LW Brayden Tracey - Moose Jaw Warriors, WHL (2019, 29th, ANA)

[WhatTheDuck]

Someone needs to eat breakfast

See this is what you have to do when you can't dispute anything I'm saying. Out of your league

 

[Hockeyville USA]

You haven't provided any data beyond just naming picks who didn't work out at spots where picks are statistically not expected to turn out, ironically you are the one ignoring statistics completely. Multiple picks you are trying to claim as evidence of a guy deserving to be fired, were actually good picks statistically speaking. The facts show that you only have about a 25% chance of landing a player who sticks in the NHL with a late first round pick. So guys like Etem and Steel, again statistically speaking were good picks at 29 and 30 overall, simply by having any NHL career. The Ducks simply have not drafted a WHL player early enough to be expecting an impact player. They've landed quite a few NHLers with picks where you can't expect to land anything, plus had a star Dman in Theodore with a late first. But you've randomly drawn a line in the sand and decided that every scout must land us an impact forward regardless of where we pick from their area. That's not how it works if we are looking at this from any reasonable fact based perspective and not just being weirdly upset about one particular pick.

You have to try and stray off topic and get personal because you are clearly way beyond your depth in this argument. @Hockeyville USA feel free to be an adult and attempt to refute anything I'm saying as well

The scouts are PAID to find players that end up hitting. We are all aware of the stats of the likelihood of certain pick ranges/rounds becoming full time NHLers. Giving stats as an excuse for consistently missing on picks is weak IMHO.

My rule of thumb is heavily scrutinizing first 3 round draft picks only; picks in rounds 4-7 generally aren't worth overanalyzing when those players don't become NHLers (unless your scouts lit a pick on fire by selecting a low probability future NHLer)

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Someone needs to eat breakfast

See this is what you have to do when you can't dispute anything I'm saying, so ironic that you accuse me of having no factual basis from my side. When the facts come out, you respond with this kind of crap

 

[cheesymc]

See this is what you have to do when you can't dispute anything I'm saying. Out of your league

You need to change your handle and image from WhatTheDuck to a whiny I_Told_You_So

 

[WhatTheDuck]

The scouts are PAID to find players that end up hitting. We are all aware of the stats of the likelihood of certain pick ranges/rounds becoming full time NHLers. Giving stats as an excuse for consistently missing on picks is weak IMHO.

My rule of thumb is heavily scrutinizing first 3 round draft picks only, picks in rounds 4-7 generally aren't worth overanalyzing when those players don't become NHLers (unless your scouts lit a pick on fire by selecting a low probability future NHLer)

Should this scout have been fired on the basis of this one bad late first rounder six years ago? When he's also found Shea Theodore with a late first and a few other NHLers with later picks? That's the side you're arguing here. His entire basis is that the Ducks don't have an impact forward from the WHL in recent years. Are we expecting every area scout to pull an impact player at each position. Can anyone name a team that has come close to doing this? I'm all for accountability and scrutinizing picks but I'd say you are latching on to the argument of someone who has no clue where those lines should be drawn

You need to change your handle and image from WhatTheDuck to a whiny I_Told_You_So

View attachment 976644

Doesn't seem like an overly fact based argument

 

[cheesymc]

The scouts are PAID to find players that end up hitting. We are all aware of the stats of the likelihood of certain pick ranges/rounds becoming full time NHLers. Giving stats as an excuse for consistently missing on picks is weak IMHO.

My rule of thumb is heavily scrutinizing first 3 round draft picks only; picks in rounds 4-7 generally aren't worth overanalyzing when those players don't become NHLers (unless your scouts lit a pick on fire by selecting a low probability future NHLer)

There’s no point putting in any further effort for someone who is so unreasonable and likely special. I can guarantee he will feel a sense of urgency to have the last response.

