Morgan Rielly "It's stanley cup or bust. I think that’s how our group feels. Anything short of that will be a failure."

[authentic]

They've been asked about this in the past. Never said anything like that. Usually they allude to the ultimate goal and say the past is the past and they are focused on camp. First time I can recall the core players all saying the cup was the goal

“To a degree”. Take it with a grain of salt

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Obviously, we're not debating past results. This thread is about potential future results.

Do eight years of 'almosts' make the Leafs more motivated to change the past, or are they simply doomed to keep repeating their pattern? I'm not a believer in pre-destiny. At some point I believe they'll make a decent run. Whether it's the group's maturing mindset or just plain puck-luck, I don't see how this roster can continue losing early every year (although, as a rival fan, nothing would please me more!).

Why not? Some cores just don't have the ability to win (see: Thornton's Sharks).

The issue with the Leafs is their big guns haven't really shown up or dominated a playoff run. What you're talking about applies to like when Ovechkin was playing well but the Caps kept choking or McDavid performing well but the Oilers falling short. In those cases, you could see a break through because the main piece of the core was actually performing, even if the team as a whole wasn't. In Toronto's case, it's literally the core.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Obviously, we're not debating past results. This thread is about potential future results.

Do eight years of 'almosts' make the Leafs more motivated to change the past, or are they simply doomed to keep repeating their pattern? I'm not a believer in pre-destiny. At some point I believe they'll make a decent run. Whether it's the group's maturing mindset or just plain puck-luck, I don't see how this roster can continue losing early every year (although, as a rival fan, nothing would please me more!).

The thing is, I think you're overrating their caliber too much. As in, I think the results are a bit more in line with their abilities than perhaps you are suggesting. I think 2022-23 was their genuinely best team, and that was the one that won a round. They've for the most part been in the "maybe win a round, maybe not" caliber. I was surprised to see even the 2020-21 team that played an entire season in the weak North Division and was shockingly upset only had a +39 GD in 56 games, then you look at the roster and it wasn't that good.

Rielly himself is somewhat symptomatic. A good, not great player that has to cosplay was a Number 1 and is often a bandaid over a fledging D group as a whole. Then there's the goaltending, already behind D groups that range from mediocre to okay and almost entirely relying on the "cross your fingers and pray" method. On an elite defensive group, someone like Rielly is a high-end #3 on a well-balanced and versatile group. Or if you are weaker on Defense, you make a big commitment on bringing in an elite goaltender to cover the gaps.

 

[Sheppy]

Rielly should've been captain, not that he's a great player or anything, but he's vet in that room and the players seem to respect him. The Leafs are going to take a big step back this year with Matthews as captain, he's the biggest reason for their lack of success in the playoffs and they reward him with the "C" for it while slapping milk and cookies on their helmet.

His tummy ache/60 last year in the playoffs was elite.

 

[Lshap]

Why not? Some cores just don't have the ability to win (see: Thornton's Sharks).

The issue with the Leafs is their big guns haven't really shown up or dominated a playoff run. What you're talking about applies to like when Ovechkin was playing well but the Caps kept choking or McDavid performing well but the Oilers falling short. In those cases, you could see a break through because the main piece of the core was actually performing, even if the team as a whole wasn't. In Toronto's case, it's literally the core.

Spock must have a beard in this universe if I'm defending the Leafs.

Yeah, no question Marner needs to step up and Tavares is losing steam. Not sure what can be expected from those guys. But Nylander's been strong, even though he was hurt last time, and Matthews was solid, despite having the most coverage. Then there's the supporting cast. Leafs now have Domi, who looked really good, and this kid Knies, who might be a big surprise.

Anyway, the bottom line is the Leafs aren't as elite as they imagined, but they're good enough to make a run if they're willing to claw their way there. Are they fed up enough to finally put up a fight? Maybe. I won't be shocked to see them make it to round 2 or 3 this season.

 

[Lshap]

The thing is, I think you're overrating their caliber too much. As in, I think the results are a bit more in line with their abilities than perhaps you are suggesting. I think 2022-23 was their genuinely best team, and that was the one that won a round. They've for the most part been in the "maybe win a round, maybe not" caliber. I was surprised to see even the 2020-21 team that played an entire season in the weak North Division and was shockingly upset only had a +39 GD in 56 games, then you look at the roster and it wasn't that good.

Rielly himself is somewhat symptomatic. A good, not great player that has to cosplay was a Number 1 and is often a bandaid over a fledging D group as a whole. Then there's the goaltending, already behind D groups that range from mediocre to okay and almost entirely relying on the "cross your fingers and pray" method. On an elite defensive group, someone like Rielly is a high-end #3 on a well-balanced and versatile group. Or if you are weaker on Defense, you make a big commitment on bringing in an elite goaltender to cover the gaps.

I agree – their 22/23 roster looked like a contender on paper. This Leafs team doesn't have the big vets they did then, but they've got some good younger guys who played well against Boston. Most important, they've got eight years of accumulated angst which may (or may not) act as a catalyst. Is that enough to add up to playoff success? Weirder things have happened. In fact, I'd say it's weird that this annual top-seeded team has managed to avoid almost all playoff success. You figure they'd have gone farther even due to dumb luck.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Here is what likely happened:

1. Asked an extremely leading question.

2. Gives the boilerplate answer.

3. The obvious reactions are gathered.

I mean it’s been cup or bust for a few seasons now. They refused to make roster changes after their latest first round flameout so you have to think this is their last shot.

