WWE: Monday Night Raw 145 - Oh, Shane is so gonna pay for this...

[AfroThunder396]

You don't need to talk to get over. It certainly helps, but guys like Neville and Zayn are getting over purely on in-ring ability.

On the other hand, you have guys like Enzo & Cass that are over purely because of their mic skills even thought they put on very meat and potatoes matches.

And then there are guys like The Undertaker and Bray Wyatt who excel with production value, aura, presentation, mystique, whatever you want to call it. I think this is where Finn's value lies.

There's no magic bullet, every wrestler has to figure out their own way to make it work.

 

[M.C.G. 31]

Neville isn't over (yet), his finish is.

 

[Emperoreddy]

You don't need to talk to get over. It certainly helps, but guys like Neville and Zayn are getting over purely on in-ring ability.

On the other hand, you have guys like Enzo & Cass that are over purely because of their mic skills even thought they put on very meat and potatoes matches.

And then there are guys like The Undertaker and Bray Wyatt who excel with production value, aura, presentation, mystique, whatever you want to call it. I think this is where Finn's value lies.

There's no magic bullet, every wrestler has to figure out their own way to make it work.

I think so as well and they have booked Finn as well as you can these first two weeks.

They let his look and entrance do the talking the first week, and booked him like a star in two excellent matches. Then they hid his promo shortcomings behind a better heel talker in Seth, and asked him to just deliver the lines he needed to and it worked. It is working as crowds are popping for him.

I would still turn him. You have the original Bullet Club on the same roster. It just makes way to much sense and it would get mega over (and sell a **** ton of merch too). Double turn works as long as Seth stays a bit on the tweener side and cocky. Cocky Seth is the best Seth.

I think people constantly forget how hard white meat babyface promos are. Cena is still the only guy in the company that can cut them (not counting DB since he isn't wrestling anymore), and even his can get old fast.

Not a coincidence that almost all the guys listed earlier in this thread are all heels right now. Face AJ was terrible earlier this year. Face Jericho was bad earlier this year. Dean is doing his best work right now because he is adding some heel notes to his promos.

 

[M.C.G. 31]

A lot of offers made to former talents were reportedly too low for them to sign when they can make more on the indies and control the dates they work.

If I were them, I wouldn't take less than $400,000 on a downside.


**

The original plan was for Sasha Banks to win the Women's Title at Wrestlemania. The reason it didn't happen? Becky Lynch got too over so they added her to the match and made it a triple-threat.

 

[Le Tricolore]

A lot of offers made to former talents were reportedly too low for them to sign when they can make more on the indies and control the dates they work.

If I were them, I wouldn't take less than $400,000 on a downside.


**

The original plan was for Sasha Banks to win the Women's Title at Wrestlemania. The reason it didn't happen? Becky Lynch got too over so they added her to the match and made it a triple-threat.

And had Charlotte retain? wat

 

[M.C.G. 31]

And had Charlotte retain? wat

They intended Sasha have her moment at Wrestlemania but it would have been one-on-one. Becky's involvement changed that. Next up was Summerslam, but when the draft happened and they wanted to push "new era" they moved the switch up to Raw.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

You don't need to talk to get over. It certainly helps, but guys like Neville and Zayn are getting over purely on in-ring ability.

On the other hand, you have guys like Enzo & Cass that are over purely because of their mic skills even thought they put on very meat and potatoes matches.

And then there are guys like The Undertaker and Bray Wyatt who excel with production value, aura, presentation, mystique, whatever you want to call it. I think this is where Finn's value lies.

There's no magic bullet, every wrestler has to figure out their own way to make it work.

Not true.

they may be getting over to a MID CARD level, but if you can't talk it is very difficult to get over on a MAIN EVENT level. It can be done but it is extremely difficult.

Finn looks thoroughly outclassed by Rollins, i am just saying it may be too soon to put him in there with the best all around performer on your roster, before he ever has a chance to get over with the broad audience

 

[Big Poppa Puck]

Chris Benoit and RVD got over without much talking.

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

Chris Benoit and RVD got over without much talking.

It's possible, but not the norm I'd say. And you'll never be "the face of the company" if you can't.

 

[Balance]

Chris Benoit and RVD got over without much talking.

Name anyone on the roster half as exciting as Benoit or RVD that can't talk

 

[Deen]

Name anyone on the roster half as exciting as Benoit or RVD that can't talk

Nakamura, Lesnar, and Itami.

