Mike Bossy vs Pavel Bure who's the better goal scorer all time?

[Gorskyontario]

Based on what? Based on the fact Bossy won Stanley Cups and Bure didn't? That's due to the randomness of the draft and the way players are traded and has nothing to do with much else. Wasn't there a possibility that the Habs would get Dionne? Well they didn't and the rest is history. You can make all these different stories about how he didn't want it enough and that's why he didn't win it. You can make similar stories about how Jagr was dependent on Lemieux and how he couldn't lead himself or how McDavid doesn't have the heart but at the end of the day the league is set up in a way where it's randomness that decides whether you win or not.

Based on Bure playing zero defense and giving almost zero effort for more than half of his career.

Yes. Shame! SHAME ON PAVEL BURE for scoring 58 and 59 goals in the heart of the dead puck era!

Did you watch him in those florida years or just with the canucks? He was terrible even with those goal totals.

 

[MadLuke]

Did you watch him in those florida years or just with the canucks? He was terrible even with those goal totals.

Why and how did the Panthers jumped from 30 wins -18 team to a 43 wins +35 playoff teams if he was terrible ?

The only other big change is Jovanovski becoming Spacek and Burke-McLean becoming Vernom-Kidd.

Hart voter did seem to think the franchise turn around was on Bure.

 

[FinLurker]

Why and how did the Panthers jumped from 30 wins -18 team to a 43 wins +35 playoff teams if he was terrible ?

The only other big change is Jovanovski becoming Spacek and Burke-McLean becoming Vernom-Kidd.

Hart voter did seem to think the franchise turn around was on Bure.

How Bure's Florida seasons differ for example Selanne's 1997-98 season when he scored over 50 goals. Next best scorers were Rucchin, Mironov and Young. Arguably better season than Bure's since that team was worse than what Florida had. And by that logic Dennis Maruk and Jacques Richard should be also on the pedestal.

 

[MadLuke]

How Bure's Florida seasons differ for example Selanne's 1997-98 season when he scored over 50 goals.

I am not sure why it would differ ?

You are comparing him to one of the best player ever having one of his best season of his career.... Sure you can have a good season without good result, if your team loose Paul Kariya. A bit like with how much the Panthers got depleted in 2001, Bure regardless of his season would have seen a team success decline.

The point being made here, is that little changed in a good direction for the Panthers outside Bure vs not-Bure and the team jumped by nearly 50% its winning, making it hard for the claim that he was bad at winning hockey game despite his goals scoring, what explain the Panthers turnaround then, just a coincidence ?

And by that logic Dennis Maruk and Jacques Richard should be also on the pedestal.

How so, the caps were a 27 wins team in 1980, when Maruk score 60-136 points in 1982 they became a.... 26 wins team.

I mean -7 on that team was indeed really good, expected for someone achieving to score 76 even strenght points.

 

[jigglysquishy]

One day Denis Maruk is going to come on this forum and wonder why everyone shit talks him.

 

[Gorskyontario]

Why and how did the Panthers jumped from 30 wins -18 team to a 43 wins +35 playoff teams if he was terrible ?

The only other big change is Jovanovski becoming Spacek and Burke-McLean becoming Vernom-Kidd.

Hart voter did seem to think the franchise turn around was on Bure.

Why and how did they go from 43 wins to 20 wins the year after?

 

[MadLuke]

Why and how did they go from 43 wins to 20 wins the year after?

List of players with larges minutes in 2000 that did not had large minutes for the Panthers in 2001, mix of injury-trade often both:

Spacek, their biggest minutes D left.
Kozlov, injury
Withney, injury
Simpsons, injury
Mellanby
Parrish

If you look at that team time on ice by games, a lot of the names of the bottom half will have played 60 or less games that season.

Do you suggest, specially considering Bure was terrible and hurting the team, they went from 30 to 43 wins ? mostly puck luck? Mike Vernom > Burke

 

[sr edler]

Why and how did they go from 43 wins to 20 wins the year after?

Because I don't know, hockey's a team game and the overall team was infinitely worse. But if you watched it closely at the time, you would know more. From the overall character of your posts (exclusively one-sentence posts, which indicates phone use, which indicates someone young) it seems perhaps you didn't catch it up close at the time. But alas, I might be wrong here, perhaps you're an old wise owl, and if that's the case I apologise. But Bure came in cold during the 98–99 season, without training camp and with new teammates, and immediately scored at 1.40 clip, and the team rose briefly from the ashes. There was a memorable game during this stretch where Florida played Colorado, Bure had a hat-trick on Patrick Roy, they were up 5-1 after two rounds, but then he (Bure) stepped on a puck and missed the 3rd period and the Panthers completely collapsed and lost 5-7 after a 6 points by Forsberg. This was the turn-of-the-century Panthers in a nutshell. But yes, even with Bure they were still flawed (obviously).