McDavid should be appreciated for what he is. A better, more skilled version of Pavel Bure, Patrick Kane etc | Page 12 | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League
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McDavid should be appreciated for what he is. A better, more skilled version of Pavel Bure, Patrick Kane etc

Score8 said:
1966-67 Calder Memorial Trophy
1967-68 James Norris Trophy
1968-69 James Norris Trophy
1969-70 Art Ross Trophy1969-70 Stanley Cup
1969-70 Hart Memorial Trophy
1969-70 Conn Smyth Trophy
1969-70 James Norris Trophy
1970-71 Hart Memorial Trophy
1970-71 James Norris Trophy
1971-72 Stanley Cup
1971-72 Hart Memorial Trophy
1971-72 Conn Smyth Trophy
1971-72 James Norris Trophy
1972-73 James Norris Trophy
1973-74 James Norris Trophy
1974-75 Art Ross Trophy
1974-75 James Norris Trophy
1974-75 Lester B. Pearson Award
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Still didn’t answer my question

Thread is about McDavid anyways who nobody regards as higher than Gretzky, Lemieux or Orr anyhow.
 
Score8 said:
Orr dominated at both end of the ice and has the hardware to prove it. Mcdavid not so much, he’s a one trick pony.
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In the 60’s and 70’s…

And last time I checked a forward doesn’t win defenceman of the year… right?


IMG_4935.png
most games played by goalies in the 1960’s. Wanna guess the average height of them back then? And factor in the smaller equipment too. The tallest goalie is Jacques Plante at 6’ even. Not trying to jack the thread but that’s a BIG difference from the goalies nowadays especially with all the training and equipment
 
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nbwingsfan said:
How many were 0 and how many were 1.

Because again, expecting 2+ points in every game is so unbelievably unrealistic for anyone.

Crosby, whose only defense his supporters use is Cup wins, only has 4g/20pts in 25 finals games. Far below what McDavid has done.
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5 games held scoreless, and 3 1 point games.

I'm not torching McD, and consider him the best offensive player since 99/66. Just seems like a lot of interference being run for him (and some unwarranted hate as well).
 
snag said:
And yet they were where 30 other teams weren't two years in a row.

They have some things to address....but who should have been there instead? The teams they beat? Unfortunately for your argument, that's not how tournaments work.
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They were there because of McDavid and Draisaitl. Edmonton being in finals 2 years in a row is a testament to how great McDavid is. Dragging a team there who shouldn't be there. AKA the OP is pure silliness
 
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ClydeLee said:
Scoring is not just what the top guy does. But it impacts the top guys and everyone else.

Goalie pads were bigger and guys could slash sticks in around the hands no problem then. Crosbys numbers or Malkins that one year are not far off from McDavid. He's not just hyped because he won, though I disagreed with his conn smythe in 16
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What does what some 3rd line guy does affect in anyway a Crosby vs McDavid comparison?
 
Beukeboom Fan said:
5 games held scoreless, and 3 1 point games.

I'm not torching McD, and consider him the best offensive player since 99/66. Just seems like a lot of interference being run for him (and some unwarranted hate as well).
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5 out of 13 games is FAR from bad. Crosby was held scoreless in 5/7 games in 2009, including the final 3 games. If Talbot didn’t score two in game 7, you’re looking at Crosby going cupless his first 10 seasons.

Thankfully for him the rest of his team stepped up. Something no one has done with McDavid
 
PainForShane said:
series easily could've gone either way.
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Disagree 100%. Panthers dominated every game and the Oilers were lucky to win 2. Great team but FL owned them the whole series.

Now, back to McJesus...right now...he is the best thing since TGO/Mario. Period. He'll go down probably at the 3rd or 4th best hockey player of all-time. He is magic on the ice. He can't do it alone.

The biggest question I have going forward is his game is 100% based off of being faster than everyone by a country mile.

Once he slows down, since he doesn't shoot, how will his game age?

He's a human highlight reel on skates.
 
nbwingsfan said:
5 out of 13 games is FAR from bad. Crosby was held scoreless in 5/7 games in 2009, including the final 3 games. If Talbot didn’t score two in game 7, you’re looking at Crosby going cupless his first 10 seasons.

Thankfully for him the rest of his team stepped up. Something no one has done with McDavid
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i mean, that series was 100000% scripted/favored to get numbers up and hype up but we dont have to go there.

its nice to see they dont do that anymore.
 
