Most overrated player: Federov or Forsberg

[I am not exposed]

Good poll.

Sergei imo.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Didn’t vote , as none of them were overrated, as nearly everyone has already mentioned.

 

[Regal]

I think both have people that overrate them and people that underrate them. I don’t think they’re particularly overrated overall, but I think when they are Forsberg tends to be overrated based on his potential career without injury and Fedorov tends to be overrated based on just his ‘94 season.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

they are both probably underrated due to the primacy of stats in player evaluation

Fedorov more so so voted Forsberg (also Avs suck)

Both as good if not better than anyone who came in the league post 2005

You both called them underrated while overrating them all in one post. Good job.

 

[Dionysus]

Neither. Both absolute studs. Forsberg was the best player in the league for a stretch in the early 2000's.

Both great two-way centers on cup winning powerhouses.

Before leaving Colorado in 2007-2008 he had 11 points in his last 4 games. One of the very best to lace them up. Injuries shortened an amazing career but he still won everything a player could want. X2 Cups, x2 Olympic Golds.

 

[RevengeOfTheDrai]

Overrated is when Federov gets promoted as the only player to win the Hart and the Lindsay as if those were mutually exclusive. it's doubtful he wins that Hart if his defensive game wasn't considered.

I think you meant Selke, but yes those things aren’t mutually exclusive, the Selke defense helped him win the Hart. Nevertheless, he got 2nd in points and I can’t blame him for not beating out Gretzky.

To put things into perspective, Matthews won the 2022 Hart, driven by his goal scoring and defensive analytics, while being 6th in points without winning the Selke.

 

[tabness]

Overrated is when Federov gets promoted as the only player to win the Hart and the Lindsay as if those were mutually exclusive. it's doubtful he wins that Hart if his defensive game wasn't considered.

Fedorov has a very strong case to be the best offensive player in 1993-1994 alone, and it isn't Gretzky who was giving him the competition there (would have been Lindros).

Any look beyond superficial total points will pretty easily demonstrate that, given the different utilization of the Wings and Kings powerplays and how Fedorov had to split time with Yzerman on separate units.

 

[daver]

Fedorov has a very strong case to be the best offensive player in 1993-1994 alone, and it isn't Gretzky who was giving him the competition there (would have been Lindros).

Any look beyond superficial total points will pretty easily demonstrate that, given the different utilization of the Wings and Kings powerplays and how Fedorov had to split time with Yzerman on separate units.

He was 5th in PPG that season so hard to clearly separate him from players like Neely, Lindros, Oates. He was on an offensive powerhouse team that can be argued cancels out the utilization argument.

 

[tabness]

He was 5th in PPG that season so hard to clearly separate him from players like Neely, Lindros, Oates. He was on an offensive powerhouse team that can be argued cancels out the utilization argument.

Not that simple. If stats based arguments are going to be made, let's get deep into the stats:

Fedorov was first by far in even strength points, only Lindros could hang.

Fedorov also actually scored 50.

Fedorov led in primary points, no secondary Sergei here.

Fedorov's powerplay points were suppressed simply because of the way the Wings ran things with Fedorov and Yzerman on different units. The Red Wings had 85 powerplay goals, Fedorov was only on the ice for 51 of them. That's a far lower proportion than Gretzky 78 of 92. Had Fedorov just got to play mostly on the powerplay, moreover had he gotten to play with Yzerman, he'd score more just by virtue of opportunity.

All this shows up clearly as Fedorov's scoring drops when Yzerman is in the lineup rather than out of it. Sharing the wealth, and keeping the two mostly seperated.

The Red Wings were an offensive powerhouse because of their depth more than a stacked line thing, I'm sure you can appreciate this given how you argue against McDavid on this point (vis a vis Crosby of course).

 

[CokenoPepsi]

I love a good hate thread.

Forsberg

 

[psycat]

There are garbage takes and there is this

Agreed thats a good take.

 

[RuudeDog]

Over rated ? This must be a joke

 

[jalapenoWithAnH]

Overrated is when Federov gets promoted as the only player to win the Hart and the Lindsay as if those were mutually exclusive. it's doubtful he wins that Hart if his defensive game wasn't considered.

