NCAA: Michigan spying scandal / Harbaugh accepts remaining suspension

[LT]

The response to this by pretty much every football coach who's talked on it should tell you everything you need to know.

None of them seem to give a shit.

 

[John Price]

 

[John Price]

 

[Troy McClure]

I see we're switching the defense from "fake news, we didn't do it" to "yeah, we did it, but everybody does it."

 

[GKJ]

I see we're switching the defense from "fake news, we didn't do it" to "yeah, we did it, but everybody does it."

Usually there is discourse about who did and didn’t know.

 

[End of Line]

Big Ten informs Michigan discipline is a possibility

The Big Ten has formally notified Michigan that it could be facing disciplinary action from the league, a step required by the league's bylaws in the event it becomes clear that a school might face punishment.

www.espn.com

 

[Ben Grimm]

The Big Ten Should Resist Mob Pressure on Michigan - Sports Illustrated

Rivals want the conference to move quickly, but it must complete its investigation.

www.si.com

Rivals Decoded Michigan’s Signals—and Shared Them With Another Big Ten Team - Sports Illustrated

Documents, obtained by SI, list breakdowns of Michigan’s signals. They were shared last season with a Big Ten school set to face the Wolverines.

www.si.com

People who think MI should not get due process after the CFP is over are a joke.

 

[izlez]

The Big Ten Should Resist Mob Pressure on Michigan - Sports Illustrated

Rivals want the conference to move quickly, but it must complete its investigation.

www.si.com

Rivals Decoded Michigan’s Signals—and Shared Them With Another Big Ten Team - Sports Illustrated

Documents, obtained by SI, list breakdowns of Michigan’s signals. They were shared last season with a Big Ten school set to face the Wolverines.

www.si.com

People who think MI should not get due process after the CFP is over are a joke.

Why after?

 

[John Price]

I see we're switching the defense from "fake news, we didn't do it" to "yeah, we did it, but everybody does it."

Report: NCAA Findings Don't Link Michigan's Jim Harbaugh to Sign-Stealing Allegations

Michigan head coach Jim Harbaugh is not being implicated by the NCAA in the alleged sign-stealing scandal at Michigan. According to Ross Dellenger and Dan…

bleacherreport.com

NO WRONGDOING!

 

[John Price]

let's be clear

harbaugh is a jagoff
harbaugh is abrasive
harbaugh is also a winner and astute football mind. after nearly getting canned covid year he looked at the way he was coaching and revamped it big time. "he stole signals". no, his success is more attributed to biff poggi who left for charlotte. and they're still kicking ass without biff.

Are the scandals concerning? yes. the underage girl controversy is bad. hiring schembecler's son with "radical" political tweets is bad. having the OC around and then finding out he did nasty shit is bad. It's been a bad offseason.

But everyone jumped to conclusions before the NCAA could even conduct an investigation. You had anonymous coaches crying about the scandal, even though everyone else was doing it. And there was next to no benefit. "BUTZZZ WHY DID THEYZ DO IT IF THERE WAS NO ADVANTAGE?" Who cares. The AP article now says that other teams KNEW Michigan's signals and colluded to share them.

Whole mess of worms here.

 

[Troy McClure]

Report: NCAA Findings Don't Link Michigan's Jim Harbaugh to Sign-Stealing Allegations

Michigan head coach Jim Harbaugh is not being implicated by the NCAA in the alleged sign-stealing scandal at Michigan. According to Ross Dellenger and Dan…

bleacherreport.com

NO WRONGDOING!

"No wrongdoing"

What are two words not appearing in the article you linked?

 

[John Price]

Big Ten teams have been clamoring for the hammer to fall down on Michigan, and a resolution is expected by midweek. However, don't expect any serious punishment as Michigan's lawyers will come down with fire and fury, like you've never seen, if anyone higher up is forced to relinquish their positions.

The investigation has barely begun and message board idiots are already clamoring for "justice". Let due process play out!

 

[stats1]

How can you punish Michigan with a sledgehammer like the rest of the B10 schools want when you literally have them all colluding together and sharing Michigan’s signs. These teams KNEW Michigan’s signs and then bitched and cried to the NCAA that it was happening to them. I don’t think much is going to come from this like most on here assume

And whatever comes down as a punishment expect lawyers for the university to immediately appeal it. Due process has to happen

 

[izlez]

let's be clear

harbaugh is a jagoff
harbaugh is abrasive
harbaugh is also a winner and astute football mind. after nearly getting canned covid year he looked at the way he was coaching and revamped it big time. "he stole signals". no, his success is more attributed to biff poggi who left for charlotte. and they're still kicking ass without biff.

