Player Discussion McDavid

[Drivesaitl]

If he doesn't have surgery this upcoming offseason I will be baffled. Something just doesn't seem right.

I'm not convinced its something appreciable. McD starts many games like he's shot out of a cannon. Trouble is he's trying the same stuff every night still trying to blow doors off D and entire teams instead of playing a more cerebral game. Its almost to me like he's a bit burned out presently and could use some rest from the game and responsibilities. I think he's mentally tired, somewhat stressed, and thus getting sick all the time. Guy needs a holiday jmo, and doesn't really know how to have one. He's type A personality all the way. Its one thing that makes him great but makes it hard for him to take a breather as well. Put me in the camp that said McD should've been told to take a couple games off. Its a lot of hockey he's played this year and last couple years.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I considered that...but like I said, it is also about HER image and brand. I wouldn't let my career choices negatively impact my wife's own endeavours or goals...nor would I "let" her (knowing full well it would be 100% her choice regardless) go into something knowing full well my choices could jeopardize that. Thus, our choices would be made collaboratively and that is why I have no doubt he will sign her. Of course, I could be wrong too. Have no idea about how they manage their relationship.

But let's face it...Edmonton loves its stars...until they don't.

Its unwritten that hockey wifes defer to their pro players career and job prospects. Especially when talking about a superstar or highest earner in hockey world. I agree with @brentashton that the restaurant doesn't really mean much about stay or go. Afairc its a rental and she can easily move on. The place was retrofitted by a third party, the owner and if this one gets scrubbed the owner will just rent it out to another startup. I'm not sure how much skin she has in the game. As well her design career didn't really take off. Seems like McD is just granting her these plaything jobs as he should. Her biggest contract in interior design was their own home. I dunno.

Doesn't it seem like the resolution of how this season plays out will influence stay or go in anycase? The 4Nations was somewhat good in that McD got to win something. Somewhat bad that he had to hang out with a team that had all mostly won Stanley Cup(s). That must burn him.

 

[Evil__Homer]

People get defensive when we say he has regressed a bit, but even in last years playoffs if my memory serves me right he didn't look good at the start? How many 5 on 5 points did he get away from the PP and away from Drai?

Anyways he has clearly taken a step back and now we wonder if it's a career long thing or a 2 year blip. I'm starting to think this guy won't win a cup in Edmonton which is sad.

This... "I'm starting to think this guy won't win a cup in Edmonton which is sad."

I wonder if he will resign or just say no thanks and find a team that he can win a cup with.

 

[TB12]

This... "I'm starting to think this guy won't win a cup in Edmonton which is sad."

I wonder if he will resign or just say no thanks and find a team that he can win a cup with.

Who da fuq is this guy?

 

[Whoshattenkirkshoes]

So far after 2 periods Mcdavid looks much better. Hopefully he can keep it up and it's not a "1 off"

Very promising sign come playoffs

 

[BlackDogg]

Who da fuq is this guy?

I don't know but he's evil

 

[WEMCHUD]

Not too sure if it's been mentioned but maybe Connor being on the road since the 4nations would be an explanation for his recent struggles.

 

[Niten Ichi Ryu]

Link:
Jason Demers on McDavid's play

Is Jason right?

 

[unicornBLOOD]

McDavid's struggles this year...

At first I thought it was because of the tough, game 7 loss. then, I thought, maybe he's just pacing himself, and he'll ramp up for playoffs. now, I'm thinking he's sick and/or injured. Maybe it's a combination of some of them or all of them, or it's none of them. One thing is for sure, this is the worst McDavid has looked since he's been an Oiler. Something is not right about him and his game, this is not even a shadow of what McDavid can actually be.

 

[independent observer]

McDavid is not shooting the puck enough… there are way too many games he has betw 0 and 2 attempts on goal. That is just not enough considering that he is gifted in putting pucks in the net.

why his play is below the very high standard he set in the past is anyones guess. Some say he may be injured or something has been nagging him since last season etc. if really something would be nagging him i don‘t understand why he didn‘t fix in the summer.

in my view he mishandles pucks more than in the past and he is using his speed less than in the past. I do also think his top gear is missing since last season. It is also weird that he regressed so much at the dot this year.

