Next expansion team in Las Vegas - How does everyone feel about it?

[KingsOfCali25]

As someone that lives in Vegas I can see most people in this thread know nothing about Vegas. I grew up in St Louis and Ice Hockey youth leagues were a fall/winter sport. In Vegas they have year round leagues.

Vegas has a huge sports staved local population. A good portion of Vegas's population are people that relocated from other cities. There is a lot larger number of hockey fans here than it seems like anyone on this board realizes. Most people may not totally abandon their original teams for the Vegas team but they would still support it and go to games.

I am not 100% sure is a team would be successful but it has as good of a chance as any other city. The money is here the sports fans are here. The question is if the team is terrible would people still support it after the honeymoon stage is over.

I think this is really spot on. I have met many sports fans (including hockey ones) out in Vegas. There is a huge transplant of fans that get moved out there for work. Just had a couple of friends that are diehard Kings fans move out there and wishing for a team.

For the people saying that the casinos would buy the tickets and give them out are wrong. You don't know how that business works I guess. The casinos wouldn't want people to leave the tables because that's money walking out the door, even if it is for 3hrs.

I don't think it will be a crazy success but it will be as good as Dallas, Nashville and Columbus. They might struggle for a couple of years, but it will catch on. Even if it's from fans of other teams. I go to almost all the Kings home games and I see at least 5-6 other teams jerseys that aren't even the 2 teams playing. So that would help the Vegas team out.

I think a Seattle/Portland team will get much more crazy hardcore fans than Vegas and I'd like to see them first but Vegas wouldn't be bad. Canada is going to have to wait until after the conferences even out before they get a new team in the east.

 

[Pizza the Hutt]

It's so clearly a terrible idea that it's almost awe inspiring that given the situations in Florida, Carolina and Arizona anyone can think this will work.

 

[mattihp]

Will they have loyal fans? People will fill up the seats to some percentage; but how dedicated will the players be if it is just casual fans? Some of these hockey players strive because they know they have some one who demands they play their hearts out every night.

 

[WaveRaven]

Why do posters keep mentioning Wisc ? That's a hockey market why would they put team there, it makes no sense

 

[bacon25]

Everyone needs to read between the lines, Bettman is desperately trying to show how strong the NHL is when it is evident that there are several teams in a poor financial state. By the time Vegas has all their ducks in a row, Arizona will have its bags packed ready to move. Expansion, if any, will happen in Canada where Bettman can get every last dollar from hungry Canadian markets. Bettman could arguably charge 3x as much for a expansion franchise to QC or TO, something he can't do in terms of Vegas.

 

[IceManCat]

Is this thing official? Or the constant chatter that we always see

 

[Sam Spade]

It's so clearly a terrible idea that it's almost awe inspiring that given the situations in Florida, Carolina and Arizona anyone can think this will work.

It's very confusing to me as well. I am not a head of industry like Bettman so of course some of the nuance of this will escape me but I HAVE lived in Vegas and it is just not a place I believe will support an NHL team.

People come and go from Vegas based on the job market/economy, a huge Hispanic population, too many other things to do, etc. Within five years you will have another Phoenix on your hands, so why bother?

And to the poster above who stated the casinos do WHATEVER they can to keep you IN THEN CASINOS spending, he is correct, so they will not give tickets away. Jesus they bus the elderly up by the thousands every day for free. Tourist packages maybe will include tix, but not casinos.

Seattle and/or Quebec would be my choices easily. Move either the Panthers or Coyotes (not many would care) and ADD the second team if you absolutely must expand.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

It's so clearly a terrible idea that it's almost awe inspiring that given the situations in Florida, Carolina and Arizona anyone can think this will work.

Those situations don't really have any relevance to whether Vegas should get a team or will work on its own.

Will they have loyal fans? People will fill up the seats to some percentage; but how dedicated will the players be if it is just casual fans? Some of these hockey players strive because they know they have some one who demands they play their hearts out every night.

There is no hockey player that strives because of some arbitrary fan dedication level. That's just lip service.

Why do posters keep mentioning Wisc ? That's a hockey market why would they put team there, it makes no sense

Wisconsin doesn't have an arena nor an ownership group interested in bringing a team there. The NHL can't just wave a magic wand and have these things appear. Someone outside has to present it to them.

Everyone needs to read between the lines, Bettman is desperately trying to show how strong the NHL is when it is evident that there are several teams in a poor financial state. By the time Vegas has all their ducks in a row, Arizona will have its bags packed ready to move. Expansion, if any, will happen in Canada where Bettman can get every last dollar from hungry Canadian markets. Bettman could arguably charge 3x as much for a expansion franchise to QC or TO, something he can't do in terms of Vegas.

