Post-Game Talk: Literally shooting yourself in the foot

[oobga]

Would if we crash the hard drive and reset it??

Need good marketing this summer. Nurse+Skinner, the ultimate 1st overall pick + help to hit the cap floor cheat code for sale.

 

[harpoon]

Hertyl injured our only legit goalie and still can't score.

The man has been in the league for more than ten years. Why do you keep on spelling his name with a ‘y’? Or is it some kind of joke I’m not getting?

 

[jesusbuiltmyhotrod]

Steve Smith own goal was also a .....split second decision.

Thru are not remotely comparable

 

[jesusbuiltmyhotrod]

Need your safe space eh?

Good lord the children are here. Block is a great feature to block immature fools

 

[9GWG9]

So wat is 5he word on Pickard?

 

[harpoon]

At least I'll be able to have a nice amount of sleep tomorrow evening. Why would I watch game 4 when I know already know what the outcome will be?

F*** Vegas
F*** Roy
F*** Skinner

Thats where I am as well. I hate to abandon the team, but I just can’t bring myself to watch if Skinner is starting. It’s not good for my already compromised health.

 

[Drivesaitl]

The man has been in the league for more than ten years. Why do you keep on spelling his name with a ‘y’? Or is it some kind of joke I’m not getting?

Harpoon reading my posts...

https://www.tsn.ca/must-see/video/must-see-hertl-accidentally-clips-athletic-trainer-while-slammin~3130686

Yeah, sorry, I don't care enough about this tool to even spell his name right. Can I have a vowel Alex?

Didn't see this Turtle meltdown being discussed in any thread. Guy tries to break his stick on the bench, because thats gonna go well. This was game 2 I guess.

 

[MessierThanThou]

Need good marketing this summer. Nurse+Skinner, the ultimate 1st overall pick + help to hit the cap floor cheat code for sale.

Wait, so how do we acquire the first overall pick we’ll have to offer to get another team to take those two contracts?

 

[oobga]

Wait, so how do we acquire the first overall pick we’ll have to offer to get another team to take those two contracts?

Hehe. we don't need that, all we need is Don Draper. And for Holland or Chia to be hired by a team to be GM

 

[harpoon]

Harpoon reading my posts...

https://www.tsn.ca/must-see/video/must-see-hertl-accidentally-clips-athletic-trainer-while-slammin~3130686

Yeah, sorry, I don't care enough about this tool to even spell his name right. Can I have a vowel Alex?

Didn't see this Turtle meltdown being discussed in any thread. Guy tries to break his stick on the bench, because thats gonna go well. This was game 2 I guess.

Haha. I missed that. Thanks for posting. What a loser. Based on the saves shown in the clip it looks like yesterday’s game.

 

[rboomercat90]

so no way he's "day-to-day" and it's likely he's out of the playoffs completely then... wtf

If Pickard was truly day to day they’d be waiting until tomorrow to decide if he was able to play, probably making the final decision in warm up. That we’re hearing this already today suggests it’s likely week to week or worse.

I’m curious to see how much rope Skinner is given now. Are we committed to sink or swim with a goalie the players have given up on and just willing to pack it in for the year or will they do what other organizations do in the post season when they’re trying to win and take a flier on another goalie on their depth chart if Skinner shits his pants again in the next game. Kinda how Hill got the net there in the first place. The Oilers decided to sink or swim with Skinner last time they played Vegas (until they pulled him when the game was out of reach).

Either way, I’m not looking forward to watching Skinner playing another road game and having another mental breakdown once the fans start getting after him.

 

[rboomercat90]

Hell Darren Pang now, would have done better

He looked bigger in his net than Skinner does.

 

[5 Mins 4 Ftg]

I dunno… watching the replay and judging from the corpses in the center of the slot, he would have had a pretty clear look at the net with angles at goal on both sides of Skinner. Have a look again and see if you agree (based on where he stepped around Nurse and McD. .

I’m sure all three of us (you, me and Skinner) can all agree that would be less than ideal. We know Skinners not a point blank big save guy… he plays a preventative game (I know one when I see one) to mask his weaknesses and that’s what that play was.

For his skill set and the time in the game that was the right call, get big, track the guy and make him run out of space… keep in mind retracting to the post wasn’t even an option. Skinner was still sliding forward when he went into butterfly… at that point you attack, retreat wasn’t really an option. Closer distance to Roy himself than the post. And anyway… that would have had Roy coming straight at him, only a bit shooters-left of the central slot.

