Most productive UFA signings of the cap era

[The don godfather]

Chara by a landslide. Hall of Famer captain and delivered the cup 2011.

 

[Nogatco Rd]

Chara by a landslide. Hall of Famer captain and delivered the cup 2011.

This, and it’s not that close IMO

 

[ColbyChaos]

Assuming you're correct (and I have no reason to believe you aren't), it's still crazy to think that Panarin needs only 46 points (in less than 222 games played) to be almost inarguably the best free agent signing of the cap era. I think he already is, but those numbers are staggering.

Different scoring environment from 2010-18 compared to now.

Hossa still takes the cake amongst forwards especially considering him only making 5 million lead to three titles while being a selke level winger that could flip a series

Panarin sucks in the playoffs and New York hasn’t don’t shit with his 11.6 million on the books either

 

[Dfence033]

Different scoring environment from 2010-18 compared to now.

Hossa still takes the cake amongst forwards especially considering him only making 5 million lead to three titles while being a selke level winger that could flip a series

Panarin sucks in the playoffs and New York hasn’t don’t shit with his 11.6 million on the books either

Except win like 2/3 of their games with him in the lineup over 5 seasons, play on two conference finals in that time, and Panarin being 4th in the entire NHL in points since he came to the Rangers, sure, they and he have done a whole lot of nothing. His playoff performances are a legitimate complaint, but he is unquestionably in the top 2 reasons why the Rangers even get there.

I still stand on Chara’s impact on “leading to a Cup” or to some massive roster character overhaul as hugely overstated. It’s no coincidence to me that Bergeron became the Bergeron people remember just as Chara arrived. I’m not knocking Chara, who with a tiny handful of others, are in this discussion. I just don’t think the “ainec” comments are way out there. It’s certainly close.

 

[JianYang]

Chara's cap hit was astounding when he signed with boston. 7.5 million cap hit back in 2006 is the equivalent of a 15 million dollar cap hit today.

 

[tyhee]

Awards like... 1 Norris? Ok. You'll have to excuse me for placing more of an emphasis on scoring (in this hypothetical) approaching or over 1,000 points with a team as a FA signing than a single Norris trophy. Chara was am excellent player, but if Panarin finishes 1000 games as a Ranger at near or over a PPG, he would easily take the top spot for me. Especially if as you say the Rangers win a Cup with him.

And "changing the entire culture of an organization" is both impossible to quantify and to attribute to a single player. I'd argue Bergeron turning into a near PPG Selke-worthy beast of a player in 2006 was at absolute worst equal to Chara's arrival that same year.

I'm with those that don't believe you can measure value produced entirely by points. Saying the high scorer has been the most productive player doesn't make any sense to me, which leaves you to either try to find a metric that takes more measures of play into account or simply being subjective.

One very rough and dirty thing a person can do is look at some estimate of point shares. Even that doesn't really work and only produces a measurement which almost certainly has to be closer than the mark than just scoring.

The PS scale on hockey-reference.com would leave Panarin needing several more seasons of productivity in order to catch Chara. Again, that's only a very rough and dirty estimate and that metric probably is imperfect as well, but at least it takes into account more than scoring.

A more interesting subject may be to compare value received compared with cap hit, adjusted in some way for era, but of course convincing people there was a reasonable metric to use in such a comparison would be as difficult as coming up with the metric itself, leading us back to subjective impressions.

 

[ColbyChaos]

Except win like 2/3 of their games with him in the lineup over 5 seasons, play on two conference finals in that time, and Panarin being 4th in the entire NHL in points since he came to the Rangers, sure, they and he have done a whole lot of nothing. His playoff performances are a legitimate complaint, but he is unquestionably in the top 2 reasons why the Rangers even get there.

That aint shit to 3 cups and another WCF while playing in the deepest division at the time. You cant be the best FA forward if you cant create success when it matters. Stacking points against bottom tier teams like the Jackets, Pens, Habs and Sens isnt the barometer for being the best FA especially when said forward doesnt offer anything defensively and disappears when th games actually matter.

I still stand on Chara’s impact on “leading to a Cup” or to some massive roster character overhaul as hugely overstated. It’s no coincidence to me that Bergeron became the Bergeron people remember just as Chara arrived. I’m not knocking Chara, who with a tiny handful of others, are in this discussion. I just don’t think the “ainec” comments are way out there. It’s certainly close.