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Debrincat93 said:
i mean, that series was 100000% scripted/favored to get numbers up and hype up but we dont have to go there.

its nice to see they dont do that anymore.
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Nah, Pens are just extremely lucky Datsyuk was injured for half the series and playing at like 50% the other 3 games
 
nbwingsfan said:
What does what some 3rd line guy does affect in anyway a Crosby vs McDavid comparison?
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The scoring environment is it... they also thrive more as playmakers, so you know who they set up. Its simply more likely for McDavid to set up a teammate to score in his prime than it was for Crosby to set up a teammate in his prime to go into the net.

You seem bitter and biased against Crosby. I dont even like Crosby but this point is silly.
 
Dipsy Doodle said:
Injuries happen. Welcome to the playoffs.
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That’s great! That’s doesn’t change what they were (or weren’t) in the finals and that McDavid had no support

The oilers had 4 players with 5 or more points, one was Bouchard who was a joke on defense, and two goalies with a .861 and .878sv%

The Panthers had 9 players with 5 or more points, and a goalie with a .919sv%

You want McDavid to overcome that kind of disparity?

We can do a player by player comparison if you’d like too, it’s gets even more hilarious the difference of teams that faced eachother.
 
T REX said:
Disagree 100%. Panthers dominated every game and the Oilers were lucky to win 2. Great team but FL owned them the whole series.

Now, back to McJesus...right now...he is the best thing since TGO/Mario. Period. He'll go down probably at the 3rd or 4th best hockey player of all-time. He is magic on the ice. He can't do it alone.

The biggest question I have going forward is his game is 100% based off of being faster than everyone by a country mile.

Once he slows down, since he doesn't shoot, how will his game age?

He's a human highlight reel on skates.
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Isn't this the whole point of the thread? He's super skilled but he plays a speedy game that when you take away his time and space in the playoffs he gets neutralized.
 
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Guess said:
Isn't this the whole point of the thread? He's super skilled but he plays a speedy game that when you take away his time and space in the playoffs he gets neutralized.
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Yep. Well, I wouldn't have necessarily put it exactly that way, but the point is IF you think McDavid's game is pure offense -- which I hadn't considered prior to gm6 but am coming around to -- IF you think his game is pure offense then basically he has to create offense otherwise his impact on the game is minimal.

With a more complete player (Sid, MacKinnon, Datsyuk etc etc), even if they don't generate offense they can still impact the game in various ways. MacK by crashing through ppl like a bowling ball / making sure the team doesn't eat pasta, Datsyuk by Datsyuking, Sid by helping draw up offensive plays, winning faceoffs after 30, Messier by crosschecking your head off etc etc, most superstars generally impact the game in multiple ways. Not all (Bure, Kane, maybe Lafleur). The point is if you think McD is pure offense, then I think it makes sense to compare him with other pure offensive guys, and he compares extremely well with almost everybody.

Anyway in the meantime we should absolutely appreciate the way he can consistently dummy defenses, that's an incredibly rare skill, we're lucky to be watching him rn
 
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yeah that's a career playoff statline for someone who gets neutralized in the playoffs? Maybe Barkov & the Panthers deserve some credit here.

edit: also I don't think Hyman gets enough credit on the things he does to help McDavid be more effective, it's not a one way street, though it might have 3 lanes going Hyman's way and only one coming back :D
 
nbwingsfan said:
That’s great! That’s doesn’t change what they were (or weren’t) in the finals and that McDavid had no support

The oilers had 4 players with 5 or more points, one was Bouchard who was a joke on defense, and two goalies with a .861 and .878sv%

The Panthers had 9 players with 5 or more points, and a goalie with a .919sv%

You want McDavid to overcome that kind of disparity?

We can do a player by player comparison if you’d like too, it’s gets even more hilarious the difference of teams that faced eachother.
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No shit, they are the more top heavy team. But that's the Oilers' thing. Their best players are expected to be that much better offensively than the opposition's best. They are built to win by offense alone, with their best offensive players shouldering the load. They sacrifice everything at the altar of production for their main guys. That's why they load up the top line, where the Pens had Crosby and Malkin each play with scrubs and make the other team pick their poison.

Bouchard has been producing at an all-time level at his position for the last 2 playoffs. He's not a defensive player. But this is not news. This is the tradeoff.

They brought in forwards last summer instead of stabilizing the goalie position for offense's sake. This is the tradeoff.
 
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