Mid-season NHL All-Star Teams

[sebsisles]

Bailey Tavares Kucherov

Doughty Klingberg
Vasilevskiy

 

[PB37]

Marchand should be in over Johnny Hockey. Better PPG, better two way forward, and is used in all situations, unlike Gaudreau.

 

[wintersej]

The only argument for Giroux over Marchand is that Giroux has more games played. That is obviously a real factor and have no problem with Giroux winning out as a mid-season exercise. By end of year, that 8 or whatever more games that Giroux played (assuming 100% health for both players) won't really make a difference.

 

[BruinLVGA]

Marchand should be in over Johnny Hockey. Better PPG, better two way forward, and is used in all situations, unlike Gaudreau.

To expand on the ppg thing, he has the 4th best ppg in the NHL (2nd best for wingers...). But of course no mention of him.

 

[wretched34]

So basically Gaudreau played more games since entering the league

Nice try buddy. Hall scored an 80 point season right before you conveniently cut off at he 2014-15 seasons. Hall scores more 5v5, has 493 games compared to Gaudreau’s 273 games and theyre about even in PPG, and Hall drives possession more.

You tried but failed.

Kind of silly to use stats from a time when one of the players you're comparing against wasn't in the league. But okay, we'll play your game.
You want to use Hall's career stats.
In the 7 full seasons he's played, he's broken the 60 point barrier twice. In the 3 full seasons Gaudreau has played, he's broken the 60 point barrier all 3 times.

In Gaudreaus Career he scores at a higher rate even strength than Hall does over his career, and also produces more primary assists than Hall does, which disproves your Hall scores more 5v5 and drives possession more.
Gaudreau's EVG% is 0.77 vs Halls 0.70.

And using Hall's 493 games vs Gaudreau's 273 as some sort of advantage for Hall is strange, seeing as Hall is older, was drafted earlier, and started his career 4 seasons before Gaudreau since he went the College Route.

Should we use it to Hall's advantage that he was a first overall pick as well, or would it be a disadvantage that we're here, comparing a 1st overall pick to a 104th overall?

 

[ConnorMcMullet]

Exactly as it says on the tin. Lot of deserving candidates so far.

Hard to pick in several positions. My Hart voting for example would for sure be in a different order (I would vote Tavares higher for Hart than Stamkos+McDavid... but I think Stamkos has objectively been more 'outstanding' as an individual.)

Here are mine:

AS-1:

Giroux - Stamkos - Kucherov
Hedman - Doughty
Vasilevskiy

AS-2:

Ovechkin - MacKinnon - Kane
Pietrangelo - Klingberg
Crawford

AS-3:
Gaudreau - McDavid - Tarasenko
Josi - Subban
Quick

Interested to see others picks.

Ovechkin is in the central know?

 

[Gerard]

Kind of silly to use stats from a time when one of the players you're comparing against wasn't in the league. But okay, we'll play your game.
You want to use Hall's career stats.
In the 7 full seasons he's played, he's broken the 60 point barrier twice. In the 3 full seasons Gaudreau has played, he's broken the 60 point barrier all 3 times.

In Gaudreaus Career he scores at a higher rate even strength than Hall does over his career, and also produces more primary assists than Hall does, which disproves your Hall scores more 5v5 and drives possession more.
Gaudreau's EVG% is 0.77 vs Halls 0.70.

And using Hall's 493 games vs Gaudreau's 273 as some sort of advantage for Hall is strange, seeing as Hall is older, was drafted earlier, and started his career 4 seasons before Gaudreau since he went the College Route.

Should we use it to Hall's advantage that he was a first overall pick as well, or would it be a disadvantage that we're here, comparing a 1st overall pick to a 104th overall?

Your even strength stats are wrong, Ill leave you to go find some credible ones.

And if you read my post correctly, Hall has way more games and their PPG is almost even with each other. What, that somehow works towards Gaudreau's favor? Yeah no it doesnt.

Gaudreau is not better than Hall, it is fine to admit. Hall has done more with less.

 

[Appleyard]

Ovechkin is in the central know?

This is for NHL All-Star Teams, not the All-Star game.

I.E. the ones voted on by the PHWA at the end of the season. For example last season: 2016-17 NHL Awards Voting | Hockey-Reference.com

 

[DFF]

Your even strength stats are wrong, Ill leave you to go find some credible ones.

And if you read my post correctly, Hall has way more games and their PPG is almost even with each other. What, that somehow works towards Gaudreau's favor? Yeah no it doesnt.

Gaudreau is not better than Hall, it is fine to admit. Hall has done more with less.

How has Hall done more? He never made the playoff. He was a total failure in Edmonton with all the high draft picks.

You started with Hall scored more which is a total lie now you come it with this done more with less bullshit.

 

[Gerard]

How has Hall done more? He never made the playoff. He was a total failure in Edmonton with all the high draft picks.

You started with Hall scored more which is a total lie now you come it with this done more with less bull****.

When Gaudreau hits 80 and puts up near PPG for another 3 seasons he can be talked about with Hall

 

[Duffalufagus]

Your even strength stats are wrong, Ill leave you to go find some credible ones.

