Value of: My (basically) full list of goalie valuations.

[dgibb10]

Why is Askarov where he is? By that logic hes with Levi

I think Askarov is much better than Levi.

Askarov and Wallstedt are in my eyes the clear top 2 with everyone else trailing behind

 

[dgibb10]

Disagree with most of this. Thinking that the Panther value Bobrovsky as a cap dump is hilarious.

If the panthers could trade Bobrovsky for positive value they 100% would and use that cap to bring back every single other one of their key UFAs.

He is THIRTY SIX years old and makes 10 million dollars for the next 2 years.

For a comparison, Fleury at that age was the reigning vezina winner, and he was making 7 mill. You know what he was traded for? nothing.

 

[Zirakzigil]

If the panthers could trade Bobrovsky for positive value they 100% would and use that cap to bring back every single other one of their key UFAs.

He is THIRTY SIX years old and makes 10 million dollars for the next 2 years.

For a comparison, Fleury at that age was the reigning vezina winner, and he was making 7 mill. You know what he was traded for? nothing.

MAF is a completely different situation. The Knights traded him because they decided to sign Lehner, which has worked out sooooo well for them. Panthers didnt deliberately pick up another goalie at the deadline for the lols.

 

[dgibb10]

MAF is a completely different situation. The Knights traded him because they decided to sign Lehner, which has worked out sooooo well for them. Panthers didnt deliberately pick up another goalie at the deadline for the lols.

They traded him because they were strapped for cash in other areas.

10 million dollars. Sam Reinhart or Bobrovsky. You pick Reinhart 100/100 times.

a 10 million dollar 36 year old is a cap dump any day of the week. Bobrovsky also hasn't dominated either of the last 2 regular seasons.

He ranked 17th this year in GSAx, right in line with Cam Talbot. Heck he didn't even have a better season than Stolarz.

Last year he ranked 43rd, and again got outplayed in the regular season by his backup in Lyon.

He has had a couple of very good playoffs, but a 36 year old making 10 mill is not a smart investment.

 

[Double Dion]

Semantics, but Markstrom is a B goalie. He's an above average goalie capable of really good stretches like a lot of similar goalies in that tier. He's definitely not in the A tier.

A guy like Vanacek would have been your C and D tier guys

I think a lot of posters don't understand what it takes to be a starter in the NHL. It's much more difficult than being a platoon guy. Markstrom is a guy who plays 60+ games. There's only 2 guys who have started as many games as him over the last few years. Hellebuyck and Vasilevskiy. Guys like Ullmark have never carried a starter's load.

 

[dgibb10]

I can't see any goalie holding a top 5 value. Igor is on the verge of making bank and Swayman is a few years away from huge cap hit as well. Only way I could see a top 5 pick being moved for a goalie, is if a team wins the lottery and jumps from 16-15-14-13-12 into the top 5. Otherwise, top 5 teams are usually more than a goalie away from being good.

Hey, if Jeremy Swayman can be had with NJD 10th overall pick+ some adds, sign me up and get me away from this godawful markstrom bullshit

 

[Double Dion]

Hey, if Jeremy Swayman can be had with NJD 10th overall pick+ some adds, sign me up and get me away from this godawful markstrom bullshit

If I'm Boston and you want Swayman then I want Nemec. 10OA in this draft? Not a chance.

Markstrom would be an ideal fit in NJ. You just don't see it. He's a good goalie for teams that give up a lot of high danger chances. That blueline will continue to do that for the duration of Markstrom's deal.

 

[dgibb10]

I think a lot of posters don't understand what it takes to be a starter in the NHL. It's much more difficult than being a platoon guy. Markstrom is a guy who plays 60+ games. There's only 2 guys who have started as many games as him over the last few years. Hellebuyck and Vasilevskiy. Guys like Ullmark have never carried a starter's load.

Untrue.

Markstrom is 11th in games over the last 2 years behind this list. Not even counting the playoff games any of these guys have played that markstrom has not. And yeah, who knows if markstrom can maintain a high workload into his mid 30s. Just 5 goalies since 2007 have been able to play 100 games in their age 35 and 36 seasons, broduer, henrik, luongo, miller, and thomas

If I'm Boston and you want Swayman then I want Nemec. 10OA in this draft? Not a chance.

Markstrom would be an ideal fit in NJ. You just don't see it. He's a good goalie for teams that give up a lot of high danger chances. That blueline will continue to do that for the duration of Markstrom's deal.