I have to respectfully disagree. The replay shows a rolling puck or puck on edge and Smith moving quick - Skinner >already< on his knees at the crease edge. Skinner says himself he thought Smith didn’t have enough time to make any other play than shoot and over-challenged getting caught.

You don’t challenge shooters from your knees. He hit the panic button to me and went into full time oh shit mode when Smith went wide left.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

But isn’t this the issue? The guy doesn’t think there’s anything to clean up. At least that hasn’t been evident in any interview I’ve ever seen him give.

Issues with talent have never been personal with me until Stu came along. I can tolerate and even respect a guy who sucks at hockey and will at least admit he has areas he needs to work on. Stu never does that. How telling is it that he refers to the rest of the team as “them”, when he says he gave them a chance to win? That’s not a misspoken word or an issue of semantics, that’s a guy who is clearly laying the blame on his teammates while taking no issue with his own play. When has McD or Drai or Pickard or anyone else ever not spoken of the team as a collective?

He’s untouchable and beyond criticism, both in his own mind and in the eyes of the local press, and it drives people up the wall. A positive attitude is important for sure, but you also have to be honest with yourself. That’s what missing here. He’ll never improve because he’s too arrogant to see any of his own weaknesses.

Appreciate your post and pov. Personally I can't stand watching Skinner interviews and generally don't. But when I do, I don't see arrogance but rather someone almost play acting moreso to hide insecurity and doubt than innate cockiness. All the talk of self help books and stoicism are extraneous reaches to find some stability to minimize self-doubt and fear. Three years in the NHL onboarding on a Cup window team and he's in survival mode trying to keep it together with the old 'fake it till you make it.'

We watched Jack Campbell pressers melting down before our eyes with cringeworthy over self critical assessment. That did nothing for him or his team and was commented and scrutinized widely across the hockey world. Personally I think Skinner maintains this persona/image publicly with likely hard reality critique and self-assessment out of public domain. Nothing for he or the team to gain by any show of weakness.

He was mid level prospect who should have been building an NHL game as a developing back-up through peak window years. Imaging going from intern to CEO/Executive Suite within a year of employment. I don't feel sorry for Skinner but I have empathy for him. That's my own pop psychology take on the player and circumstances. My real criticism is for management groups that blew their load on a bad veteran goalie option and have largely crack filled this critical position while squandering the long overdue roster finally arriving in peak winning window.

Game 4 is a fresh page for everyone. Time again to see what this team's got.

 

[frag2]

Harpoon reading my posts...

https://www.tsn.ca/must-see/video/must-see-hertl-accidentally-clips-athletic-trainer-while-slammin~3130686

Yeah, sorry, I don't care enough about this tool to even spell his name right. Can I have a vowel Alex?

Didn't see this Turtle meltdown being discussed in any thread. Guy tries to break his stick on the bench, because thats gonna go well. This was game 2 I guess.

Someone should just fall onto Hill like Hertl. I mean if we are gonna get penalized, might as well make them penalties count

 

[CrazyJoeDavola]

ggs

 

[brentashton]

Sure, if you wanna be intentionally daft that's the same thing.

You are just saying because Skinner has bad numbers previously, he has to be at fault for this game too. Everyone in the world knows Stu isn't good enough, due to his past play that you noted, but there is nothing that can be done about that now. Thing is, we also know how good McDrai can be, which they haven't been at that level for long stretches the past couple games. That can be changed, certainly also played a part in the loss before just the final moments, and is a more interesting discussion than just crying about Skinner for the 1000th time.

Not being daft, my post made sense unlike yours.

Just trying to square your circle where you say past games don’t have relevance after saying past games have relevance.

 

[Oilslick941611]

No, the hill I'm dying on is being critical of the players who have underperformed the last 2 games relative to their usual otherworldly play and high pay, and not just crying about the goaltender like everyone does here every f***ing game. Never once did I say Stu was fine, but he gave us what you would expect from a goalie making peanuts compared to those guys or most starters.

I'm keeping the discussion on the most recent games played, I don't see the relevance of any past games.

because there is none.

McDrai havn't had the best last two games, Skinner sucks, and everyone on the ice contributed to that GWG. Its no one players fault. Everyone made poor choices.

 

[Austerlitz]

I didn't say what Stu did is good fundamentals. I said it worked. Those are different things.

It didn't work, though. At all. A puck straight through the crease in front of a completely wide open net?

 

[Drivesaitl]

Someone should just fall onto Hill like Hertl. I mean if we are gonna get penalized, might as well make them penalties count

This playoffs we probably want Hill in the net. He isn't as good as he was a couple years ago and also now teams have more book on him.

