Player Discussion Mitch Marner Part Infinity

[thewave]

Before he even entered the building?

That's some crap that I'm not buying - everyone loved this kid the first few years here. Super skilled, unselfish, played in all situations, local kid, full of energy and enthusiasm and life, and such a breath of fresh air compared to the crap we were used to at the time.

I don't buy that you, and others here, had pegged him as a problem before he even started. Sentiment really started to turn in the final year of his ELC, when the Dregers of the hockey world started negotiating on his behalf, clearly trying to use Leafs fans as leverage against the organization after going through the entire William Nylander saga.

His old man was complaining all the way back in Jr that McDavid was getting to much press etc etc. attitude stuff.

This guy had red flags around him as a kid.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Marner has all the leverage - he won't need to fight "tooth and nail" for anything.

We have this sign & trade conversation every summer about notable UFAs, and they never actually end up happening, because the acquiring team has no interest in giving up assets for an 8th year which is often a player's 35+ year.

I don't think 'leverage' really applies.

Marner can wait 4 weeks and then sign with whoever will gave him what he wants, or at least what he will accept.

Leafs can offer him what they think he's worth, and if he doesn't like it they can save the money and use it elsewhere.

 

[notDatsyuk]

He would never lol. It still half shocks me that not a single one of them said to the media "we just werent good enough when it mattered. We need to be better. We are going to work hard all summer to get stronger and faster to make sure it doesnt happen again."

Looking at McDavid last year when Edmonton lost in the finals he was just gutted. He is not going to let it happen again this year. Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, Rielly have assumed any responsibility for the team over their tenure here. Matthews complaining about passengers and Marner screaming for people wake the f*** up. It isnt Holmberg or Lorentz fault. Even Domi and Benoit came up clutch more than the bros.

Skill gets you into the playoffs but Heart wins Championships. It feels like the whole world is aligned in thinking that they show zero heart.

I know it will never happen and not having our first for next 2 seasons doesnt help but I am pretty convinced that we cannot win with any of them here. It may sound impulsive but I would look to trade Matthews, Nylander, and Rielly as well. Sure they all have NMC but I think if Brad told them he is trading them, let me know a few teams.

I would rather retool now with a likeable hardworking team than have another 4 years of nonsense until Matthews walks as a ufa.

Nylander said he played badly the last few games. Matthews and Marner blamed others. I don't recall what JT said.

 

[Confucius]

So he can only sign 8 years with the Leafs then. Got it.

Sign and trade can be 8 years or trading his rights gives another team early negotiating time over the rest of league. But that is only 7 years. Thanks for the correct info.

sure another team can sign him to 8 years if he is on their roster before July 1st.

Say another team wants to try and negotiate with Mitch ahead of anybody else, the team offers the leafs a deal. If Mitch signs with us we give you a 3rd. Leafs say ok go ahead and talk to him. Now the ball is in Mitch’s court, he can say go away I’m going USA on July 1st. The new team says ok but you won’t get a better deal than this and it’s for 8 years.

How can it be 8? If Mitch likes the offer he waves his NMC, the Leafs trade him to the new team for that 3rd. Mitch is now officially a member of the new team and can sign for 8 years.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Their camp was throwing out the Schedule B bonuses nonsense to Kypreos last week - it's not just the permanently sour approach they have, but the fact that they seem to take everything so personally and emotionally, and never ever seem like they move on from it.

You could practically see Marner wearing the animosity

Dealing with them feels like the equivalent of reminding your wife she has to pick up the kids today and getting a detailed notarized list of everything you have potentially done wrong since 1993 both in real life and dreams she’s had.

 

[notDatsyuk]

$1.36M per playoff goal.

$10.9M, and a deferred full no move, without getting max term.

It's sickening how badly they handled this situation.

$1.36M per goal if he had 8 per season.

That’s over 6 seasons, so about $8.2M per playoff goal.

 

[Tak7]

Dealing with them feels like the equivalent of reminding your wife she has to pick up the kids today and getting a detailed notarized list of everything you have potentially done wrong since 1993 both in real life and dreams she’s had.

This might be the funniest sentence I've read all year.

 

[Tak7]

His old man was complaining all the way back in Jr that McDavid was getting to much press etc etc. attitude stuff.

This guy had red flags around him as a kid.

For real?
First I've heard of this.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

This core is so miserable to watch I'm starting to feel nostalgic for Kessel, Bozak and JVR.

 

[Doublerum1975]

His old man was complaining all the way back in Jr that McDavid was getting to much press etc etc. attitude stuff.

This guy had red flags around him as a kid.

What does his father have to do with Mitch?

 

[NVious]

Definitely believable that they refused to negotiate all season despite being offered 8x13.5 (according to Dreger) but were also totally ready to sign a team friendly deal before the team asked him to waive his NMC.

Mitch was willing to come back on a 17.5x8, but the stingy Leafs screwed Mitch over yet again.

 

[thewave]

What does his father have to do with Mitch?

The Marners operate as a team. Ferris is a part of the team. He started a foundation for crying out loud. I wonder if it's like the U2 Bono One foundation that gave like 2% of the money to it's causes. Last I heard all the Marner family is making money doing foundation "business"

 

[NVious]

What's sickening is that some random HFBoards posters like me could read the room with that kid before he even entered the building. The execs and managers had no clue, were dumb as nails to the whole thing and even when it got extremely apparent, they still had not clue.

Incompetence of the highest order.

Retrospectively the point at which one of them NEEDED to be moved was after Montreal and probably 80-90% of people would've been fine going for a new look.