 

[Hypernova]

But what it did is make Rollins look like a real superstar and Finn as a JAG, maybe it is too early to push him as a main eventer? if you can't talk it's very hard to be a main event babyface

Idk what you guys are talking about. Finn gave a decent promo and his line at the end about 'the only thing you'll have handed to you at Summerslam is YOUR ASS!" was pretty awesome. You make it sound like it was the Rock vs Lance Storm. Finn did fine and I believe Cris Benoit was champion at one point and he was always terrible on the mic so it's a moot point. Maybe in a perfect world the champ has to be up to The Rock and Austin's caliber on the mic but it's just not true in the real world. Finn has a lot going for him, he can be decent on the mic and still be champion.

 

[Hypernova]

It's possible, but not the norm I'd say. And you'll never be "the face of the company" if you can't.

What is "face of the company"? The Rock, Austin, Hogan, Bret, Cena? That's a small number of guys so why does everyone need to be compared to them? It's not the normal path to being champion. Being that big is nice but you can't compare every new guy coming up to them. It's not fair at all.

 

[AfroThunder396]

Neville isn't over (yet), his finish is.

Neville was certainly making progress before the injury.

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

What is "face of the company"? The Rock, Austin, Hogan, Bret, Cena? That's a small number of guys so why does everyone need to be compared to them? It's not the normal path to being champion. Being that big is nice but you can't compare every new guy coming up to them. It's not fair at all.

Sure, I'd agree with that. In the realm of discussions it's all about expectations. I assume this was all based on Finn Balor? Can Finn Balor be a main eventer? I definitely think it's possible. Can he be John Cena? The Rock? Austin? I don't really see it. Doesn't mean it can't happen though, people do get better at different attributes in wrestling. Look at AJ Styles.

Wrestling is weird nowadays though, it's more difficult to get over as a face than a heel. I guess it's because heel's always tended to be more entertaining and have more creative freedom.

 

[Kimi]

Neville gets over when he has good matches, which is something he's batter at than almost the entire roster. The problem is he's given nothing to do so has nothing matches.

 

[Ensane]

Neville was made to be your first (rebooted) cruiserweight champion.

 

[M.C.G. 31]

Yo Neville is a ****ing tank. I saw him and Enzo working out on Enzo's snap story yesterday and jeez. I know Neville is a beast, but god damn.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Yo Neville is a ****ing tank. I saw him and Enzo working out on Enzo's snap story yesterday and jeez. I know Neville is a beast, but god damn.

I look forward to a Balor-Neville match down the road but I'm glad they're establishing Finn off the bat. Even if you don't like him as a baby, it's a good thing to have a fresh face at the main event level.

 

[Kimi]

Sure, I'd agree with that. In the realm of discussions it's all about expectations. I assume this was all based on Finn Balor? Can Finn Balor be a main eventer? I definitely think it's possible. Can he be John Cena? The Rock? Austin? I don't really see it. Doesn't mean it can't happen though, people do get better at different attributes in wrestling. Look at AJ Styles.

Wrestling is weird nowadays though, it's more difficult to get over as a face than a heel. I guess it's because heel's always tended to be more entertaining and have more creative freedom.

Heels have always been more over with the hardcore fans, it's just the way it is. I remember old Flair promos where he flat out says it lol.

 

[Kimi]

I look forward to a Balor-Neville match down the road but I'm glad they're establishing Finn off the bat. Even if you don't like him as a baby, it's a good thing to have a fresh face at the main event level.

They had one at the Rumble NXT show where they typed TV in the bigger arena earlier this year.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Heels have always been more over with the hardcore fans, it's just the way it is. I remember old Flair promos where he flat out says it lol.

As long as you get over, it doesn't really matter. It's something that they should be exploiting more than they do. Once you get over as a heel, the fans will follow you through a babyface run for quite some time.

 

[Ensane]

Yo Neville is a ****ing tank. I saw him and Enzo working out on Enzo's snap story yesterday and jeez. I know Neville is a beast, but god damn.

What was Enzo doing? Spotting him?

 

[BonMorrison]

Yeah, Neville is ripped af. Dat upper body.

 

[M.C.G. 31]

What was Enzo doing? Spotting him?

Lifting weights. Certified G things.