No...but one can only wonder if they were so unhappy with Mantha...why they didn't pull the trigger on Myers for Mantha and whatever. Particularly as it started to became obvious last year that Larkin was going to be much better than advertised.
Missing the Playoffs would cause a shift in philosophy.
- Thread starter BinCookin
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No...but one can only wonder if they were so unhappy with Mantha...why they didn't pull the trigger on Myers for Mantha and whatever. Particularly as it started to became obvious last year that Larkin was going to be much better than advertised.
Okay (and wasn't trying to jump in or pile on the conversation) just have always wondered this.
Weren't the rumors/discussions at the time that KH did not want to part with Mantha? Which I was fine with until I heard how disappointed they were in him.
InjuredChoker
Registered User
Detroit has #1's from 2005 and 2007 still in their system now, and neither of them have shown much of an NHL pulse. Detroit will give a #1 as long as they possibly can to develop before moving them on.
They gave Wallin 7 years, Kuznetzov 8, Golubovsky 7... even if Mantha just bumbles along Detroit will keep him around for as long as they possibly can. Just in case.
You've literally said this in almost every thread when someone mentions trading for a D.
This was never part of the deal. Larkin was never supposed to be traded for Myers. The rumored offer was Mantha + 1st.
Please stop sprouting the same lies every time this is brought up.
We all get it. You don't like making trades because you enjoy being in the land of mediocrity. Myers is trash, Phaneuf is trash, Buff is trash, Yandle is trash etc etc.
I'm not trading top prospects to bandaid the defense when the team's window to actually compete closed many seasons ago. The deal for Myers absolutely included Larkin but keep telling yourself it didn't.
You keep telling yourself the same.
How about some proof to back up your claim, the only one who keeps making these same claims. Buffalo asked for Mantha and were turned down. Buffalo did not say Larkin or no deal. They were open to trading for Mantha or Tatar in which Detroit said no.
http://www.wingingitinmotown.com/2015/2/6/7978319/red-wings-sabres-trade-rumors-tyler-myers
http://www.rotoworld.com/recent/nhl/4123/anthony-mantha (Per Friedman)
http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/eye-on...ings-have-significant-interest-in-tyler-myers
http://www.mlive.com/redwings/index.ssf/2014/10/ask_ansar_on_the_red_wings_pur.html (Per Khan)
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/HockeyBuzz-Hotstove/Hotstove-Best-Fit-For-Tyler-Myers/187/63095
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=65331 (Per HSJ)
Is there a list with the trades on it that transformed a team from middle of the pack-ish to elite?
Mine is pretty much the Patty Roy trade. Maybe we can add the Hasek trade to Buffalo, if one presumes Buffalo became elite after that.
I suppose my general point is: Trades don't tend to have big/immediate positive impacts on the general direction of a team. Their effects always seem to be more diffuse, sometimes taking years to fully appreciate.
Puck Daddy did a retrospective on the 20 most important NHL trades back in 2011, and the Maltby McGillis deal cracked the list at 20.
InjuredChoker
Registered User
carter and richards trade arguably did that for the kings.
but yeah, those were more of a complimentary pieces. they had doughty (and kopitar) already. wings need to find that too.
but yeah, those were more of a complimentary pieces. they had doughty (and kopitar) already. wings need to find that too.
They had Kopitar (1C), Doughty (1D), and Quick (elite goalie)
We have 2/3 of those things. We should be doing everything we can to snag a 1D... I would have loved for us to trade up in the draft last year to get hanifin or provorov, who would have been easier to get.
We could have traded anyone outside of Larkin and Mrazek... Noone can convince me it wouldn't have been possible.
InjuredChoker
Registered User
i'm not sure if provorov will be #1; i do think hanifin will be. and yeah, we gotta find a way to find one and preferably ASAP. not sure if larkin will develop into kopitar-level (i believe he has good chance) but he'll be a heck of a lot closer to kopitar than anything we have on defense will be to doughty.
BinCookin
Registered User
People make that series seem like NSH was Crap.
That was the year that CHI, STL, NSH, DET were 4 of the 5 best teams in the whole league.
DET was ranked #5 in the league, NSH #4. Ironically 4/5th seeds doesnt state how big a first round series that was thanks to the 3 division things, you had Chi at 6 favored over #3 phx.