He can likely charge a satisfactory amount in a relocation like he did in the Atlanta-to-Winnipeg relocation. Again, teams in a poor financial state is always going to be there regardless. You can't truthfully expect a 100% rate of financial success among all franchises when a few of them have to lose a lot every year which drives fans away.

 

[HanSolo]

As someone that lives in Vegas I can see most people in this thread know nothing about Vegas. I grew up in St Louis and Ice Hockey youth leagues were a fall/winter sport. In Vegas they have year round leagues.

Vegas has a huge sports staved local population. A good portion of Vegas's population are people that relocated from other cities. There is a lot larger number of hockey fans here than it seems like anyone on this board realizes. Most people may not totally abandon their original teams for the Vegas team but they would still support it and go to games.

I am not 100% sure is a team would be successful but it has as good of a chance as any other city. The money is here the sports fans are here. The question is if the team is terrible would people still support it after the honeymoon stage is over.

I was so sick of being the only one saying these things. The people of this city want pro sports bad. I mean would a team here be a knockout success as far as fanbase size goes? It won't rival Canadian teams or anything but the insistence that the people of this 2 million person metropolitan can't form a sizeable enough fanbase? I mean it's fine to have doubts. I have a few nagging doubts myself but insisting that there simply cannot be a strong fan presence in Vegas...like there's no way? That's asinine. And frankly it's hard to tell how many actually know about Vegas and think it will fail and how many are just wounded that there's no plans to go back to Quebec or Hartford. Or new teams in Seattle and Markham..

Also the comparisons to Phoenix are baffling.

 

[Soth]

Even if the team loses money this would be a very savvy move by Bettman imo

People arent thinking about how good this could potentially be for growing the sport of hockey. Tourists would get comped tickets all the time and some would become fans after seeing a live game. Also hockey would be playing in people hotel rooms too.

The team itself may or may not be profitable, but it has more power to grow the sport and increase revenue

 

[Sharpshooter]

Of course there'll be a team in Vegas. Look at the Commissioner's last name.

 

[Soundwave]

I'm kinda tired of the "growing the game" argument. Yeah it's cool that there's a small handful of players that come from California and Phoenix might have one after almost 20 years of the Coyotes there.

But so what? It's not the NHL's mission statement to put teams everywhere (no less than three in California) just so 1 or 2 seven year olds can eventually become inspired to play the game and eventually make it to the big show.

There are teams coast to coast in the US now, so it's not even a regional issue anymore.

Lets be honest too ... do the Vegas arena people *really* want ice hockey? Or are they just settling for ice hockey because they couldn't get the NBA team they wanted?

 

[BackHandShelf22]

It's going to be the highway gas station/fast food joint of the NHL.

I don't doubt them being able to make it profitable. But other than that it doesn't make any sense at all. Cash grab.

 

[Smokey McCanucks]

Well, we all know that there's two more teams needed in the west to balance the conferences. Seattle is getting one, once their arena is finished. So it's a question of who gets the other one, and Vegas is definitely the place with the most excitement and buzz around it. It's a worthwhile experiment and if it doesn't work out they can always move to KC or someplace.

 

[BigFatCat999]

This is a clash between my mind which loves hockey and has studied economics since 13, and my expansionist heart. I would rather have expansion in the Pacific Northwest, either Seattle or Portland. And then Houston. (Or KC/OKC). Frankly, this seems more like a landing spot for Arizona

 

[NyQuil]

Because someone has the money and interest in putting a team there with a new arena being built to house hockey. It really is not that hard to figure out why Vegas is getting play right now from the league. The league wants to expand westward. Vegas has the essentials needed. Every other place except for Quebec City doesn't. QC will get a relocation if/when one is needed from an Eastern conference team, I think.

There is also something to be said about a location like Vegas taking ownership of their own professional sports franchise. I guess that's what this season ticket drive will show or not. People are worried about other sports not being there as some red flag and it's not really. The NBA had a PR nightmare in Vegas for their All-Star Game a few years ago. Vegas hasn't and likely won't put together what is necessary to build a football or baseball stadium so they're not a feasible option.

The issue is that longevity isn't what Vegas is about.

Everything changes.

In a dynamic entertainment market like that, continuity isn't a selling point.

 

[haveandare]

Why? This idea of expansion watering down the product is a myth. There is really nothing that anyone would actually notice when it comes to play quality adding one or two teams.