He’s one of the posters here that poisons HFBOARDS.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Should this scout have been fired on the basis of this one bad late first rounder six years ago? When he's also found Shea Theodore with a late first and a few other NHLers with later picks? That's the side you're arguing here



Doesn't seem like an overly fact based argument

Should he have been fired? Potentially yes, but potentially no as well. But when you consistently miss in a certain region, the GM/assistant GMs/amateur scouting department need to do an audit on where they screwed up & how to improve moving forward. Most organizations reevaluate a draft 3 years later and/or 5 years later & essentially audit themselves.

From what I've generally heard/seen online, the Ducks' management staff is a bit more stubborn than the average.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Should he have been fired? Potentially yes, but potentially no as well. But when you consistently miss in a certain region, the GM/assistant GMs/amateur scouting department need to do an audit on where they screwed up & how to improve moving forward. Most organizations reevaluate a draft 3 years later and/or 5 years later & essentially audit themselves.

From what I've generally heard/seen online, the Ducks' management staff is a bit more stubborn than the average.

They don't consistent miss in that region and that wasn't the original basis of the argument though. He stated that the Tracey pick alone was fireable if there was proper accountability. That's way beyond accountability, that's absurdity. The Ducks have had a pretty solid track record drafting from the WHL including one star player. Even the best scouts have a Tracey or several on their record. It's absurd to expect each area scout to land you an impact player at each position, that just doesn't happen. If they are getting you NHL players consistently and the occasional star, they are doing their job.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

They don't consistent miss in that region and that wasn't the original basis of the argument though. He stated that the Tracey pick alone was fireable if there was proper accountability. That's way beyond accountability, that's absurdity. The Ducks have had a pretty solid track record drafting from the WHL including one star player. Even the best scouts have a Tracey or several on their record. It's absurd to expect each area scout to land you an impact player at each position, that just doesn't happen. If they are getting you NHL players consistently and the occasional star, they are doing their job.

He may have been too negative but you're clearly being too positive. And even if you want to cut the Ducks some slack on the Tracey pick specifically, the management staff essentially let an asset burn its value completely out when it was becoming clearer that Tracey wouldn't become the NHLer they thought he would. Tracey regressed from his DY to D+1 and D+2, perfect opportunity to trade him at some point to recoup some value.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

He may have been too negative but you're clearly being too positive. And even if you want to cut the Ducks some slack on the Tracey pick specifically, the management staff essentially let an asset burn its value completely out when it was becoming clearer that Tracey wouldn't become the NHLer they thought he would. Tracey regressed from his DY to D+1 and D+2, perfect opportunity to trade him at some point to recoup some value.

It was a bad pick, not disputing that. It was ridiculous to state that the scout should have been fired just on that basis, and I don't think it's "being too positive" to say as much. There's a reason he completely bowed out of the conversation and started with the immature crap, he doesn't have the facts to back up his side.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

It was a bad pick, not disputing that. It was ridiculous to state that the scout should have been fired just on that basis, and I don't think it's "being too positive" to say as much. There's a reason he completely bowed out of the conversation and started with the immature crap, he doesn't have the facts to back up his side.

I meant you're being too positive about the Ducks drafting & excuse making to clear them of their recent draft mistakes/underachieving, not about the Ducks Dub scout stuff.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

I meant you're being too positive about the Ducks drafting & excuse making to clear them of their recent draft mistakes/underachieving, not about the Ducks Dub scout stuff.

Sorry, where within this argument did I do so? I refuted that specific late first round picks were bad, when they produced NHL players. Again that's a stat based argument based on the rate of getting anything out of late first rounders, it's not Ducks specific.

I think I'm being entirely more reasonable than anyone suggesting a scout should be fired solely for one bad pick at 29th overall

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Sorry, where within this argument did I do so? I refuted that specific late first round picks were bad, when they produced NHL players. Again that's a stat based argument based on the rate of getting anything out of late first rounders, it's not Ducks specific.