WingedWheel1987
Registered User
Nashville suffocated Detroit that series. It was painful to watch.
It was never close.
Nashville just sat back and waited for Detroit to give them free goals.
It was never close.
Nashville just sat back and waited for Detroit to give them free goals.
Chance on Chance
Registered User
If we draft our future #1 he's 4-6 years away from the year we draft him so yes hopefully ASAP
Henkka
Registered User
We should trade for him, so his age and peak matches better with Larkin and Mrazek. But who is ready (and enough stupid) to trade his 22-years old potential Norris defenceman?
I don't believe we are gonna draft that guy. He comes in too late. Juolevi looked promising though at WJC, and I see him as Finnish Lidström, but don't believe he could drop at draft for our pick.
Most probably it's either somebody home-grown who is already in the system (DeKeyser, Marchenko, Ouellet, Russo, Saarijärvi) or UFA.
And from that group everything points to DeKeyser. until proven othervise. He is not perfect 1D, more of 2D, but he is best possible one.
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Calgary. Whenever the question is 'which team is dumb enough to do (whatever)', the answer is always Calgary.
For instance, they have 4 dmen all locked up to multi-years between 4.65-6.75 mil and their team is terrible. Hamilton's playing third pairing for them. Heck, they owe Smid 3 mil next year and he's essentially their Kindl. Never plays, and when he does it's never long.
I don't think they'd move Brodie or Giordano, but I bet they'd move Russell, Wideman or Hamilton. Bet it'd only take Tatar or Nyquist, plus maybe a pick.
Frk It
Mo Seider Less Problems
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Score may not have been lopsided, but ice was tilted heavily in their favor.
We matched up awful against them.
InjuredChoker
Registered User
wouldn't touch russell or wideman.
hamilton, though, i'd be all years. but if they are even somewhat smart, they aren't looking to trade him. it was largely a future move.
I'm asking this honestly... what do the fancy stats show for that series? My old man memory recalls the Wings controlling possession for the vast majority of the series. But their shots were limited to low scoring opportunities and the Preds, on the other hand, seemed to score on Howard on every single good chance.
The Wings that year were a really good team, is my point. Nothing like the hobbled mess that limped into the 2014 playoffs and never controlled a single game.
Frk It
Mo Seider Less Problems
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I remember Rinne standing over our screeners seeing every puck, easily. Their large d corps giving us hell and keeping us on the perimeter. And their overall size and speed advantage beating us to pucks and killing us on the boards.
But I could be wrong.
I don't think we were a bad team that year. I just think that, stylistically, Nashville was the worst possible matchup for the type of team we had at the time.
I still recall the Wings having the puck way more and being the ones on attack. It kind of looked like a kitten running into a bear at times, but the kitten was still the one doing all the offense.
Howard always seemed to let in every good chance and the Preds got a lot of bounces. That's why I don't buy "it was never close." It was stupidly close because the Wings were just being survived by the Preds.
You'll recall the Wings kind of did this, and almost succeeded, against the Hawks. You know, until the Hawks adjusted and figured out how to open up their scoring again, something the Wings never did.
Frk It
Mo Seider Less Problems
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I still recall the Wings having the puck way more and being the ones on attack. It kind of looked like a kitten running into a bear at times, but the kitten was still the one doing all the offense.
Howard always seemed to let in every good chance and the Preds got a lot of bounces. That's why I don't buy "it was never close." It was stupidly close because the Wings were just being survived by the Preds.
You'll recall the Wings kind of did this, and almost succeeded, against the Hawks. You know, until the Hawks adjusted and figured out how to open up their scoring again, something the Wings never did.
Maybe I'm exaggerating, but I remember leaving those games thinking we were just outmatched.
I mean Howard vs Rinne isn't even fair to Jimmy, when Rinne is on his game he is one of the best.
And they had the Suter-Weber pairing at the time, so that's like 30 minutes of going up against an absolute nightmare pairing
Plus I remember Kevin Klein played the series of his life in that one.
We certainly remember that series differently. I remember never remotely being in that series and to me it is Babcock's worst performance of his coaching career. Didn't attempt to adjust whatsoever against Nashville suffocating us offensively throughout the series. Not to mention that comment about Nashville having "7 top 6 forwards." Babcock just seemed to give up on that series before it was over.