Bergeron's concussions came after Chara’s arrival try again. Boston had success New York could only dream of

Panarin doesn't have an argument especially when the goal is to win the cup

 

[Dfence033]

That aint shit to 3 cups and another WCF while playing in the deepest division at the time. You cant be the best FA forward if you cant create success when it matters. Stacking points against bottom tier teams like the Jackets, Pens, Habs and Sens isnt the barometer for being the best FA especially when said forward doesnt offer anything defensively and disappears when th games actually matter.


Bergeron's concussions came after Chara’s arrival try again. Boston had success New York could only dream of

Panarin doesn't have an argument especially when the goal is to win the cup

Bergeron played his 2nd NHL season when Chara arrived, and put up back to back near PPG seasons. Unless you are going to try to convince me that Chara turned Bergeron into a PPG perennial Selke winner by simply existing.

Let’s just agree to disagree.

 

[mattihp]

'Best' is pretty subjective in this context. If they are to be compared I can't imagine why position, caphit and defensive play wouldn't be part of the equation.

Chara and Selänne winning cups with similar or even worse rosters than Panarin's supportive cast is also interesting.

 

[morehockeystats]

There are different UFA signings - between players who refused extension and those who weren't offered one.

 

[Hockey Know it all]

Awards like... 1 Norris? Ok. You'll have to excuse me for placing more of an emphasis on scoring (in this hypothetical) approaching or over 1,000 points with a team as a FA signing than a single Norris trophy. Chara was am excellent player, but if Panarin finishes 1000 games as a Ranger at near or over a PPG, he would easily take the top spot for me. Especially if as you say the Rangers win a Cup with him.

And "changing the entire culture of an organization" is both impossible to quantify and to attribute to a single player. I'd argue Bergeron turning into a near PPG Selke-worthy beast of a player in 2006 was at absolute worst equal to Chara's arrival that same year.

I have one issue with this Statement- Bergeron was never really a ppg guy. People want to argue and say he is the best ever defensively but I feel Datsyuk is just as good and he also ended his career almost PPG.

 

[Dfence033]

I have one issue with this Statement- Bergeron was never really a ppg guy. People want to argue and say he is the best ever defensively but I feel Datsyuk is just as good and he also ended his career almost PPG.

I won’t argue Bergeron over Datsyuk, but only one is relevant to the topic in this thread. Bergeron was “near” PPG as well. 1,000 points in 1,200 games removing his 0.5PPG rookie year is reasonably close enough, and I did say “near” PPG. He had or paced for 70+ points 7 times in his career. He may not be Datsyuk, but he’s certainly a very impactful player in the Bruins turnaround that was being entirely attributed to Chara.

 

[morehockeystats]

I won’t argue Bergeron over Datsyuk, but only one is relevant to the topic in this thread. Bergeron was “near” PPG as well. 1,000 points in 1,200 games removing his 0.5PPG rookie year is reasonably close enough, and I did say “near” PPG. He had or paced for 70+ points 7 times in his career. He may not be Datsyuk, but he’s certainly a very impactful player in the Bruins turnaround that was being entirely attributed to Chara.

Some attribute it to Thornton's departure just as much as Chara's arrival.

 

[Dfence033]

Some attribute it to Thornton's departure just as much as Chara's arrival.

I’d attribute it to many factors. Whether Thornton being traded, Bergeron becoming who he was, Chara’s arrival, etc. my point was that using “changing the culture to win Cups” being attributed exclusively to Chara as a free agent signing as a reason he’d place above a hypothetical 1,000 points in 1,000 games Panarin is a nonstarter for me.

 

[Theodore450]

Does Adam Fox count?

 

[Jersey Fan 12]

Assuming you're correct (and I have no reason to believe you aren't), it's still crazy to think that Panarin needs only 46 points (in less than 222 games played) to be almost inarguably the best free agent signing of the cap era. I think he already is, but those numbers are staggering.

Understand both recency bias and the Sam Rosen Ranger inflation, but you didn't seriously compare Artemi Panarin to Teemu Selanne?

 

[Dfence033]

Understand both recency bias and the Sam Rosen Ranger inflation, but you didn't seriously compare Artemi Panarin to Teemu Selanne?

Considering Selanne was traded to the Ducks, rather than signing as a free agent, and has his most productive years prior to returning as a free agent, yes, I do. After signing as a free agent, Selanne had 506 points in 572 games with the Ducks. Panarin could reasonably have 1,000 points in 1,000 games. Would I take a prime Selanne over a prime Panarin? Probably. Do they compare under the parameters of “best free agent signing?” Not really.