Proposal: Marco Rossi for Matty Beniers

[57special]

MN seems to want to move Rossi, despite his 60 pt. season. He is a RFA.

Beniers has been underperforming his contract(7.1M) in the past two seasons(37 and 43 pts.) in SEA, after a very nice rookie year(57 points). I was really high on Beniers in his draft year, but he seems to have stalled a bit.

Marco is small, but thick. Average speed. VG hands, passing, and offensive instincts, average defensively. Mediocre FO's. Rossi had to overcome a Covid health scare, then spend 1 1/2 seasons in the AHL, before coming up for good and having a 40, then 60 pt season in successive seasons.

Beniers is bigger, faster. Slightly better but still mediocre FO%. Good defensively, offense is a work in progress.

SEA would do this trade to get more offense. MN ... to get more size, i guess? I am kind of confused as to why they would want to move an ascendant young C who is scoring, but Guerin just traded Khusnutdinov and Lauko for Brazeau. He likes size.

 

[ThatGuy22]

MN seems to want to move Rossi, despite his 60 pt. season. He is a RFA.

Beniers has been underperforming his contract(7.1M) in the past two seasons(37 and 43 pts.) in SEA, after a very nice rookie year(57 points). I was really high on Beniers in his draft year, but he seems to have stalled a bit.

Marco is small, but thick. Average speed. VG hands, passing, and offensive instincts, average defensively. Mediocre FO's. Rossi had to overcome a Covid health scare, then spend 1 1/2 seasons in the AHL, before coming up for good and having a 40, then 60 pt season in successive seasons.

Beniers is bigger, faster. Slightly better but still mediocre FO%. Good defensively, offense is a work in progress.

SEA would do this trade to get more offense. MN ... to get more size, i guess? I am kind of confused as to why they would want to move an ascendant young C who is scoring, but Guerin just traded Khusnutdinov and Lauko for Brazeau. He likes size.

I don't think the rumors from 4 months ago that were based pretty much exclusively on Russo's gut instincts are still valid.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Zero chance Seattle goes for this, Rossi massively looks like a product of Kaprizov and Seattle doesn't have a Kaprizov to prop up Rossi.

 

[57special]

I don't think the rumors from 4 months ago that were based pretty much exclusively on Russo's gut instincts are still valid.

He was repeating the same thing a week ago, and say what you will about him, is a respected Hockey writer with good sources. All you have to do is look at the way Hynes is deploying Rossi (3rd line, wingers of Foligno and a rotating cast of untalented characters.), to see that what he thinks of him. This, on a team that needs offense.

 

[Hockeyfan200]

He was repeating the same thing a week ago, and say what you will about him, is a respected Hockey writer with good sources. All you have to do is look at the way Hynes is deploying Rossi (3rd line, wingers of Foligno and a rotating cast of untalented characters.), to see that what he thinks of him. This, on a team that needs offense.

I was listening to the pods and if what russo is saying is true, rossi is looking for more than boldy's money which in this case with how much Rossi has struggled lately, I would trade him for Matty or another C . The sign Brock Nelson in free agency

 

[ThatGuy22]

I was listening to the pods and if what russo is saying is true, rossi is looking for more than boldy's money which in this case with how much Rossi has struggled lately, I would trade him for Matty or another C . The sign Brock Nelson in free agency

Why wouldn't he be looking at more than Boldy, assuming similar term? Boldy got that deal off of a 60 point season (like Rossi just had) with an 82.5 million cap.

Under a 95 million cap, Rossi can both make more than Boldy, and be a less percentage of the cap than Boldy was at the time he signed.

Just because Boldy is going to be a steal as the cap makes its huge jumps, doesn't mean players going for new contracts are going to say "I cant make more than Boldy"

 

[sansabri]

Zero chance Seattle goes for this, Rossi massively looks like a product of Kaprizov and Seattle doesn't have a Kaprizov to prop up Rossi.

Kaprizov missed half the season

 

[Empoleon8771]

Kaprizov missed half the season

Yes and Rossi was horrendous when Kaprizov was out. He finished the year with 6 goals and 14 points in 30 games when Kaprizov missed all but the last 4 games.

 

[ThatGuy22]

Zero chance Seattle goes for this, Rossi massively looks like a product of Kaprizov and Seattle doesn't have a Kaprizov to prop up Rossi.

Rossi was PPG in the first two months after Kaprizov got hurt. He slumped hard in march though.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Why wouldn't he be looking at more than Boldy, assuming similar term? Boldy got that deal off of a 60 point season (like Rossi just had) with an 82.5 million cap.

Under a 95 million cap, Rossi can both make more than Boldy, and be a less percentage of the cap than Boldy was at the time he signed.

Just because Boldy is going to be a steal as the cap makes its huge jumps, doesn't mean players going for new contracts are going to say "I cant make more than Boldy"

Guerin has already said that he doesn't believe in cap inflation.

 

[ThatGuy22]

Guerin has already said that he doesn't believe in cap inflation.

Jeebus. Good to know our GM doesn't believe in objective reality. We got a cap flat earther on our hands

 

[AKL]

Guerin has already said that he doesn't believe in cap inflation.