Are the scandals concerning? yes. the underage girl controversy is bad. hiring schembecler's son with "radical" political tweets is bad. having the OC around and then finding out he did nasty shit is bad. It's been a bad offseason.

But everyone jumped to conclusions before the NCAA could even conduct an investigation. You had anonymous coaches crying about the scandal, even though everyone else was doing it. And there was next to no benefit. "BUTZZZ WHY DID THEYZ DO IT IF THERE WAS NO ADVANTAGE?" Who cares. The AP article now says that other teams KNEW Michigan's signals and colluded to share them.

Whole mess of worms here.

Stallions still stole signals. Stallions was still in contact with coaches during games.

Michigan still cheated.

If other teams also cheated, they should also be punished

 

[stats1]

Stallions still stole signals. Stallions was still in contact with coaches during games.

Michigan still cheated.

If other teams also cheated, they should also be punished

Or ALL schools do this to certain degrees. Ok so all B10 teams or most B10 teams should be investigated and punished. That sure would take a long time. Then go try the SEC/ACC etc… you don’t think Georgia or Alabama cheat? Georgia’s won 26 straight and have like 2 losses in the last 4 years. Yet they’re clean? I doubt it.

 

[izlez]

Or ALL schools do this to certain degrees. Ok so all B10 teams or most B10 teams should be investigated and punished. That sure would take a long time. Then go try the SEC/ACC etc… you don’t think Georgia or Alabama cheat? Georgia’s won 26 straight and have like 2 losses in the last 4 years. Yet they’re clean? I doubt it.

Fantastic. If we have evidence of anyone cheating, they should be punished. Severely.

 

[GKJ]

Reality if they can’t/won’t punish everyone, and Michigan may be just the ones who got caught.

 

[Unholy Diver]

Or ALL schools do this to certain degrees. Ok so all B10 teams or most B10 teams should be investigated and punished. That sure would take a long time. Then go try the SEC/ACC etc… you don’t think Georgia or Alabama cheat? Georgia’s won 26 straight and have like 2 losses in the last 4 years. Yet they’re clean? I doubt it.

Stealing signals is not illegal

The issue at hand is that in-person scouting is illegal, no matter if they are stealing signals or just having a guy watch and see that they usually run to the left from the shotgun when #82 is on the field as an extra TE

Everyone is getting caught up in the stolen signals, and while that is part of it due to them video taping stuff which I believe is illegal, the issue is the in-person pre-game scouting


From the Washington Post article

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2023/10/26/michigan-sign-stealing-scandal/

The NCAA does not specifically prohibit sign-stealing, but off-campus, in-person scouting of future opponents is prohibited by NCAA Bylaw 11.6.1, which was enacted in 1994 as a cost-cutting measure designed to promote equity between well-funded programs and those with fewer resources.

 

[Troy McClure]

Reality if they can’t/won’t punish everyone, and Michigan may be just the ones who got caught.

Which is how sports generally deals with these things. SMU didn't get the death penalty because they were the only school paying players. SMU was just doing it the most brazenly and was used to send a message to others. When the Saints got caught paying bounties for concussing opponents, they weren't the only team doing it, but they were the one that became the face of the problem.

 

[Herby]

I don't want to say to much on this because someone close to me works in the AD, but this story is going to get pretty wild here in the next little bit, basically once the B10 suspension happens and then the subsequent injunction is filed. There was a bit of MAD thinking for years in college sports, as many teams have skeletons in their closets for a variety of things. But now that the first ICBM has been launched, there will be some airing of this stuff over the next little while.

I wouldn't say its likely or even 50/50 that Michigan considers legal avenues to leave the B10, but there has definitely been some important people at UM who want to seriously consider going down this path if Pettiti keeps his stance. Whether it's a reality or a bluff to get Fox involved, I don't know but you can't understate how damaging it is for a conference and one of it's two alpha members to end up in court during the football season. Fox is paying huge money for B10 TV rights and a huge chunk of that is because of one game. Only NFL games draw better as far as sports, the game even trounces the NBA finals in viewership. If Michigan were to leave the B10, Fox would be able to renegotiate a lower deal, which would take money out of everyones pocket.