And if you read my post correctly, Hall has way more games and their PPG is almost even with each other. What, that somehow works towards Gaudreau's favor? Yeah no it doesnt.

Gaudreau is not better than Hall, it is fine to admit. Hall has done more with less.

You prefer Hall. That is fine. But to suggest that you’ve won the argument on the basis on the metrics just doesn’t hold water. To suggest it’s not even debatable just discredits you entirely.

Hall is a great player. I’d be willing to bet a lot of money that a plurality of GM’s in the league would not trade Gaudreau straight across for Hall.

 

[DFF]

When Gaudreau hits 80 and puts up near PPG for another 3 seasons he can be talked about with Hall

Huh? He doesnt need to do that. He has already scored better than Hall every year since he entered the league.

I am beginning to wonder if you know how to read basic stats

 

[Gerard]

Huh? He doesnt need to do that. He has already scored better than Hall every year since he entered the league.

I am beginning to wonder if you know how to read basic stats

80 > anything Gaudreau has put up in a season

Hall has done it much longer too.

Gaudreau isnt as good as Hall.

 

[M88K]

80 > anything Gaudreau has put up in a season

Hall has done it much longer too.

Gaudreau isnt as good as Hall.

Come on now, you've got to be kidding right?

1 season which based on Halls entire, career is a outlier , makes him better?

The fact that you have to cherry pick one year that Hall actually out produced Gaudreau (before he was even in the NHL) should be a big indication that you're way off base.
But for basis, let me remind you of Jonathan Cheechoo the 56 goal scoring 93 point producing nothing of a player.. Who by your own weird admission is better than both Hall and Gaudreau because 93>80 Right?

Guadreau has out produced Hall in every year he's been in the league
198 for Hall in 246games (.8ppg pace)
249 for Gaudreau in 272games (.91ppg pace)

That is a big discrepancy.

Guadreau is every bit as good as hall. In fact, based on the numbers Gaudreau is better. Neither is going to wow you in the defensive zone. So Technically speaking, you'd want the younger and better Gaudreau than Hall, in the offensive zone

As Far as Even Strength goes
Hall Averages 2.7 p per 60 ev this year
1.9 '16
2.4 '15
2.1 '14


Gaudreau 2.7 '17
2.5 '16
2.7 '15
2.2 '14

So yes, Gaudreau outscores him at Even strength as well.

Other than your arbitrary 80> everything all your "facts" are wrong

 

[Gerard]

Come on now, you've got to be kidding right?

1 season which based on Halls entire, career is a outlier , makes him better?

The fact that you have to cherry pick one year that Hall actually out produced Gaudreau (before he was even in the NHL) should be a big indication that you're way off base.
But for basis, let me remind you of Jonathan Cheechoo the 56 goal scoring 93 point producing nothing of a player.. Who by your own weird admission is better than both Hall and Gaudreau because 93>80 Right?

Guadreau has out produced Hall in every year he's been in the league
198 for Hall in 246games (.8ppg pace)
249 for Gaudreau in 272games (.91ppg pace)

That is a big discrepancy.

Guadreau is every bit as good as hall. In fact, based on the numbers Gaudreau is better. Neither is going to wow you in the defensive zone. So Technically speaking, you'd want the younger and better Gaudreau than Hall, in the offensive zone

As Far as Even Strength goes
Hall Averages 2.7 p per 60 ev this year
1.9 '16
2.4 '15
2.1 '14


Gaudreau 2.7 '17
2.5 '16
2.7 '15
2.2 '14

So yes, Gaudreau outscores him at Even strength as well.

Other than your arbitrary 80> everything all your "facts" are wrong

Its almost like if Hall’s teams made the playoffs he would probably have scored more than when they dont.

Hall will outscore him this year and for a while now since he has Hischier like Gaudreau has Monahan

 

[M88K]

Its almost like if Hall’s teams made the playoffs he would probably have scored more than when they dont.

Hall will outscore him this year and for a while now since he has Hischier like Gaudreau has Monahan

He will huh? He hasn't so far, but there is plenty of time so maybe he actually does for the first time since Gaudreau has joined the league.
You have tons of ready made excuses and not a single supported argument for your claim.
obviously you have your bias.
Hall played with the likes of Jordan Eberle, Draisaitl, He even had McDavid for half a season in 15-16 with Edm. McDavid being a much better player than Monahan, plus the other offensive talent that was around him. and still couldn't surpass Guadreau but now.. 26p Hischier is there to "carry" Hall.

You can have your unfounded, nonfactual bias opinion, everybody has one of two of them, but when you have nothing but your opinion to support said argument, maybe you shouldn't try to to make bold claims likes

"Hall is better than Gaudreau. There is not one shred of evidence to prove otherwise"

when quite literally all of the available evidence says the exact opposite of that clearly nonsensical opinion

 

[ConnorMcMullet]

Is this even a debate? Coming from an Oilers fan who absolutely HATES gaudreau and the flames, johnny is clearly the better player. He's put up more points ever since entering the league without much talent around him, and at times carried his entire team.

 

[HugginThePost]

A lot of "troll feeding" going on here.

The guy is clearly trying to get a rise out of everyone.......what other explanation can there be?