Apart from Draisaitl,
Hyman, McDavid and Bouchard are not playing the way we are used to…

Not sure how to fix it, but once again, I think a lot is mental with this team…

 

[Whoshattenkirkshoes]

McDavid's struggles this year...

At first I thought it was because of the tough, game 7 loss. then, I thought, maybe he's just pacing himself, and he'll ramp up for playoffs. now, I'm thinking he's sick and/or injured. Maybe it's a combination of some of them or all of them, or it's none of them. One thing is for sure, this is the worst McDavid has looked since he's been an Oiler. Something is not right about him and his game, this is not even a shadow of what McDavid can actually be.

Or he is regressing. I'm not saying that for sure, but you can't disregard it either.

 

[Messrules11]

Or he is regressing. I'm not saying that for sure, but you can't disregard it either.

I stated before that Gretzky’s last 200 point season came at age 25, McD is 28, it’s going to happen.

 

[brentashton]

Or he is regressing. I'm not saying that for sure, but you can't disregard it either.

If, and that’s a big if, he was experiencing skill and physical regression, I think it would be incredibly suspect that he had this significant amount of drop off, year over year.

I believe he has a medical issue he is challenged by.

It’s uncommon that superstars have such large drops in performance in just one calendar year.

Usually it’s more of a gradual decline, which is partly because they are so committed to their craft and highly tuned athletes that they find ways to compensate mentally, strategically or physically and are able to stave off huge drops in performance, as a result.

But we really don’t know. It’s disturbing to watch, that’s for sure.

 

[Messrules11]

If, and that’s a big if, he was experiencing skill and physical regression, I think it would be incredibly suspect that he had this significant amount of drop off, year over year.

I believe he has a medical issue he is challenged by.

It’s uncommon that superstars have such large drops in performance in just one calendar year.

Usually it’s more of a gradual decline, which is partly because they are so committed to their craft and highly tuned athletes that they find ways to compensate mentally, strategically or physically and are able to stave off huge drops in performance, as a result.

But we really don’t know. It’s disturbing to watch, that’s for sure.

His linemates have also declined, Hyman is no where near a 50 goal season, Drai is on his own line, Nuge, I won’t even bother with and just a few games ago he was saddled with Podz and Kap.

 

[unicornBLOOD]

Or he is regressing. I'm not saying that for sure, but you can't disregard it either.

just seems like a pretty major regression for a 28 year old, and not just any 28 year old, a phenom. Sure, he's human, but the guy is coming off an unreal year, 130+ points, 100 assists, great playoffs, won the conn smythe award, to go from that to a guy who doesn't even get 100 points in a season? Seems unlikely to me.

 

[North]

Does anybody remember Zach Laing saying McDavid would need surgery at the end of last season?

He didn’t undergo any surgery and basically just jumped into wedding prep.

Where did Laing get that information? He seemed quite certain.

 

[Drivesaitl]

McDavid is not shooting the puck enough… there are way too many games he has betw 0 and 2 attempts on goal. That is just not enough considering that he is gifted in putting pucks in the net.

why his play is below the very high standard he set in the past is anyones guess. Some say he may be injured or something has been nagging him since last season etc. if really something would be nagging him i don‘t understand why he didn‘t fix in the summer.

in my view he mishandles pucks more than in the past and he is using his speed less than in the past. I do also think his top gear is missing since last season. It is also weird that he regressed so much at the dot this year.

Apart from Draisaitl,
Hyman, McDavid and Bouchard are not playing the way we are used to…

Not sure how to fix it, but once again, I think a lot is mental with this team…

He's not using his speed less. He's actually opting for the blow the doors off speed more than he should in games and thus getting gassed. Teams are much more schooled on that now and they just devised plans to counter his break contain game. For instance at least one player is supposed to slow him down in NZ or at line, the D make sure they have contain so he doesn't burn their doors off on a breakaway. The whole Oilers PP is also often featuring the McD bump back where he guns it every time expecting to find a path right to net.

He's not using speed less its become an obsession for him. Its not working but with like many things I guess its been his bread and butter most of his life and he goes to that well thinking its always going to be the answer. The McD of two seasons ago found a much better superior balance and he would stop up, find open spots, look for openings and look to have scoring chances. He was playing a more cerebral game two seasons ago. For some reason he never got back to that.

