Value of: Michael Bunting

[Marmoset]

I haven't seen this mentioned in the Toronto media and I find that surprising.

I believe the Leafs would be best suited to trade him a year ahead of his UFA status and start to replenish some of the team's spent assets as they'll need them to shed the salary they'll need to this summer to improve the team's payroll structure and team depth.

His value will never be higher than it is now, scoring 63 points as a first year player. I just don't see the Leafs likely to be able to re-sign him to the deal he'd be expected to get in 23/24 considering he's probably looking at a deal in the $5-6m range based on his production.

So my question is what the Leafs think they should receive for this player as a rental. And which teams would find significant value in Bunting, who seems to be a very affordable complimentary scoring forward, making just $925,000 next season.

Did you see some of the guys the Leafs have tried in that spot over the past couple of years? It's not as simple as just plugging another guy on the line with Matthews and Marner. Not everyone can play effectively with them, even talented players.

They have definitely let too many players head to UFA for no return over the years. However, this is not the time to make these types of moves. It's hard to believe but it's only two years until Matthews is UFA, and three years for most of the remaining core. They are in win-now mode. Shanahan, Dubas, they are likely not overly concerned about replenishing the system because they know if they don't win very soon they will be out the door.

Is summary: Yes, trading Bunting would help to replenish assets, but having the best possible team right now is more important.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Who's played in Michael Bunting's spot in the past? It's important to remember that this guy was a shot-in-the-dark UFA signing with no track record. The two guys next to him are Auston Matthews and Mitch Marner.

Teams that want to win need to identify the parts of their roster that need to improve. And sometimes to improve those areas, they may need to make sacrifices.

Bunting had a pretty productive half season the year prior in Arizona. People knew who he was and that he was going to get a chance to score some goals somewhere in the league. His sample size was small, but he wasn't an unknown. I don't see anyone out there who could obviously replace his production with such a small cap hit as a free agent.

The Leafs do need to improve. They need to improve their team next year, not their team 3 or 4 years from now. They don't get better by moving Bunting though, as they will have to spend more to replace what he can bring. If the Leafs need to make some shake-ups, Bunting likely isn't the right guy to move out to do so.

 

[belair]

I'm not really suggesting they trade Matthews, Marner or Nylander either.

I'm suggesting that Leafs have a very large task in front of them this summer that will require them to add both cap space and trade capital.

Regardless of who they trade, I believe Toronto will have to make it worthwhile for other teams to help them accomplish that.

 

[TGWL]

Teams that just want to maximize profits by selling at highs don't go anywhere. Ok, maybe they do, I don't really have the stats, but it sounds really dumb.

 

[belair]

Bunting had a pretty productive half season the year prior in Arizona. People knew who he was and that he was going to get a chance to score some goals somewhere in the league. His sample size was small, but he wasn't an unknown. I don't see anyone out there who could obviously replace his production with such a small cap hit as a free agent.

The Leafs do need to improve. They need to improve their team next year, not their team 3 or 4 years from now. They don't get better by moving Bunting though, as they will have to spend more to replace what he can bring. If the Leafs need to make some shake-ups, Bunting likely isn't the right guy to move out to do so.

They need to do both.

If they continue to shed talent year after year like they have, they'll get to a point where they can't sustain that competitive product.

Of all areas their roster needs for them to be a highly competitive team, their scoring winger is pretty low on the list.

If anything, that spot on their roster would be a carrot for a higher end offensive player looking for an opportunity to zoom their stats. I don't see quality guys willing to take sweetheart deals to fill their bottom six.

 

[ManofSteel55]

They need to do both.

If they continue to shed talent year after year like they have, they'll get to a point where they can't sustain that competitive product.

Of all areas their roster needs for them to be a highly competitive team, their scoring winger is pretty low on the list.

If anything, that spot on their roster would be a carrot for a higher end offensive player looking for an opportunity to zoom their stats. I don't see quality guys willing to take sweetheart deals to fill their bottom six.

You're right that they need to have a decent pipeline of talents so they don't hit the downward cycle that ends with them looking for the next Matthews. But that's not how GM's tend to think when they are close to being a contender. They want the last piece or two that will put them over the top. Teams that are contending won't trade players like Bunting for futures. You're more likely to see them trade off a key piece to shake up the dressing room a bit IMO.