Funny enough in the end literally moving any of them would've been fine.

Mitch and Auston have massive dropoffs going into the playoffs, Auston is higher paid and more injury prone though, whereas Mitch's goal scoring dropoff is just as bad except he goes from a good goal scorer in the season to a terrible one post season.

Willie has the lowest dropoff offensively but he's so soft in the defensive end and at times completely lazy (even in the playoffs).

Literally moving any of them would've been a good move.

 

[thewave]

Retrospectively the point at which one of them NEEDED to be moved was after Montreal and probably 80-90% of people would've been fine going for a new look.

Funny enough in the end literally moving any of them would've been fine.

Mitch and Auston have massive dropoffs going into the playoffs, Auston is higher paid and more injury prone though, whereas Mitch's goal scoring dropoff is just as bad except he goes from a good goal scorer in the season to a terrible one post season.

Willie has the lowest dropoff offensively but he's so soft in the defensive end and at times completely lazy (even in the playoffs).

Literally moving any of them would've been a good move.

After MTL. Marner was the only choice. Crying and puck flinging aside. He is the weakest playoff type player.

 

[ACC1224]

What does his father have to do with Mitch?

Nothing, his father hasn't been involved in years.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Nothing, his father hasn't been involved in years.

Yeah, right.

 

[thewave]

Yeah, right.

I encourage you to visit and support. I know it's been around for years and has like 20 posts on it but it is a great place to store generational wealth etc.

Marner Assist Foundation

marnerassistfoundation.com

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

He would never lol. It still half shocks me that not a single one of them said to the media "we just werent good enough when it mattered. We need to be better. We are going to work hard all summer to get stronger and faster to make sure it doesnt happen again."

Looking at McDavid last year when Edmonton lost in the finals he was just gutted. He is not going to let it happen again this year. Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares, Rielly have assumed any responsibility for the team over their tenure here. Matthews complaining about passengers and Marner screaming for people wake the f*** up. It isnt Holmberg or Lorentz fault. Even Domi and Benoit came up clutch more than the bros.

Skill gets you into the playoffs but Heart wins Championships. It feels like the whole world is aligned in thinking that they show zero heart.

I know it will never happen and not having our first for next 2 seasons doesnt help but I am pretty convinced that we cannot win with any of them here. It may sound impulsive but I would look to trade Matthews, Nylander, and Rielly as well. Sure they all have NMC but I think if Brad told them he is trading them, let me know a few teams.

I would rather retool now with a likeable hardworking team than have another 4 years of nonsense until Matthews walks as a ufa.

It would be nice for just one time for them to admit they had something to do with not advancing. I mean personal responsibility on the matter. "I didn't get the job done"...is it that hard to say? Instead it's "Passengers" and we will "Learn from this"...My God...how tone deaf are they?

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

This guy refused to negotiate all year and turned down $13.5 million a year for 8 years. The Leafs doing their due diligence and exploring a trade is on him because he didn’t want to play ball.

Good riddance then. Enjoy Vegas, LA, Chicago, wherever you end up.

Maybe it's the pettiness in me...but I don't want him to enjoy his new destination...like..at all. I want him to be miserable because he took everything the Leafs gave him for granted. It's small of me to be like that..but I don't care.

 

[Tak7]

It would be nice for just one time for them to admit they had something to do with not advancing. I mean personal responsibility on the matter. "I didn't get the job done"...is it that hard to say? Instead it's "Passengers" and we will "Learn from this"...My God...how tone deaf are they?

We've known for years that they just aren't wired that way. It would go a very long way if even one of them just came out and said "yeah, I have to be better".

At this point though, given how consistently they've avoided taking any sort of accountability for anything, I have to think it's something the organization has tried to push upon them to avoid saying - offer up a word salad without actually answering the question, do your time, get out of the scrum, go enjoy your summer, etc.

 

[Gallagbi]

What does his father have to do with Mitch?

I don't think one exists without the other

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

Their camp was throwing out the Schedule B bonuses nonsense to Kypreos last week - it's not just the permanently sour approach they have, but the fact that they seem to take everything so personally and emotionally, and never ever seem like they move on from it.

You could practically see Marner wearing the animosity

Do the dummies in Marner's camp not realize that none of the management that "Ripped him off" is still here? Like even Shanny is gone. Is it Tannenbaum's fault now?

 

[RuudeDog]

I believe the Leafs get worse without Marner next year. But the mere notion of him feeling disrespected about waiving when he didn't negotiate once throughout the year is beyond ridiculous. They tried to sign him. So very disrespectful. They overpaid him on his 2nd contract after Lou screwed him on the first one based on this team winning in the future. Said it from the day he signed that contract and held out. He was beloved in the city until we all saw he was in it more for himself than trying to build a winning team around him.

I am not a Marner hater and want to see him re-sign. But at this point. Best to move on.

 

[ACC1224]

I believe the Leafs get worse without Marner next year. But the mere notion of him feeling disrespected about waiving when he didn't negotiate once throughout the year is beyond ridiculous. They tried to sign him. So very disrespectful. They overpaid him on his 2nd contract after Lou screwed him on the first one based on this team winning. Said it from the day he signed that contract and held out. He was beloved in the city until we all saw he was in it more for himself than trying to build a winning team around him.

I am not a Marner hater and want to see him re-sign. But at this point. Best to move on.

there is no reason to believe that is true.

 

[ashs]

Been the biggest marner supporter but his camps antics are making me just want it gone.