Its sad that this season McD has tried to pull the bank it in off a goalie 50 or more times. He does it almost every game and sometimes multiples. That he's using such a low reward play so many times is just one facet to illustrate how for some reason he's opting for inefficient attempts instead of much more High danger options.

As far as other player influences Hyman and Booch have just reverted back to range of what they likely are as players. Hyman was NEVER anywhere near a PPG player or 50 goal scorer prior to being here. Booch shot out of the cannon with point shot and other tnings and opponents adjusting to what he looks for. NHL correction has happened and been applied to McD, Booch, AND Hyman. This isn't possible with Drai who is simply stronger than 99% of players on ice and can just bull through. Drai has trained himself to be stronger than anybody he faces. lb/lb he's the hardest guy in the league to knock off the puck or try to control.

 

[Drivesaitl]

If, and that’s a big if, he was experiencing skill and physical regression, I think it would be incredibly suspect that he had this significant amount of drop off, year over year.

I believe he has a medical issue he is challenged by.

It’s uncommon that superstars have such large drops in performance in just one calendar year.

Usually it’s more of a gradual decline, which is partly because they are so committed to their craft and highly tuned athletes that they find ways to compensate mentally, strategically or physically and are able to stave off huge drops in performance, as a result.

But we really don’t know. It’s disturbing to watch, that’s for sure.

I dunno Brent. Theres some other ways to look at it. For me the 22-23 season can be considered very much outlier. Its unlike any other season he's had. McD hadn't scored 50G once prior to that and hasn't since. His peak is 41 goals other than that, a full 24 goals off that one year mark. Also in 22-23 McD had an outlandish 71PP pts on an all legend PP that broke many records. That alone was never going to recur to the same level.

So if we level out or factor the 22-23 season being outlier how much drop off, really, has occurred? McD has ranged anywhere from 108pts up over last several full seasons. He's recently also had 120 and 130pt campaigns. He/s missed games due to suspension and injury this season, he's seeing a much less effective Oilers PP where he's getting appreciably less pts. His scoring is struggling all season (the biggest difference being right there)

In anycase this season, prorated is not appreciably different than his 17-18; 18-19;19-20 campaigns.

Another consideration is that this is the only post cup final season we've ever seen from McD. The only truest fatigue season. Where its normal for players to have dropoff just because of how many games played. Contrast the raw games he's had to play the last couple seasons with say the Covid seasons where McD actually got appreciable rest and much shorter playoffs.

McD in one of the covid seasons only played in 60 games regular season and playoffs combined. Last few seasons he played from 90 to over 100games. Quantum difference and last couple seasons he's played the most hockey he's ever had to play.

My take is we're seeing cumulative fatigue and maybe a hand or wrist injury. But of the type likely to be chronic for him from now on in a league that allows its star players to be hacked, chopped, abused etc. McD can't be compared to all previous NHL superstars. Many of those had constant protection from harm on the ice riding shotgun. McD has never had that and suffers all the abuse prior superstars didn't have to, to the same degree.

 

[Spawn]

just seems like a pretty major regression for a 28 year old, and not just any 28 year old, a phenom. Sure, he's human, but the guy is coming off an unreal year, 130+ points, 100 assists, great playoffs, won the conn smythe award, to go from that to a guy who doesn't even get 100 points in a season? Seems unlikely to me.

He’s also not the only one seeing regression.

Last season MacKinnon, Kucherov and McDavid had 1.71, 1.78 and 1.74 ppg respectively.

They were 1st, 2nd and 3rd in league scoring.

This year those same three players are at: 1.49, 1.55 and 1.39

They are currently 1st, 3rd and 4th in league scoring (Draisaitl is at 2nd)

It’s as much a shift in scoring patterns as it is anything else.

That’s not to say McDavid isn’t struggling. He definitely has been. But the whole team has been as well.

One really bad 10 game stretch does not dictate what this player will be moving forward.

 

[MessierII]

Does anybody remember Zach Laing saying McDavid would need surgery at the end of last season?

He didn’t undergo any surgery and basically just jumped into wedding prep.

Where did Laing get that information? He seemed quite certain.

It was reported he had a core muscle injury nagging him since early in the season. I remember some people speculating he might need surgery but not sure there was anything concrete.

 

[unicornBLOOD]

He’s also not the only one seeing regression.

Last season MacKinnon, Kucherov and McDavid had 1.71, 1.78 and 1.74 ppg respectively.