How is it a myth? The league needs more players. Players who wouldn't currently make the cut suddenly make the cut when the league needs more players. Every team will have to give up current roster players, and it's more likely than not that most of those teams don't just have backup NHL-ready players sitting around. Every team will force players who otherwise wouldn't make the cut onto their rosters. With one team it's not a huge deal I guess, but it's a slippery slope.

On top of that, the league already has a team in AZ which is doing terribly financially speaking. Why put another one, and force an expansion draft for a team that seems at least decently likely of not working out?

 

[Mightygoose]

Las Vegas Black Knights anyone?

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/will-las-vegas-be-called-the-black-knights/

I would prefer just Knights.....better than Blackjacks though

 

[bigbuffalo313]

As someone that lives in Vegas I can see most people in this thread know nothing about Vegas. I grew up in St Louis and Ice Hockey youth leagues were a fall/winter sport. In Vegas they have year round leagues.

Vegas has a huge sports staved local population. A good portion of Vegas's population are people that relocated from other cities. There is a lot larger number of hockey fans here than it seems like anyone on this board realizes. Most people may not totally abandon their original teams for the Vegas team but they would still support it and go to games.

I am not 100% sure is a team would be successful but it has as good of a chance as any other city. The money is here the sports fans are here. The question is if the team is terrible would people still support it after the honeymoon stage is over.

What are you talking about? I've never been to Vegas but I know that it is all sand and there will be no hockey fans there because it isn't in Canada

 

[Jacob]

I don't see Vegas working out long-term. Why would they experiment with a sunbelt city that has never supported ANY pro sports team let alone one as foreign to most of the US as hockey?

 

[M.C.G. 31]

I'd rather a team relocate. When the current division/conference layout was implemented, I always assumed it would mean an Eastern conference team would get relocated out west (in Seattle, not in Vegas). Not really digging expansion, but whatever.

And yes, I do feel expansion waters down the product, too. Guys who don't belong in the league will end up in the league because of it.

 

[perrygetzanother]

the nhl product is already watered down enough, every team has at least one line that is just there to absorb minutes while the others rest with no real hope of ever scoring. i enjoy shutdown, cycling hockey but i'd rather see more talented players on the ice going at it. that's part of why olympic hockey brings in so many eyeballs, the talent level on the ice at any given time is enormous and everybody's actually trying to win. the fact that teams in so many areas dont get the support of locals is another sign that the product is watered down. when hockey leaves winnipeg and QC to go to US cities, it's a pretty big sign that something's up.

expansion is a bad idea. i think the nhl needs to contract a few teams actually, not expand, but if other cities are going to get a chance at a team i gutwrenchingly offer up my ducks as prime relocation candidates.

as a former season ticket holder i can tell you that they do not receive the support that they deserve. the fact is they won the SC within the last decade, have been elite for the last several years and still dont draw support in the HC. it's really disheartening to know that they are condemned to be a budget team because revenues dont even match the cap.

the OC crowd just wont ever be what the LA crowd is, it's far too conservative to become rowdy and hostile for fans of other teams. that and the arena is just really hard to get to on weeknights, those freeways are brutal.

i'd be okay with moving the ducks to seattle. it would hurt and i'd have to buy gamecenter to watch them, but it would be healthier for the franchise and prevent an expansion that would water down the league's product.

 

[Mayor Bee]

I don't see Vegas working out long-term. Why would they experiment with a sunbelt city that has never supported ANY pro sports team let alone one as foreign to most of the US as hockey?

The IHL's Las Vegas Thunder had a huge following, and were completely screwed when UNLV (which was the landlord for the venue they played in) decided not to renew or even discuss renewing the lease.

The first outdoor official NHL game wasn't in Chicago or Detroit or New York or Philadelphia or Pittsburgh; it was in Las Vegas in 1991.

I'd rather a team relocate. When the current division/conference layout was implemented, I always assumed it would mean an Eastern conference team would get relocated out west (in Seattle, not in Vegas). Not really digging expansion, but whatever.

And yes, I do feel expansion waters down the product, too. Guys who don't belong in the league will end up in the league because of it.

Good, let's move your team.

 

[iamjs]

It doesn't make sense for me that Quebec doesn't have a team yet.

The people are crazy about hockey, the junior team there draw close to 16,000 fans every game, then you have a hockey legend who just passed away having a national ceremony, adulated by many, considered a national hero, and will probably have a street named after him.

Good luck in Vegas Bettman

With all respect to Mr. Beliveau, that doesn't constitute a reason to drop an expansion team into Quebec.

 

[Oak]

I don't like Vegas.

I'd much rather Quebec or Seattle.