 

[OilerTyler]

It didn't work, though. At all. A puck straight through the crease in front of a completely wide open net?

Exactly. It was going through the crease (not in the net). He successfully cut down Smith's angle to the point where he missed the net. If Drai doesn't score an own goal were not even talking about it. It was bad luck and it happens.

It's honestly the least-worst goal that Skinner let in last night.

 

[Kinibo]

Appreciate your post and pov. Personally I can't stand watching Skinner interviews and generally don't. But when I do, I don't see arrogance but rather someone almost play acting moreso to hide insecurity and doubt than innate cockiness. All the talk of self help books and stoicism are extraneous reaches to find some stability to minimize self-doubt and fear. Three years in the NHL onboarding on a Cup window team and he's in survival mode trying to keep it together with the old 'fake it till you make it.'

We watched Jack Campbell pressers melting down before our eyes with cringeworthy over self critical assessment. That did nothing for him or his team and was commented and scrutinized widely across the hockey world. Personally I think Skinner maintains this persona/image publicly with likely hard reality critique and self-assessment out of public domain. Nothing for he or the team to gain by any show of weakness.

He was mid level prospect who should have been building an NHL game as a developing back-up through peak window years. Imaging going from intern to CEO/Executive Suite within a year of employment. I don't feel sorry for Skinner but I have empathy for him. That's my own pop psychology take on the player and circumstances. My real criticism is for management groups that blew their load on a bad veteran goalie option and have largely crack filled this critical position while squandering the long overdue roster finally arriving in peak winning window.

Game 4 is a fresh page for everyone. Time again to see what this team's got.

Point taken. I can certainly agree that he was thrust into this position by bad decision making. This whole mess is clearly a failing of the organization and were it not for the mistakes of management we wouldn’t even have to be discussing this. Further to this, I’m reminded of Shawn Horcoff who took a lot of the same grief after signing a contract far in excess of what his skills warranted. Ability be damned, we expected him to play to the level of his contract when we should have been pointing the finger at management. Skinner was promoted to #1 due to necessity, not on merit, and that’s squarely on the front office.

It really is the perfect storm for disliking a player: lack of talent relative to the role, a press corps misrepresenting the reality of it, an apparent unwillingness by the player himself to be accountable (whether or not that’s his true mindset), and that little sense of panic we all feel as the window closes just a little more with each passing season. I put myself in this category.

I do feel that if there’s any team that can overcome our goaltending, it’s this year’s club. I keep thinking back to Game 5 of the LA series and I feel that if we can bring that game again then there’s no beating us. I don’t know that I’ve ever seen defence at such a level. We haven’t seen that yet in this series.

 

[CrazyJoeDavola]

Point taken. I can certainly agree that he was thrust into this position by bad decision making. This whole mess is clearly a failing of the organization and were it not for the mistakes of management we wouldn’t even have to be discussing this. Further to this, I’m reminded of Shawn Horcoff who took a lot of the same grief after signing a contract far in excess of what his skills warranted. Ability be damned, we expected him to play to the level of his contract when we should have been pointing the finger at management. Skinner was promoted to #1 due to necessity, not on merit, and that’s squarely on the front office.

It really is the perfect storm for disliking a player: lack of talent relative to the role, a press corps misrepresenting the reality of it, an apparent unwillingness by the player himself to be accountable (whether or not that’s his true mindset), and that little sense of panic we all feel as the window closes just a little more with each passing season. I put myself in this category.

I do feel that if there’s any team that can overcome our goaltending, it’s this year’s club. I keep thinking back to Game 5 of the LA series and I feel that if we can bring that game again then there’s no beating us. I don’t know that I’ve ever seen defence at such a level. We haven’t seen that yet in this series.

And people still want Holland back. Who's arrogance and lack of any actual pro scouting and critical thinking skills decided to give the bag to Jack Campbell, who was a sub 900 goalie for like 7 straight months prior to Jul. 1.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

Point taken. I can certainly agree that he was thrust into this position by bad decision making. This whole mess is clearly a failing of the organization and were it not for the mistakes of management we wouldn’t even have to be discussing this. Further to this, I’m reminded of Shawn Horcoff who took a lot of the same grief after signing a contract far in excess of what his skills warranted. Ability be damned, we expected him to play to the level of his contract when we should have been pointing the finger at management. Skinner was promoted to #1 due to necessity, not on merit, and that’s squarely on the front office.

