Proposal: MAF to the Hurricanes
- Thread starter Incetardis
- Start date
THall4
Registered User
Big McLargehuge
Fragile Traveler
You don't think he'd waive to be the clear #1 on a good young structured team like Carolina? He'd be crazy not to
Roland McKeown and Victor Rask (lol) are not pieces that are being shipped out for a guy who will likely be bought out this offseason. Canes would be doing the Pens a favor here.
I'd rather see the Canes bomb this year and sign Bishop to a huge contract than give away a guy like Rask for MAF.
I'd rather see the Canes bomb this year and sign Bishop to a huge contract than give away a guy like Rask for MAF.
Number1RedWingsFan52
Registered User
Doubt that MAF has any desire to play in Carolina. Pretty sure they're on his No Trade List.
Ding ding ding, winner.
If Carolina wanted Fleury, they'd have acquired him in the offseason. They're fine with Ward/Lack for now.
hagelin1381
Registered User
Doubt he'd want to play in Carolina but it'd be fun to see Carolina with goalies that are NHL caliber
Yeah, if they give Fleury away free and add their first rounder.
Otherwise, be forced to protect him and lose Murray to Las Vegas. Or , somehow pay Fleury off to waive his NMC so he can be selected.
Unsustainable
Seth Jarvis has Big Kahunas
Yeah, taking a teams 1st line center to a team with 2 1st line centers would be pretty good for that team to have 3 1st line centers.
Empoleon8771
Registered User
Why is Fleury likely being bought out? That's a pretty baseless claim on your part.
I think a buyout is a worst case scenario type situation. Penguins will definitely try to move him before the expansion draft, but if they can't? Doubt they risk losing Murray.
Canada4Gold
Registered User
- Dec 22, 2010
- 43,055
- 9,244
Don't bother, the guy you quoted believes that Pit can convince Las Vegas to not take Murray by offering a 2nd round pick
Murray >>>> 2nd round pick + Next available asset obviously. It would be an expensive trade to convince them not to take Murray.
Interesting to how Pit and Fleury plays it. Fleury presumably will put all teams who might reasonably trade for him on his no trade list. So the question becomes does he waive for a trade or take his buyout and sign somewhere in the offseason. Either way he gets to pick his team, he would likely get more money by being bought out.
bleedgreen
Registered User
Canes fans that think Bishop wants to play with us are being a little too optimistic, and I don't think RF would really pursue him that hard. MAF has always made more sense to me, but not at the apparent price pens fans want. The top young guys wouldn't be available. Rask is kinda comical, he's essentially our number one center. MAF has years left on a decent sized contract, I don't think he's that easy for the pens to trade and they are under the gun because of the expansion draft. Especially in season. I don't see him bringing back a huge bounty at this point.
The canes would take him but it would have to be a reasonable price. RF hasn't overpaid for a single thing yet, other than Semin's buyout where he had no choice.
The canes would take him but it would have to be a reasonable price. RF hasn't overpaid for a single thing yet, other than Semin's buyout where he had no choice.
Paulie Gualtieri
R.I.P. Tony Sirico
- May 18, 2016
- 12,847
- 3,362
What are you saying? That there is some kerfuffle between all of the GM's to screw us over, even if a specific deal benefits them (not saying that this proposed deal necessarily does). That's just delusional.
Personally I don't find it too hard finding a team we could trade him too. He knows that his future here isn't as a starter, which he most likely wants to be. Plenty of teams would want an upgrade on the goalie they will be originally planning to protect. Said goalie might be coming back in the deal.
Tender Rip
Wears long pants
I suppose the trouble is to estimate what a reasonable price is....
Fleury is indisputably an elite regular season goalie. Longevity, wins and stats should say enough about that. In game one this season he made about 40 saves against one of the best teams in the league and was the 1st star of the game.
His salary is fair for a nr. 1 goalie and he has two more years on his deal. And he is not old.
I honestly don't know what is fair, but it can't be low-balling infused by "we're doing you a favor" arguments.
I thought two seconds from Calgary would have been fair prior to the draft. Or at least acceptable, what with Murray risk management and cap space.
Fleury is indisputably an elite regular season goalie. Longevity, wins and stats should say enough about that. In game one this season he made about 40 saves against one of the best teams in the league and was the 1st star of the game.
His salary is fair for a nr. 1 goalie and he has two more years on his deal. And he is not old.
I honestly don't know what is fair, but it can't be low-balling infused by "we're doing you a favor" arguments.
I thought two seconds from Calgary would have been fair prior to the draft. Or at least acceptable, what with Murray risk management and cap space.
Big McLargehuge
Fragile Traveler
Fleury is in year 1 of 3 at a $5.75 million cap hit...that's a pretty good contract for a fringe top 10 goalie who isn't likely to start physically declining until after his current deal is up. Especially when the alternative is being one of numerous teams lining up to sign Bishop (again, one team is going to get Bishop next year...though I've seen at least six fan bases use him as a trump card in negotiations on this board...do the math).