The problem with your last statement is that the Leafs can't afford to dangle the carrot for an opportunity to zoom their stats. Not for a decent player anyway, but I can't imagine they will want a reclamation project there when they already have a good player there.

 

[Asymmetric Solution]

Anders Bjork + Cody Eakins rights for Bunting

 

[seabass45]

Keep trying to think of a trade that might work for the Leafs and coming up empty. I don’t think anyone is trading a first for him or something equivalent. It just isn’t worth trading him for a second or something, let things play out and if he earns a big deal elsewhere then so be it.

 

[belair]

Did you see some of the guys the Leafs have tried in that spot over the past couple of years? It's not as simple as just plugging another guy on the line with Matthews and Marner. Not everyone can play effectively with them, even talented players.

They have definitely let too many players head to UFA for no return over the years. However, this is not the time to make these types of moves. It's hard to believe but it's only two years until Matthews is UFA, and three years for most of the remaining core. They are in win-now mode. Shanahan, Dubas, they are likely not overly concerned about replenishing the system because they know if they don't win very soon they will be out the door.

Is summary: Yes, trading Bunting would help to replenish assets, but having the best possible team right now is more important.

If you're going to convince Auston Matthews to re-sign there long-term, you need to show him that there's a plan to build something larger than what they've built so far. The Leafs cannot continue to maintain the status quo.

As a fan of the Oilers, I see where you're coming from when it comes to finding fits for players who thrive when playing with elite talent. It was difficult to find wingers for McDavid. But large scale, it was never the thing that held the team back.

It's a lot easier to find a player or two who compliment the two elite players who are going to drive your 5v5 offense than it will be to find an impactful two-way third line center or a 20-minute a night second pairing defenseman. Particularly at low cost.

Any deviation from what the Leafs have built so far requires a much larger discussion in terms of direction. And a trade like this isn't about what they're doing next season. It's about giving them the necessary tools to improve that direction beyond next season.

If you're making those plans based on the primary assumption Kyle Dubas and Brendan Shanahan are trying to save their bacon, you really have to question whether that's the best course for the franchise.

 

[WingsMJN2965]

Know what's a really kick ass idea?

A cap strapped team like Toronto trading a 60 point forward that makes $900K next season.

 

[SML2]

I don't see how any team looking at Bunting doesn't come to the conclusion that his production is a result of playing with top flight linemates. Why would I give you anything for him if I cannot already replicate that scenario for him to succeed in, and if I have that scenario, why can't I just find my own guy? Why would I give you anything?

 

[belair]

Their plan to "clear the misspent cap" is to trade away maybe the most cost-effective scorer on the roster?

Why don't the Leafs just attach picks / prospects to the "misspent" contracts to bribe a team like Seattle to take them?

Giordano is gone after this year. There's your money to pay Bunting.

They've been spending picks and prospects for rentals and salary dumps for close to half a decade. That's how long they've been 'going for it'. In all likelihood, the tap is close to being run dry, particularly from a trade value standpoint.

As it stands they may not even have the cap to bring back guys like Mikheyev, Engvall or Kase, who all provided valuable depth offense thoroughly the regular season when their elites weren't on the ice for the most part.

The prospect of them shedding cap beyond Mrazek would require them to part with players like Kerfoot, Holl or Muzzin, should he choose to waive. Those are players who all carry significant responsibility on their roster and would take a significant chunk of salary to replace. So it's difficult to see how the roster depth improves from within without a pretty significant piece being dangled.

 

[Mrfenn92]

Would be silly to move him

 

[Hoglander]

Matthews/Marner/Tavares are all being paid like guys who should be carrying their own line. Put them together for PP or when down late, and separate them at 5v5. Keep Bunting, add some cheaper players that maybe just need an opportunity. Tavares is untradeable, so Nylander should be moved to make cap space for a better goalie. Left over cap to address the D as necessary. Whether these complimentary players are signed/traded for/promoted from within, they should be cost effective. Let the big money guys earn their pay:

Bunting/Matthews/ compimentary player(CP) - line 1
CP/Kerfoot/Marner - line 2
CP/ Tavares/ CP - line 3

Imo

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Toronto's been 'going for it' each and every year they've had the core. And they'll be 'going for it' regardless of whether Michael Bunting is a Maple Leaf.