I think I'm being entirely more reasonable than anyone suggesting a scout should be fired solely for one bad pick at 29th overall

Steel disappointed, Etem disappointed, Tracey completely busted. Just out of the Dub.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Steel disappointed, Etem disappointed, Tracey completely busted. Just out of the Dub.

Steel and Etem were not bad picks relative to where they were drafted. The Ducks made four late first rounders out of the W within a short span. One star (Theodore), two NHL players and one bust. That's above expectations for picks that again have about a 25% chance of producing a player who sticks for 100+ NHL games.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Steel and Etem were not bad picks relative to where they were drafted. The Ducks made four late first rounders out of the W within a short span. One star (Theodore), two NHL players and one bust. That's above expectations for picks that again have about a 25% chance of producing a player who sticks for 100+ NHL games.

They weren't the correct picks though, same with Tracey, that's what matters. Hold your scouts to the highest standard. Simple

 

[Static]

You sound like a federal employee currently being assessed by DOGE who is resisting any performance metrics and reasonable expectations.

Aha, things make sense now.

They weren't the correct picks though, same with Tracey, that's what matters. Hold your scouts to the highest standard. Simple

Every team would have to fire their scouts every year then? Anaheim's scouts hit more often than almost any other franchise, so, maybe they are of the highest standard?

Nobody is infallible, but that is baked into the job.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

They weren't the correct picks though, same with Tracey, that's what matters. Hold your scouts to the highest standard. Simple

So like I said earlier, you expect teams to fire scouts when they miss on late firsts 75% of the time. Even two years after having just landed a star with a late first? Seems...reactive

 

[Static]

Larsson and etem are difficult post-draft reads because both blew their knees out early in development. It pretty much ended etem's career. I'd bet at least etem would have had a long career and been a successful pick; not a star or anything close, but a useful player who played a lot of games.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

Aha, things make sense now.


Every team would have to fire their scouts every year then? Anaheim's scouts hit more often than almost any other franchise, so, maybe they are of the highest standard?

Nobody is infallible, but that is baked into the job.

Gaucher, Warren, Myatovic, Clara, Pitre are all not trending well. Perreault already busted, Colangelo, Terrance & Hinds look meh at best. Moore won't be anything most likely.

McTavish, Zellweger, Mintyukov, Luneau, Carlsson, Sidorov, Sennecke, T. Smith look good to varying degrees. I'm cautiously optimistic with Solberg, Pettersson, & Masse, we'll see.

I think the Ducks' drafting has been a mixed bag, definitely solid in some respects but still leaves me wanting more considering how many picks they've had and several players drafted shortly after the Ducks' picks who've turned out better already. I tend to be more critical of all management/scouting staffs when it comes to the draft, high standards should be help.

 

[Static]

Gaucher, Warren, Myatovic, Clara, Pitre are all not trending well. Perreault already busted, Colangelo, Terrance & Hinds look meh at best. Moore won't be anything most likely.

McTavish, Zellweger, Mintyukov, Luneau, Carlsson, Sidorov, Sennecke, T. Smith look good to varying degrees. I'm cautiously optimistic with Solberg, Pettersson, & Masse, we'll see.

I think the Ducks' drafting has been a mixed bag, definitely solid in some respects but still leaves me wanting more considering how many picks they've had and several players drafted shortly after the Ducks' picks who've turned out better already. I tend to be more critical of all management/scouting staffs when it comes to the draft, high standards should be help.

Is it wise to evaluate anaheim's drafting on players who are still in development? That doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Evaluate their drafting on players who have now physically matured and exited development into what they are and will be as players. If you do that, their record is one of the best.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

There’s no point putting in any further effort for someone who is so unreasonable and likely special. I can guarantee he will feel a sense of urgency to have the last response.

He’s one of the posters here that poisons HFBOARDS.

Lmao you preach about accountability, have a look in the mirror bud. I have been making perfectly reasonable arguments and you ran out of garage to spew and started shit posting dumb memes and personal attacks like usual. You don't know f*** all about hockey