something that can't be competed with.

EDIT: And as I suggested earlier, the fact that it hasn't been the death knell for TSN a decade plus in now is quite impressive. I am not sure it has much to do with TSN as it does with the incompetency of SportsNet. Rogers should have been able to step on their throats by now.

The partnership in MLSE certainly helped.

I think the French language rights that reach 1/4 1/3 of the Canadian population would help keep Bell afloat. The two giants have bought up any competitors and the CRTC is obligated not to have a monopoly running telecommunications.

Initially I thought the Rogers takeover of MLSE would pivot Bell towards the other franchise it held shares in, and that may still happen if they get the language rights.

As an old timer I can still pick up CBC on my digital antenna so the playoffs are good. I still followed the Canadiens on RDS after they took over La Soiree du Hockey, until they were blacked out in our region.

 

[TheTotalPackage]

The partnership in MLSE certainly helped.

I think the French language rights that reach 1/4 1/3 of the Canadian population would help keep Bell afloat. The two giants have bought up any competitors and the CRTC is obligated not to have a monopoly running telecommunications.

Initially I thought the Rogers takeover of MLSE would pivot Bell towards the other franchise it held shares in, and that may still happen if they get the language rights.

As an old timer I can still pick up CBC on my digital antenna so the playoffs are good. I still followed the Canadiens on RDS after they took over La Soiree du Hockey, until they were blacked out in our region.

Most definitely, to all of this.

And it has been speculated for as long as the Expos 2.0 expansion talk has been going on that Bell would get involved in the ownership of the team, paving the way for them holding 162+ games worth of MLB programming throughout the summer and compete side-by-side with Rogers and the Blue Jays.

 

[Chileiceman]

why not? say 4 million gets Sportsnet+ for 20-25 bucks who wouldnt have it without NHL, thats 80-100 million a month
up to around 1.1 billion a year x 12, thats 13.2, then you have the rest of revenue.

4 million people are not subscribing to Sportstnet plus. That's more people than Stanley Cup Final audience. I'd say they would be thrilled if 500,000 people subscribed.

 

[Golden_Jet]

4 million people are not subscribing to Sportstnet plus. That's more people than Stanley Cup Final audience. I'd say they would be thrilled if 500,000 people subscribed.

Ya and every subscriber is not watching

 

[varsaku]

why not? say 4 million gets Sportsnet+ for 20-25 bucks who wouldnt have it without NHL, thats 80-100 million a month
up to around 1.1 billion a year x 12, thats 13.2, then you have the rest of revenue.

You are not factoring the production costs to broadcast these games, which itself will cost quite a lot. Additionally, you have other content to pay and produce. Their only hope is that they are able to pull in more advertising revenue to offset some of the expenses.

 

[Greatzsky 99]

4 million people are not subscribing to Sportstnet plus. That's more people than Stanley Cup Final audience. I'd say they would be thrilled if 500,000 people subs

You are not factoring the production costs to broadcast these games, which itself will cost quite a lot. Additionally, you have other content to pay and produce. Their only hope is that they are able to pull in more advertising revenue to offset some of the expenses.

I just was trying to make a point, that it seems ludicrous to pay 5.2 billion CAD and then 11 billion if they are losing
a lot of money, it doesnt make any sense to me. And that the info i saw was that TSN had around 7 million subscribers 2021.

I mean. what type of shareholders would say, yeah we lost a billion lets lose 2 more?

 

[WeaponOfChoice]

I'm seeing two different numbers posted. Is the deal for 11b or 7.7b?

 

[Summer Rose]

I'm seeing two different numbers posted. Is the deal for 11b or 7.7b?

$11 billion Canadian which currently translates to $7.7 billion US.

 

[GKJ]

Maybe to get content for streaming as cable disappears. That is probably their play.


Expansion makes no sense now for Canada with the TV package already signed. Expansion will only happen if there is risk of the new deal being lower. NHL will use expansion to only drive up the price which wouldn't make sense now since only Rodgers would gain from it. If you wait till the next deal and do it then, NHL could also benefit with a much larger TV deal.

Sports are the only thing keeping cable channels alive plus you need content if you are making a jump to streaming.

By the time they’re looking at going to 36, the deal will be coming due anyways.

 

[varsaku]

By the time they’re looking at going to 36, the deal will be coming due anyways.

In a dream world it would be awesome if they did pro/rel with two 20-team leagues. That would add alot more meaning to the regular season and make things more interesting for teams at the bottom and middle of the pack teams. I think it would work out even better than in soccer since there is a hard cap and draft to ensure parity. It will force players not to slack off in regular season games or atleast make it costly if they do.

I just was trying to make a point, that it seems ludicrous to pay 5.2 billion CAD and then 11 billion if they are losing
a lot of money, it doesnt make any sense to me. And that the info i saw was that TSN had around 7 million subscribers 2021.

I mean. what type of shareholders would say, yeah we lost a billion lets lose 2 more?

This deal should have been split between multiple carriers to breed competition. This will only allow Rodgers to get complacent and do bare minimum to reduce costs.

 

[LadyStanley]

Friedman talks about new deal. One novel news tidbit is that the exclusive negotiating window was extended (without any public notice).