The Rangers are in a similar position .

 

[WarriorofTime]

I agree – their 22/23 roster looked like a contender on paper. This Leafs team doesn't have the big vets they did then, but they've got some good younger guys who played well against Boston. Most important, they've got eight years of accumulated angst which may (or may not) act as a catalyst. Is that enough to add up to playoff success? Weirder things have happened. In fact, I'd say it's weird that this annual top-seeded team has managed to avoid almost all playoff success. You figure they'd have gone farther even due to dumb luck.

At some point with the Leafs, it's just a question of how many times can you run back the exact same formula, make some small tweaks here and there and hope for a different result?

 

[Strangelove]

They're not making the Cup Final this year. The window will re-open after this season is over and Tavares 11M albatross comes off the books.

That will get gobbled up by Tavares' replacement/new salary + raises.

Raises to Marner, Knies, McCabe, Woll...

 

[Commander Clueless]

It's easy to dunk on Toronto, but most of their playoff losses have been hard-fought and gone the distance. How much closer can a series get than OT in game 7?

I hate to say it, but I can see them getting over that hump, because the hump isn't really that big.

I would have agreed with you, but the frequency at which it keeps happening would suggest that hump may be bigger than it appears... Even if it is mental.

I'm a Leafs fan and I can't tell you how much I hope you are correct. I'll cheer for it happen.... But I'll also believe it when I see it.

...Okay I'll believe it when I see it AND make extra sure I'm not dreaming first.


What's that old saying? Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me 8 times...uh...fire Keefe and run it back or something? I forget how it goes exactly.

 

[AvroArrow]

That will get gobbled up by Tavares' replacement/new salary + raises.

Raises to Marner, Knies, McCabe, Woll...

Probably not, Dubas is gone

 

[Strangelove]

Probably not, Dubas is gone

Doesn't matter who the GM is, that extra money will be gobbled up.

 

[nuxnux1]

For a group that doesn’t seem to preform well under pressure this is sure putting a lot on them, let’s see how it works out

 

[Kerberos]

I'm talking about the fact the Oilers are a more mature group in age than the Leafs and so hit their peak sooner. Leafs are entering their peak

The cope here is insane.

The Leafs suck and have no playoff success because their supposed best players are playoff busts. That's all there is to it.

You don't have a single player on your team that has the ability to elevate like McDavid or Draisaitl.

 

[HockeyVirus]

The cope here is insane.

The Leafs suck and have no playoff success because their supposed best players are playoff busts. That's all there is to it.

You don't have a single player on your team that has the ability to elevate like McDavid or Draisaitl.

McDavid just had the best playoff of all time so duh lol. The point you miss is if collectively they play better it makes up those gaps.

Berube won't have them playing the trap in the postseason, they will be able to score

 

[JoVel]

This guy really said water is wet and HFBoards will turn it into a 70 page thread.

 

[nuxnux1]

This guy really said water is wet and HFBoards will turn it into a 70 page thread.

It’s just that having that be the message in the room and coming out and saying it are two very different things, Morgan Reilly ain’t that guy and people laughed when the greatest player since Gretzky said this. It’s just giving people free ammo.

 

[Matty Sundin]

They badly need to win an over dramatic emotional game 7 series winner to get over whatever mental issue they have over it but seem to lose game 7 in every possible way.

Their roster isn’t as strong as years before but I do think the talent and make up of their line up is still good enough for a long run if everything falls together but they need to get over that mental hump somehow.

 

[dirtydanglez]

this has been the expectation for the last 5 years. i think it was a mistake going again with the same core.

 

[MilkofthePoppy]

I'm surprised he would aim so high considering getting out of the first round is such a huge challenge for that group.

 

[K1984]

Do you think that the Oilers made it to the Cup Finals because of a pre-season press conference last year?

Sarcasm aside - I do remember an interview where Mark Messier talked about joining the Rangers and having the entire organization terrified to even mention the Cup, and him saying that it was important to be able to have the group understand the expectation.

If anything the "Cup or bust" pre-season narrative cost the Oilers last year.

They had their eyes on June in October and came into camp early and overworked themselves.

 

[benfranklin]

The rangers have the same problem as the Leafs, a core who vanishes in big moments. The Rangers are the Leafs if they had a stud goalie. And they found their guy in Woll

In what universe has Woll proven himself at all, let alone to be mentioned in the same post as Shesterkin when referencing a potential playoff matchup?!

ill give you the core vanshing when it matters, but you can say that about almost every team that lost a series ever.The Avalanche come to mind. Disappeared the past two seasons, but thee ago, boom won it. Panthers, same deal.

The Rangers have been to two ECF's in the last three years! Leafs fans would kill for that type of "success" instead of being the laughing stock of the league still. They are at best 3rd rankings right now initially ranking Eastern teams (arguably in the 4-7 range) so making an ECF, let alone a SCF is a long shot, but sure lets declare that Woll is the already the guy to carry them there.

 

[PaulD]

Leafs have never won 3 rounds....ket alone 4....... and they ain't gonna do it with this roster.

 

[MoreMogilny]

If anything the "Cup or bust" pre-season narrative cost the Oilers last year.

They had their eyes on June in October and came into camp early and overworked themselves.

Berube in his camp presser addressed that. He’s focusing the team on the moment they’re in, not the playoffs. Not yet.

 

[chaser17]

Hate the leafs but the roster looks solid. An all Canadian cup final could be fun!