Michigan would be welcomed with open arms to the SEC, right as the B10 is about to enter a level where they are equal or close to equal with the SEC this would be damaging for the B10. I personally think the ACC would make the most sense for a variety of reasons, and since college FB is now all about who has the most playoff caliber teams, that would put the ACC at a similar level to the B10 with Michigan joining Clemson, FSU, Miami and potentially Notre Dame as teams who could reasonably expect to contend for a playoff spot any given year.

I also just don't understand the angle from one particular program to be the one to bring this to light and then be the one most vocal about punishment. Not only will that program be the one that is damaged most in the subsequent retaliatory releases, but they also risk losing their most important rival both financially and emotionally. Both programs would suffer if the rivalry ceased to exist. Very strange.

 

[John Price]

 

[GKJ]

I don't want to say to much on this because someone close to me works in the AD, but this story is going to get pretty wild here in the next little bit, basically once the B10 suspension happens and then the subsequent injunction is filed. There was a bit of MAD thinking for years in college sports, as many teams have skeletons in their closets for a variety of things. But now that the first ICBM has been launched, there will be some airing of this stuff over the next little while.

I wouldn't say its likely or even 50/50 that Michigan considers legal avenues to leave the B10, but there has definitely been some important people at UM who want to seriously consider going down this path if Pettiti keeps his stance. Whether it's a reality or a bluff to get Fox involved, I don't know but you can't understate how damaging it is for a conference and one of it's two alpha members to end up in court during the football season. Fox is paying huge money for B10 TV rights and a huge chunk of that is because of one game. Only NFL games draw better as far as sports, the game even trounces the NBA finals in viewership. If Michigan were to leave the B10, Fox would be able to renegotiate a lower deal, which would take money out of everyones pocket.

Michigan would be welcomed with open arms to the SEC, right as the B10 is about to enter a level where they are equal or close to equal with the SEC this would be damaging for the B10. I personally think the ACC would make the most sense for a variety of reasons, and since college FB is now all about who has the most playoff caliber teams, that would put the ACC at a similar level to the B10 with Michigan joining Clemson, FSU, Miami and potentially Notre Dame as teams who could reasonably expect to contend for a playoff spot any given year.

I also just don't understand the angle from one particular program to be the one to bring this to light and then be the one most vocal about punishment. Not only will that program be the one that is damaged most in the subsequent retaliatory releases, but they also risk losing their most important rival both financially and emotionally. Both programs would suffer if the rivalry ceased to exist. Very strange.

Probably because they once had it happen to them for things they saw as frivolous, which eventually cost them their head coach.

I can't see any actual penalties coming to Michigan for this season, though.

 

[End of Line]

This whole thing has turned into a damn circus

 

[Tony Romo]

I say you just ban the big 10 from the playoffs and let Texas in, imo.

 

[Herby]

Probably because they once had it happen to them for things they saw as frivolous, which eventually cost them their head coach.

I can't see any actual penalties coming to Michigan for this season, though.

I agree the tattoo stuff was ridiculous and the punishment didn't warrant the crime, especially with what was going on at the time in the SEC.

But why would that make Ryan Day be so active in pushing these accusations and severe punishment? He was not at OSU when it happened, and I don't think there is a single person involved in the UM football program who was employed then, and (correct me if I'm wrong) but I don't believe UM was ever involved in ratting out OSU when that happened.

Mandel said it best in his article today on The Athletic, the B10 risks now being turned into what the SEC was 15-20 years ago when everyone was on probation because everyone kept reporting other schools and accusing other schools of cheating. MAD worked out perfectly in the Cold War, and it worked out well in the B10 for awhile, but now that the bombs have been deployed there is no turning back. I hate that UM has to go down this path and air peoples dirty laundry. Maybe I am biased, but IMO the B10 has given them no choice with the actions being taken in response to this and the lack of action taken with other things, either lay the hammer down on everyone or slap everyone on the wrist.

And just the smug "our **** don't stink" attitude from other members of the conference. Quotes like "we are worried about the safety of the players" when the news broke, we now find out Rutgers and OSU (the likely culprits) are sharing Michigan's signs with Purdue before the B10 championship game, yeah they really care about the safety of the players.

This could have been resolved with a simple phone call demanding that Stallions be fired and UM being given some kind of minor penalty, and upon being told by UM that "others are doing it to us" a statement released from B10 headquarters warning teams to cease any activity that involves stealing and/or sharing other teams signs and any future actions will result in more serious penalties. This has been totally inept leadership from Petitti, one that could have serious ramifications with the conference's reputation as well as the TV payouts from Fox.

Just absolutely comical that this is going to end up in the courts.