The fact of the matter is Toronto is going to need assets to sustain their competitive roster beyond next season and ultimately clear the misspent cap from their payroll.

Bunting, while a valuable piece for them, is a highly tradeable asset, but is also very replaceable in terms of the role he fills there. And if it doesn't happen now, it will next off-season. He's their rental as an impending UFA.

And the way you fix misspent payroll? Trade the guy that makes a stick of gum.

 

[Marmoset]

If you're going to convince Auston Matthews to re-sign there long-term, you need to show him that there's a plan to build something larger than what they've built so far. The Leafs cannot continue to maintain the status quo.

As a fan of the Oilers, I see where you're coming from when it comes to finding fits for players who thrive when playing with elite talent. It was difficult to find wingers for McDavid. But large scale, it was never the thing that held the team back.

It's a lot easier to find a player or two who compliment the two elite players who are going to drive your 5v5 offense than it will be to find an impactful two-way third line center or a 20-minute a night second pairing defenseman. Particularly at low cost.

Any deviation from what the Leafs have built so far requires a much larger discussion in terms of direction. And a trade like this isn't about what they're doing next season. It's about giving them the necessary tools to improve that direction beyond next season.

If you're making those plans based on the primary assumption Kyle Dubas and Brendan Shanahan are trying to save their bacon, you really have to question whether that's the best course for the franchise.

Re: Convincing Auston Matthews to re-sign: I think that will come down the success of the team and whether he's happy in Toronto. Success of the team is slightly different from status quo because some people believe the current core can be successful with minor changes. Like you I'm skeptical about that.

Re: Deviating from what they've built. I agree with the first part. Regarding beyond next season, see my next response ...

Re: Dubas/Shanahan: I agree. However, it's reality - people don't want to lose their jobs. I'm not a fan of the Dubas regime. They've managed the cap poorly and traded too many draft picks and prospects, and they have exhibited some beliefs in team building and drafting which I do not agree with. However, if Dubas (and possibly Shanahan) are going to remain in charge, which is very likely for now, then you are going for it NOW and not worrying much about later. Going back to the start of your response, if the team doesn't win imminently there is a chance Matthews (and possibly other core players) won't choose to re-sign. Bunting likely helps them win next season much more than whatever return he brings. Basically, the 'beyond next year' doesn't matter much. If they don't win next season, massive changes are coming which will dwarf anything to do with Bunting, both on and off the ice.

 

[Ciao]

Trading Bunting is just a really bad idea. It makes no sense at all.

That's my opinion on the matter.

 

[broc]

This guy is the Chris Kunitz of Toronto. He’s producing well bc of who he’s playing with (ala Kunitz with Pittsburgh).

anywhere else he’s like Connor Brown- capable with a few flashes here and there, but ultimately nothing to get overly excited about or pay a mint on.

also, like other guy said- leafs are competing now and he’s proven he can hang with the boys and produce so why upset that when the window is now for Toronto..

 

[Cap'n Flavour]

I think the Leafs should just sign a dozen-odd UFAs, trade them all for second round picks, and draft a powerhouse. Also they can trade every player they have for another, marginally better player, until they have a team full of superstars.

Source: I played lots of NHL 2003 and 2004.

 

[im gangster]

This is silly. Toronto is trying to win now.

Getting a 2nd round pick or less for a guy who did well in the top 6 and makes sub 1m doesn't make sense.

Are they really though? They never change anything material despite half a decade of the exact same result.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

I think the Leafs should just sign a dozen-odd UFAs, trade them all for second round picks, and draft a powerhouse. Also they can trade every player they have for another, marginally better player, until they have a team full of superstars.

Source: I played lots of NHL 2003 and 2004.

But first you have to trade all of your 4th-7th round picks for everyone elses 4th-7th round picks to earn multiple additional phones and resolve your rivalries around the league.