Which is an objectively crazy thing for an NHL GM to say. But they also hinted that they may not spend to the cap anymore, which is also a crazy thing for a GM to say after his mantra when he was hired was "it's about f***ing winning".

Zero chance Seattle goes for this, Rossi massively looks like a product of Kaprizov and Seattle doesn't have a Kaprizov to prop up Rossi.

Yes I suppose it would look like this if all you did was look at the stat line and watched zero games.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yes I suppose it would look like this if all you did was look at the stat line and watched zero games.

"Watch the games" isn't a rebuttal to that argument.

Seattle already has Beniers as a 40-50 point center that is very strong defensively. Rossi needs to be a 60+ point center for it to be worth trading Beniers for him, and Rossi has not shown to be capable of that without playing with a linemate like Kaprizov. He's going to be playing with guys like McCann and Schwartz with Seattle.

Now add on that Beniers is signed long-term while Rossi is an arbitration eligible RFA and it makes it even worse for Seattle.

 

[AKL]

"Watch the games" isn't a rebuttal to that argument.

You should always watch the player play before you draw conclusions, stat lines don't provide important context. But I suppose if you didn't watch the player, you probably would think being told to watch the player isn't fair to say to you.

 

[Empoleon8771]

You should always watch the player play before you draw conclusions, stat lines don't provide important context. But I suppose if you didn't watch the player, you probably would think being told to watch the player isn't fair to say to you.

"Watch the games" rebuttals are people who don't have statistical arguments to back up their claims and instead just insist their claims are right because they say so.

It's a bad deal for Seattle.

 

[AKL]

"Watch the games" rebuttals are people who don't have statistical arguments to back up their claims and instead just insist their claims are right because they say so.

This is a rebuttal for people who don't know what they're talking about but think looking up a stat line makes them an expert.

 

[Empoleon8771]

This is a rebuttal for people who don't know what they're talking about but think looking up a stat line makes them an expert.

Cool story. Still a bad deal for Seattle.

 

[AKL]

Guys check out this website. I just became an expert on Pittsburgh Penguins hockey without even watching a single game this season. Ask me anything.

 

[BKarchitect]

I’m still a Beniers-stan even if his output and offensive line-driving has been disappointing. I think he can still be a pretty elite 2C with a defensive-bent and leadership qualities. The physical package is still there and he leaves nothing to be desired from an effort standpoint.

With Wright being significantly more offensive and Catton perhaps soon to be ready to be that playmaking engine (at C or wing), I’d hold onto Matty as a two-way counterweight and see if a coaching change and perhaps some improving weaponry up front can unlock him offensively.

It’s certainly not a bad offer though. There’s plenty to like about Rossi.

 

[AKL]

With Wright being significantly more offensive and Catton perhaps soon to be ready to be that playmaking engine (at C or wing), I’d hold onto Matty as a two-way counterweight and see if a coaching change and perhaps some improving weaponry up front can unlock him offensively.

Think you're spot on here. Seattle has some good offensive pieces coming up, they need a guy like Beniers more than a guy like Rossi at this point. Meanwhile, Minnesota already has their Beniers so to speak, in Eriksson Ek. They need an offensive guy who meshes well with Kaprizov, which is what Rossi is and can be.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Guys check out this website. I just became an expert on Pittsburgh Penguins hockey without even watching a single game this season. Ask me anything.

Or maybe I'm also a Kraken fan who has lived in Seattle for the last 4 years and realize that Beniers for Rossi is a shitty deal for Seattle.

The offensive upside Rossi offers over Beniers is simply not high enough to sacrifice the defensive advantage that Beniers has. And that's even if you completely ignore that Seattle has no one like Kaprizov to help Rossi offensively, plus you completely ignore that Beniers is signed long-term while Rossi is a RFA that needs a new contract.

 

[AKL]

Or maybe I'm also a Kraken fan who has lived in Seattle for the last 4 years and realize that Beniers for Rossi is a shitty deal for Seattle.

My apologies, I didn't realize you lived in Seattle. That changes everything in regards to your expertise on Rossi.

 

[Empoleon8771]

My apologies, I didn't realize you lived in Seattle. That changes everything in regards to your expertise on Rossi.

The offensive upside Rossi offers over Beniers is simply not high enough to sacrifice the defensive advantage that Beniers has. And that's even if you completely ignore that Seattle has no one like Kaprizov to help Rossi offensively, plus you completely ignore that Beniers is signed long-term while Rossi is a RFA that needs a new contract. Plus you completely ignore that Rossi's best season was 60 points while Beniers' best season was 57 points.

Since you keep editing out why I'm saying it's a shitty deal for Seattle.

 

[AKL]

Since you keep editing out why I'm saying it's a shitty deal for Seattle.

I don't really care who you think it's a shitty deal for, I only take exception to the idea that you're a Rossi expert because you looked up a stat line and don't need to watch any of the games or understand the context surrounding him, and that suggesting you should is somehow not a valid point.

I already said Seattle doesn't do this so continuing to ram that point down my throat isn't accomplishing anything other than making it look like you aren't even comprehending my posts.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Okay Marco Rossi is actually an elite 1C that Minnesota should give a lifelong contract to. You've helped me see the light!

Seattle still says no to the OP, but I'm beating a dead horse with that at this point.