It really is the perfect storm for disliking a player: lack of talent relative to the role, a press corps misrepresenting the reality of it, an apparent unwillingness by the player himself to be accountable (whether or not that’s his true mindset), and that little sense of panic we all feel as the window closes just a little more with each passing season. I put myself in this category.

I do feel that if there’s any team that can overcome our goaltending, it’s this year’s club. I keep thinking back to Game 5 of the LA series and I feel that if we can bring that game again then there’s no beating us. I don’t know that I’ve ever seen defence at such a level. We haven’t seen that yet in this series.

It's a high risk gamble at the absolute apex of this franchise's window phase after walking in the desert through more than a decade of failed rebuilds, countless coaches and many management groups. That's where I point the arrow. This current roster has one $4 million small free agent winger on the 4th line and a second small $3 million one in the press box.

I can't really draw a line to the Horcoff comparison. Different position versus last line of defense; different phases of organization with Horcoff in largely a rebuild cycle outside the Cinderella run. Add that era organization had trouble keeping talent so Horcoff overpayment stemmed some of that disadvantage. But ultimately he was miscast as a top centre when his strong utility as a hard working two-way player could not meet the salary.

Agree that Skinner is kind of a perfect storm scenario and position that is a magnet for criticism as we are all out of patience for well beyond a decade of rebuild(s) have finally payed off a team capable of competing and winning a Cup. I equate Skinner's situation as a development phase goaltender as trying to onboard a speeding bullettrain in full flight. I don't get hung up on media opinionating about Skinner (or much of anyone) as Gregor, Spector, Stauffer and the like have about as much actual playing experience as most of this board. Generally best to tune it out or take with a grain of salt. There's no winner if/when media go on a crusade against a player. There should have been a commitment to mitigate the Skinner high risk with a bonafide veteran 1A/1B running mate.

This team can beat anyone on any given day. Its challenge has been to beat elite teams over seven game series and do so by reducing/eliminating their bad decisions within the margins. Skinner was bad last night and he had a lot of team help to gift Vegas a win. Agree the LA Game 5 is the best, complete 60 minutes I've seen from this group. That's the secret sauce they need to find and execute consistently to lift the Cup. The Dynasty Teams won theirs when they learned to defend and suppress opposition scoring versus simply trying to outgun them. Game 4 is their next chance to show that maturity.

 

[MessierThanThou]

No, the reason he was in that position is because the whole team gave up with 15 seconds left. This has happened multiple times when pushing McDrai to get a win late, rather than playing it safe, playing til the clock hits 0.0 and getting to OT. Nobody on the ice in those last 15 seconds is without some blame.

Draisaitl had one of his worst games of his career, before the own goal even. He is a bigger catalyst to our teams success than Skinner. He's paid to never have these games, Skinner is paid to hopefully give us a fighting chance and he kept us in it til the end. People like to bitch that the team needs to play "perfect" to win, well ya, when you nerf your goaltending by spending so little and choose to instead invest in forwards and D, that is to be expected. Problem is, this team is playing nowhere close to perfect and frankly it's the big guys who are failing to pull their weight for long stretches of play despite getting some points. Dumb turnovers by Leon, horrid line changes, refusal for Connor to shoot for 90% of the game, those are bigger reasons we lost the game than any 1 guy on the last play.

Skinner sucks and even the players know it as some here like to say? Well why aren't they playing like they know they have to be better in front of him? Are they weak mentally too? like some accuse Skinner of, and just admitting defeat because their preferred tender isn't in net? If so, doesn't sound like a team ready for a cup imo.

I'm no Skinner defender, I wanted an upgrade at the deadline. But it's really annoying seeing everything blamed on him when the team shits the bed at glorious opportunities.

This is one of the single most profoundly idiotic things I've ever read on here. A team that just won six straight playoff games (WITHOUT Skinner) is mentally weak because they can't prevent their mentally weak goalie from allowing shots that should be routine saves to get past him?

Skinner let in two objectively bad goals earlier in the game, and you children decide to blame everything on Draisaitl for a buzzer beater where Skinner was nowhere near his net? Even if we play into your little game and blame that one on Drai, Skinner is STILL more at fault for the loss than Draisaitl since math tells me being responsible for two goals allowed is more detrimental than being responsible for one.

Yes, when players cough up the puck and allow chances against a goalie, they have most certainly f***ed up, but when the opposing player uses that opportunity to take a weak shot that a league average goalie is expected to stop and that shot becomes a goal, well...sorry, that goal is now mostly on the goalie.