Hence why I have Jeremy Swayman in the 5th overall tier. Markstrom actually in fact fell apart with a weak defensive core once Tanev was gone sporting a 0.870

 

[Double Dion]

Untrue.

Markstrom is 11th in games over the last 2 years behind this list. Not even counting the playoff games any of these guys have played that markstrom has not. And yeah, who knows if markstrom can maintain a high workload into his mid 30s. Just 5 goalies since 2007 have been able to play 100 games in their age 35 and 36 seasons, broduer, henrik, luongo, miller, and thomasView attachment 880652


Hence why I have Jeremy Swayman in the 5th overall tier. Markstrom actually in fact fell apart with a weak defensive core once Tanev was gone sporting a 0.870

Read it again. I never said the last 2 years. I said the last few of years. 2 years is an extraordinarily small sample size with veteran goalies. I'm also not sure where you're getting the stat table, but it's incorrect in the GSAx stat line.

Untrue.

Markstrom is 11th in games over the last 2 years behind this list. Not even counting the playoff games any of these guys have played that markstrom has not. And yeah, who knows if markstrom can maintain a high workload into his mid 30s. Just 5 goalies since 2007 have been able to play 100 games in their age 35 and 36 seasons, broduer, henrik, luongo, miller, and thomasView attachment 880652


Hence why I have Jeremy Swayman in the 5th overall tier. Markstrom actually in fact fell apart with a weak defensive core once Tanev was gone sporting a 0.870

So you're saying he struggled after he was told he's going to NJ and they traded his 2 best friends while the team completely fell out of the playoff race and dealing with an injury? Shocker. Calgary had 3 #8 defensemen in the lineup and a guy who hadn't played in a year and a half. They also had 2 NHL centers on the roster. Before that he was #1 in the NHL in high danger save percentage.

 

[Nemec]

Blackwood made the list.
Fitz entered the chat

 

[dgibb10]

Read it again. I never said the last 2 years. I said the last few of years. 2 years is an extraordinarily small sample size with veteran goalies. I'm also not sure where you're getting the stat table, but it's incorrect in the GSAx stat line.


So you're saying he struggled after he was told he's going to NJ and they traded his 2 best friends while the team completely fell out of the playoff race and dealing with an injury? Shocker. Calgary had 3 #8 defensemen in the lineup and a guy who hadn't played in a year and a half. They also had 2 NHL centers on the roster. Before that he was #1 in the NHL in high danger save percentage.

Markstrom is an aging goalie. I'm not looking back to 3-4 years ago to show he can handle a full workload. The workload he can handle will only become less and less as he ages

Kaapo Kahkonen played through the same awful defense, except the entire year.

 

[Forge]

I think a lot of posters don't understand what it takes to be a starter in the NHL. It's much more difficult than being a platoon guy. Markstrom is a guy who plays 60+ games. There's only 2 guys who have started as many games as him over the last few years. Hellebuyck and Vasilevskiy. Guys like Ullmark have never carried a starter's load.

60 is a fairly arbitrary number (I don't think Igor has ever played 60 games in the regular season and I don't think anyone cares). I agree that there is value in being a guy who can be trusted with a workload, but I do think that number is lower than 60 now. I think if your guy is playing 53, it's probably fine. The league is simply moving away from that model for the most part. They know that guys tire and wear down. Only 10 guys started that many games this year. The year before it was 12. So that seems like the a good number to hit. Now, Marty seems to value guys that can do 60, so maybe that matters in a trade for the devils, but I'm not sure how much weight people give it when evaluating goalies in general.

Also, that workload value only carries weight as long as your numbers don't suffer, and as long as you don't break down. You can point to that season 3 years ago for Markstrom, but he's entering his age 35 season now. He suffered multiple injuries last year (though one was a broken finger I think, which is a fairly random incident) and his body wearing down is a concern. We've seen guys still play at a decent level at his age (including Bob this year), so his age itself isn't an issue for me acquiring him, but it limits how much I value his season 3 years ago. If he just craters and is done, it's not all that surprising at his age. That's okay to admit, just as I can admit he is still very much capable of doing what Bob is doing this year.

I agree that Ullmark has never done that, and I've made that same argument for why he's not a perfect target either. I think people probably still value what he does game in and game out more so than Markstrom, but that's just me guessing what a consensus ranking would be. I still think people as a whole largely value Markstrom around the 11-14 mark of starting goalies, and that's with accounting for his workload versus someone like Ullmark. That's squarely above average territory to me, though he's probably in a much wider tier of goalies that goes something like 9 - 16 or something. But any of those guys is also capable of putting up a season where they were a top 3 goalie in the nhl.