This year those same three players are at: 1.49, 1.55 and 1.39

It’s as much a shift in scoring patterns as it is anything else.

That’s not to say McDavid isn’t struggling. He definitely has been. But the whole team has been as well.

One really bad 10 game stretch does not dictate what this player will be moving forward.

I agree with that, and ya, you're right, scoring is down from last year for a lot of players. Here's to hoping we see the McDavid we're used to seeing, sooner than later.

 

[JordanGalhanth]

It was reported he had a core muscle injury nagging him since early in the season. I remember some people speculating he might need surgery but not sure there was anything concrete.

That makes a lot of sense TBH.

Watching McDavid live on Saturday, I noticed that his lateral movement looks dramatically stiffer; the speed is still there, but he's currently not able to stickhandle or dangle with the same fluidity that he usually can. You really can't do that if your core is shot. He was clearly laboring in the warm-ups too.

Of course, Nuge and Hyman regressing doesn't help his cause either.

 

[brentashton]

I dunno Brent. Theres some other ways to look at it. For me the 22-23 season can be considered very much outlier. Its unlike any other season he's had. McD hadn't scored 50G once prior to that and hasn't since. His peak is 41 goals other than that, a full 24 goals off that one year mark. Also in 22-23 McD had an outlandish 71PP pts on an all legend PP that broke many records. That alone was never going to recur to the same level.

So if we level out or factor the 22-23 season being outlier how much drop off, really, has occurred? McD has ranged anywhere from 108pts up over last several full seasons. He's recently also had 120 and 130pt campaigns. He/s missed games due to suspension and injury this season, he's seeing a much less effective Oilers PP where he's getting appreciably less pts. His scoring is struggling all season (the biggest difference being right there)

In anycase this season, prorated is not appreciably different than his 17-18; 18-19;19-20 campaigns.

Another consideration is that this is the only post cup final season we've ever seen from McD. The only truest fatigue season. Where its normal for players to have dropoff just because of how many games played. Contrast the raw games he's had to play the last couple seasons with say the Covid seasons where McD actually got appreciable rest and much shorter playoffs.

McD in one of the covid seasons only played in 60 games regular season and playoffs combined. Last few seasons he played from 90 to over 100games. Quantum difference and last couple seasons he's played the most hockey he's ever had to play.

My take is we're seeing cumulative fatigue and maybe a hand or wrist injury. But of the type likely to be chronic for him from now on in a league that allows its star players to be hacked, chopped, abused etc. McD can't be compared to all previous NHL superstars. Many of those had constant protection from harm on the ice riding shotgun. McD has never had that and suffers all the abuse prior superstars didn't have to, to the same degree.

Valid points Drive. Chronic fatigue, wrist or core muscle medical issue all seem in the realm of possible. The fatigue seems to be contributing to him making poor mental hockey decisions (last shift in Carolina game as an example). I don’t doubt any of these having an impact on him, along with the habitual on ice abuse that he has received over 10 years.

Perhaps it could be a signal of his decline before our very eyes, but it just seems like an overly massive drop year over year, where as I expect a more gradual regression in his game. His skating speed, “hand magic” is also off this year.

I hope they sit him for a week in March and allow him to rest. He’s always been a guy susceptible to fatigue. Like you said, going to game 7 last spring, the 4Nations hasn’t helped.

 

[Whoshattenkirkshoes]

just seems like a pretty major regression for a 28 year old, and not just any 28 year old, a phenom. Sure, he's human, but the guy is coming off an unreal year, 130+ points, 100 assists, great playoffs, won the conn smythe award, to go from that to a guy who doesn't even get 100 points in a season? Seems unlikely to me.

Well he is obviously mailing it in this regular season, combined with regression from his line mates it looks worse than it is, but stats aside it still looks like a slight regression from his play 2 years ago.

 

[Ritchie Valens]

Crosby to McDavid at the 4 Nations: Go 70% in the season and play lights out in the playoffs

That’s the theory I’ve been going with. He’s won practically every personal accolade there is to win and has his eyes only on the big prize. He knows the grind of a full playoff now and realizes he needs to leave the tank 75% full. Being the most northern based team in the league, they log a ton of travel in the playoffs so that gets tiring on them too. His defensive game could be better but he’s doing enough to help the team win.

I think we see a different McDavid come playoffs.