Well he did lead the Wings in points, assists, goals and game winning goals that season. He had 22% more points than the second leading scorer. On a league level he was only beaten by Gretzky. Comparing the offensive impact of Fedorov and Gretzky it's relevant to point out that Wings won their division with a 2 point margin to Leafs while Kings didn't even make it to playoffs. I'm pretty sure Hart has been won with lesser offensive performances.

Also in another comment you brought up ppg. Imo this is not a valid point in Hart conversation. Hart is about impact the player has had. There's four players ahead of Fedorov in ppg that season and only one of them (Gretzky) played a full season. Lemieux played 22 , Neely 49 and Lindros 65 games. It's possible their ppg's would have decreased if they played a full season. Also it is clear your impact for your team decreases the less games you play. Fedorov played the full season and arguably had most of an impact for his teams success out of the top 5 ppg players even though he was the fifth.

But even if it's the case that he wouldn't have won Hart if his defensive game wasn't considered that doesn't make it any less special. Detroits best and leagues second best scorer also being the leagues best defensive forward is one hell of an accomplishment in itself and thats reflected in the hart + selke double win.

 

[WillardJFredricks]

Forsberg. Although Fedorov seems to be getting close. But on here, Forsberg is revered to an insane degree. Yes he was a great player, but on these boards you'd think he was Gretzky, Lemieux, Crosby and McDavid all rolled into one.

 

[Toby91ca]

Neither were overrated. Both were downright dominant when they wanted to be.
Dumb thread is dumb.

The most dominant player ever could still be overrated, it all comes down to how a player is rated. For example, a lot of people believe Gretzky is the greatest player of all time…calling him that probably isn’t overrating him…but suggesting he was twice the player Lemieux was would be overrating him.

I think there are people that overrate both of theses guys…in my mind, more overrate Forsberg, but on the whole, neither are overrated

 

[FissionFire]

How overrated can he be if people still can’t spell his name correctly all these years later?

 

[Diglett]

Forsberg.

Some people act like he was the best thing since Lemieux.

 

[norrisnick]

Neither. Both absolute studs. Forsberg was the best player in the league for a stretch in the early 2000's.

Both great two-way centers on cup winning powerhouses.

Before leaving Colorado in 2007-2008 he had 11 points in his last 4 games. One of the very best to lace them up. Injuries shortened an amazing career but he still won everything a player could want. X2 Cups, x2 Olympic Golds.

Way too much Thorne and Clement in that sentence there. Lidstrom existed in the early 2000s and was a better overall player than Forsberg.

 

[Patty Ice]

Neither

 

[authentic]

they are both probably underrated due to the primacy of stats in player evaluation

Fedorov more so so voted Forsberg (also Avs suck)

Both as good if not better than anyone who came in the league post 2005

I find it strange that players who basically looked like the best ever at their best, outplayed the best players of their era in the playoffs consistently, dominated 200ft of the ice, but aren’t ranked in the top 30 players of all-time are the ones people pick on as overrated

 

[authentic]

He said something about Fedorov being able to win a Norris if he wanted to.

My biggest gripe about Fedorov was that he could have turned it on more in the regular season. We all knew Fedorov would dominate in the postseason but didn’t know which guy would show up the other 82 games. He’d play great against the avs, stars, blues and other big name teams. Then he’d coast against Nashville and Columbus.

Someone posted something where he outscored every elite player of his era in his career head to head, I think Forsberg was the only one who essentially matched him.

 

[JFedol]

2002 Forsberg was something else entirely from the eye test lol

Looked otherworldly vs Detroit ngl

27pts with a shit ton of hooking, obstruction and grabbing to lead the entire playoffs after not playing in the RS from a foot injury. I don't know if Fedorov could come close to producing those numbers

 

[kp61c]

how can fedorov be the most overrated when every second one on this site doesn't even bother to spell his name correctly?

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

2002 Forsberg was something else entirely from the eye test lol

Looked otherworldly vs Detroit ngl

27pts with a shit ton of hooking, obstruction and grabbing to lead the entire playoffs after not playing in the RS from a foot injury. I don't know if Fedorov could come close to producing those numbers

In my 30+ years of watching hockey 2002 Forsberg is the closest to 93-94 Fedorov I’ve seen when talking 3-zone dominance. The guy was just in the zone all postseason.