At the end of the day I think it's a moot point since I expect that Carolina (as well as most of the Metropolitan Division) is on Fleury's no-trade list, but I'm always baffled when Fleury's contract is brought up as some sort of negative outside of the situation in Pittsburgh. You're not getting a better goalie at that cap hit without paying a massive premium on a younger goalie.
As for the expansion draft stuff...I'll keep repeating myself here. There will be plenty of good goalies available in the Expansion Draft, so this Murray or bust mentality I've seen is a bit extreme. Plus someone like Derrick Pouliot would usually be hugely appealing for an expansion team - a former high pick with a ton of upside who plays a style of hockey that typically costs a premium to acquire, who just so happens to be blocked thanks to being on a very good team. I honestly don't think it'll be too hard for the Pens to persuade Vegas to look elsewhere for goalies...hell, I wouldn't be that surprised if Fleury is starting for Vegas next year.
Either way, if worst comes to worst the Pens will buyout Fleury and deal with ~$2 million in dead cap space rather than allow Murray to be selected and I really doubt it comes to that.
I don't expect the Pens to get a 'fair' trade for Fleury because of the expansion draft stirring the market, but I really don't think this is going to have as poor of a result for the Pens as many want to happen.
Yes. He'd be an impending UFA so there's no chance Vegas would waste a pick on him, but the expansion draft occurs before Condon's contract expires.
At the end of the day I think it's a moot point since I expect that Carolina (as well as most of the Metropolitan Division) is on Fleury's no-trade list, but I'm always baffled when Fleury's contract is brought up as some sort of negative outside of the situation in Pittsburgh. You're not getting a better goalie at that cap hit without paying a massive premium on a younger goalie.
As for the expansion draft stuff...I'll keep repeating myself here. There will be plenty of good goalies available in the Expansion Draft, so this Murray or bust mentality I've seen is a bit extreme. Plus someone like Derrick Pouliot would usually be hugely appealing for an expansion team - a former high pick with a ton of upside who plays a style of hockey that typically costs a premium to acquire, who just so happens to be blocked thanks to being on a very good team. I honestly don't think it'll be too hard for the Pens to persuade Vegas to look elsewhere for goalies...hell, I wouldn't be that surprised if Fleury is starting for Vegas next year.
Either way, if worst comes to worst the Pens will buyout Fleury and deal with ~$2 million in dead cap space rather than allow Murray to be selected and I really doubt it comes to that.
I don't expect the Pens to get a 'fair' trade for Fleury because of the expansion draft stirring the market, but I really don't think this is going to have as poor of a result for the Pens as many want to happen.
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Empoleon8771
Registered User
Yeah, a buyout is possible and is definitely the worst or one of the worst options. I just think that saying "he will likely be bought out" is a pretty baseless claim.
dogbazinho
Registered User
I've got to think Francis has a plan to acquire a goalie soon as he can't honestly expect to be competitive with Lack and Ward in net. Given JR and Francis's history with both franchises it stands to reason that these would make good partners. That said Francis has been a shrewd GM when it comes to trades and JR has been known to toss players away. I'd say a pick, a goalie (and a lesser prospect.)
Here is the 'base' behind the claim
Penguins gave Fleury a NMC .
Penguins have to protect Fleury in the expansion draft
Penguins can only protect 1 goalie
Penguins just won the cup with their 21 year old goalie Matt Murray
Penguins dont want to give up Murray.
Penguins must TRADE Fleury
Penguins must CONVINCE Fleury to waive his NMC
Penguins must convince another team to somehow IGNORE the corner they are backed into with Fleury / Murray and take Fleury off their hands.
Or................
Just buy Fleury out.
Baseless? Not so much.
Big McLargehuge
Fragile Traveler
Fleury's NTC allows him to list 12 teams he won't allow a trade to without his consent, he doesn't have a full NMC as people seem to think he does.
Fleury's partial NMC, which unfortunately does result in him having to be protected at the expansion draft, simply doesn't allow for him to be demoted.
Fleury's partial NMC, which unfortunately does result in him having to be protected at the expansion draft, simply doesn't allow for him to be demoted.
The league has already stipulated that its irrelevant . Las Vegas has to be the team he is willing to waived to.
If you were Fleury, wouldnt you stand firm and wait for a buy out? I would. Im going to another team anyways. Why not get a Penguins paycheck and pick my new team?
And the more I think about it, what other team would trade for him? With a buyout, they can lobby him for much cheaper as a UFA because hes getting a Penguins paycheck.
Big McLargehuge
Fragile Traveler
17 teams could trade for Fleury today without his consent...so how is the buyout the most likely scenario to happen? Teams are going to do what is in their best interest, if someone needs a goalie and isn't on Fleury's no-trade list what are they going to be more interested in doing - helping their team or tightening the screws on another team? They're going to do what is in their best interest, acquire the very good starter at a reduced price.
And the fallacy of 'just wait until he's a free agent anyway' only works in a vacuum when no other teams are looking for goaltending. That's never the case. Even if it does come down to Fleury being bought out, any discount a team would likely get from the buyout money goes out the window when multiple teams inevitably bid for his services. Fleury is a fringe top 10 starter, not a third pairing defenseman on the wrong side of 35.
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